AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion

[decker_cky]

I'd be shocked if Tzaangors stay the same.  They're a unit that's begging for the ardboyz and plague monks treatment to speed up the game. 

[Bufkin]

I really hope they buff flamers, flamers are awesome. 

[Carnelian]

I really hope Kairic Acolytes get buffed so that they do more than just take up space! 

[Neffelo]

On 12/22/2019 at 10:32 PM, Sinfullyvannila said:

Don’t mistake my disagreement with misunderstanding.

 

The old changes were 1 1/2 year apart, on a 1 year change cycle. The hypothetical changes will be 1-3 months apart on a 1/2 year cycle

What about the points changes from the GHB 2018 to the BoC release? For instance the Tzaangor Skyfire on Discs went up to 220 in the GHB 2018, and went down to 200 in the BOC release, which was 3 months later.  Tzaangor enlightened on disc also went down 20 points from 160 to 140. 

In this case GW  published  points for these units, then went and changed the points and the warscrolls in the subsequent release.  There is no reason to think they would not do this again with the upcoming DoT book. 

[Murder Pancake]

I desperately want to see a buff of some kind to screamers. They're my favorite model in general, and I'd like to carpet the table with them at some point. 

[5kaven5lave]

New hero, Tzaangors and a some Screamers in the new box then?

[Neffelo]

Someone in the rumor thread made a good point that neither of these forces have battleline in box, which is unusual for these. This makes me think we may get some ways to have Skyfires or Enlightened as Battleline, maybe with the new character? 

[Murder Pancake]

I think that was me. It could be a matter of just having a very niche box. None of the battleline we have can fly and doesn't fit an aerial combat theme.  But on that same vein, this is not a box that can be used outside of narrative unless they are making sweeping changes to the roster.

[Freejack02]

Didn't see this posted yet, but we have confirmation on a new boxed set with new Battletome in January:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/12/25/happy-christmas-from-warhammer-communitygw-homepage-post-1/

I'm thrilled to have new options for Tzeentch (and pretty happy that KO might finally get the rewrite they so desperately deserve)!

 

 

Edited December 25, 2019 by Freejack02

[smartazjb0y]

3 hours ago, Neffelo said:

Someone in the rumor thread made a good point that neither of these forces have battleline in box, which is unusual for these. This makes me think we may get some ways to have Skyfires or Enlightened as Battleline, maybe with the new character? 

Not a bad bet since it would make sense for the KO hero in the box to make the Endrinriggers battleline 

[Kramer]

1 hour ago, smartazjb0y said:

Not a bad bet since it would make sense for the KO hero in the box to make the Endrinriggers battleline 

Which wouldn’t make any narrative sense but I do get and agree with the argument. 

[GeneralZero]

What's about the Screamers of Tzeentch. I don't know what I'd do with them. But the rest of the box is top.

[AverageBoss]

23 hours ago, Neffelo said:

What about the points changes from the GHB 2018 to the BoC release? For instance the Tzaangor Skyfire on Discs went up to 220 in the GHB 2018, and went down to 200 in the BOC release, which was 3 months later.  Tzaangor enlightened on disc also went down 20 points from 160 to 140. 

In this case GW  published  points for these units, then went and changed the points and the warscrolls in the subsequent release.  There is no reason to think they would not do this again with the upcoming DoT book. 

The reason for this is that GW completed and sat on the GHB months before relese. It was finished before books they released before it.

[Neffelo]

21 minutes ago, AverageBoss said:

The reason for this is that GW completed and sat on the GHB months before relese. It was finished before books they released before it.

 

Do you have a source for this? Otherwise it's just conjecture. 

That being said, I do think that' s likely the case, which is more toward my point that just because they didn't make updates in the GHB does not mean there will not be updates in the upcoming tome. 

 

[AverageBoss]

3 hours ago, Neffelo said:

 

Do you have a source for this? Otherwise it's just conjecture. 

That being said, I do think that' s likely the case, which is more toward my point that just because they didn't make updates in the GHB does not mean there will not be updates in the upcoming tome. 

 

There were sources posted at the time it came out, and it was common knowledge. A video from the writers saying it was finished and ready while Gloomspite was still being pieced together, which perfectly explains all the discrepancies between it, and the books released immediately before and after it.

[Neffelo]

35 minutes ago, AverageBoss said:

There were sources posted at the time it came out, and it was common knowledge. A video from the writers saying it was finished and ready while Gloomspite was still being pieced together, which perfectly explains all the discrepancies between it, and the books released immediately before and after it.

Do you have a link to that Video or a Link to any of these sources when it came out? 

[Prometheo567]

Hi, I was gifted a Lord of Change for Xmas so I guess that's a sign of Tzeentch to finally start a DoT army. I would like to start at 1000 points. I have some minis from back on 8th edition (yeah, I need to rebase them) and I was wondering if a "mini-changehost" (I know I cannot field itr under 1000, I just mean LoC + tons of horrors and endless spells) was possible.

I was thinking on something in the lines of LoC+2-3 Pink Horror units + fill the leftover 100 points with brimstones or assorted endless spells. I have 2 questions tho.

a) Which endless spells would you use on a 100 points budget? I am hopelessly lost there

b) Would that be too fragile? Can the whole horror-multiplication compensate for that? Is my LoC going to die first turn to cannon fire?

Thank you for the advice.

[Sinfullyvannila]

45 minutes ago, Prometheo567 said:

Hi, I was gifted a Lord of Change for Xmas so I guess that's a sign of Tzeentch to finally start a DoT army. I would like to start at 1000 points. I have some minis from back on 8th edition (yeah, I need to rebase them) and I was wondering if a "mini-changehost" (I know I cannot field itr under 1000, I just mean LoC + tons of horrors and endless spells) was possible.

I was thinking on something in the lines of LoC+2-3 Pink Horror units + fill the leftover 100 points with brimstones or assorted endless spells. I have 2 questions tho.

a) Which endless spells would you use on a 100 points budget? I am hopelessly lost there

b) Would that be too fragile? Can the whole horror-multiplication compensate for that? Is my LoC going to die first turn to cannon fire?

Thank you for the advice.

I’d do 2 Pinks, LoC, Magister, Blue Horrors and Burning Head

Magister is your General with Arcane Sacrifice  so you can Arcane Sacrifice Pinks. Then run them over with your Burning Head. If you kill 4 pinks and get 2 other Fate Points you can bring in 10 more Blue Horrors on your first turn.

Take Unchecked Mutation and Bolt of Tzeentch on your Pink Horrors and then Fold Reality on your LoC. You can use your 5s from your destiny dice to roll D3 on Arcane Bolt with your LoC. If you have Chaos Spawn models(if your opponent is cool you can ask if you can proxy in some Large D&D models as they have the same base size), your Magister is probably going to be casting his spell scroll spell each turn. Unfortunately he isn’t a Daemon so he doesn’t benefit from Beacon of Sorcery.

Alternatively you can ditch the Flaming Skull to replace the Magister with the Tzaangor Shaman. He has better stats and the Daemon Keyword so he benefits from Beacon of Sorcery and can take Fold Reality and let your LoC take Tzeentch’s Inferno. You lose out on Magister’s conversion spell though(TS can only convert into lost models from A unit of Tzaangors).

Edited December 26, 2019 by Sinfullyvannila

[Prometheo567]

Interesting. What's your opinion on the Gaunt Summoner (the undisked one)? It casts 2 spells per turn, apparently, for only 20 more points and is also a daemon. Also, for suiciding pinks, aren't swords somehow better? I fell like I would need to downgrade the blues to brimstones for that.

Thank you!

[Sinfullyvannila]

16 minutes ago, Prometheo567 said:

Interesting. What's your opinion on the Gaunt Summoner (the undisked one)? It casts 2 spells per turn, apparently, for only 20 more points and is also a daemon. Also, for suiciding pinks, aren't swords somehow better? I fell like I would need to downgrade the blues to brimstones for that.

Thank you!

He’d be in there if LoC weren’t. He’s a staple at 2000 points but you aren’t going to be dealing with as many hordes at 1000 points. Also, I chose the Magister for his conversion spell. He’s got a pretty decent chance of paying for himself too.

Swords is definitely better if you don’t have an Arcanite General. I prefer Arcane Sacrifice and Burning Head because an ideal outcome for me is only losing enough models to get the blues out on the first turn, so that I can burn a one on my battleshock roll at the end of my first turn. Quicksilver is riskier, but it will work. 

Edited December 26, 2019 by Sinfullyvannila

[GeneralZero]

I know that we are waiting the new BT but, I have many tzaangors (60) and discs ones (will have more with the new dual army box...). Can a pure chicken army viable or eventually on the edge of competitiveness? (with LoC , HQ , etc..)

[Neffelo]

Does anyone think we are going to get some special bonus' to endless spells? I really like the OBR soul-linked, and I think that would be really cool. Some kind of bonus like that to all endless spells we cast would be really neat. I am hoping for a "Legion" that specializes in doing stuff with endless spells

 

[The_Dudemeister]

That would be neat. Another idea would be an Endless Spell that syphons enemy spells like the Curseling, makes that spell available for nearby wizards and changes every faction keyword into "Tzeentch".

Like when a Ghoul King casts Black Hunger and they "pick 1 friendly Flesh-eater Courts unit wholly within 24"... add 1 to the Attacks characteristics". So when the Endless Spell unbinds that, a Tzeentch wizard can immediately cast it himself and it would read "pick 1 friendly Tzeentch unit..."

[LordPrometheus]

I just traded for a Tzeentch army a day before the new tome was announced, so I'm stoked! I'm expecting Endless Spells and hopefully a lot of fun magic shenannigans.

I do have a question. Is it worth getting some Chaos Knights for this army, or any other StD units? They seem pretty good.

Edited December 26, 2019 by LordPrometheus

[Sinfullyvannila]

9 minutes ago, LordPrometheus said:

I just traded for a Tzeentch army a day before the new tome was announced, so I'm stoked! I'm expecting Endless Spells and hopefully a lot of fun magic shenannigans.

I do have a question. Is it worth getting some Chaos Knights for this army, or any other StD units? They seem pretty good.

You’re better off with Tzaangor Enlightened over Knights. Knights need a warshrine buff or the Chaos Sorcerer Lord buff to be worthwhile.

Gaunt Summoner on Disc is going to be a staple from now on I’m sure; since you don’t need a terrain piece to summon the pinks with him anymore so he’s basically 80 points for a 2 cast with a decent spell(his pinks don’t count as battleline though). They may be changing the foot model to do the same.

Chaos Sorcerer Lord on Manticore should math put to being a stronger horde clearing spell than Summoner on foot but is pretty pricy.