AoS 2 - Disciples of Tzeentch Discussion

[Lughaidh]

My local group usually plays either 1250 or 2000.  How does this look for a 1160/1250 list?  Yes, I also have the required Blue & Brimstone Horrors for summoning.

[newsun]

22 hours ago, Lughaidh said:

My local group usually plays either 1250 or 2000.  How does this look for a 1160/1250 list?  Yes, I also have the required Blue & Brimstone Horrors for summoning.

I think it's better to have 6 enlightened than the battalion and myself I'd go for 15 chaos warriors instead of the Tzaangors and make it 9 enlightened.

[mmimzie]

2 hours ago, newsun said:

I think it's better to have 6 enlightened than the battalion and myself I'd go for 15 chaos warriors instead of the Tzaangors and make it 9 enlightened.

this

[MrRoff]

Ok, quick question. 

Can wizards cast arcane bolt without a target just to rank up easy faith points? 

Like if you have +10 spells a turn, and turn 1 you're to far away from the enemy, could just cast all arcane bolt without a target to get the spell successfully cast, to get free fp?

Seems fishy to me

Met a tzeentch player that did that in a noob in house "tournament" last week 

 

EDIT: Ment Fate points, not faith. 

Edited January 13, 2019 by MrRoff

[Lughaidh]

3 hours ago, newsun said:

I think it's better to have 6 enlightened than the battalion and myself I'd go for 15 chaos warriors instead of the Tzaangors and make it 9 enlightened.

Guy I bought the models from only had 3 Enlightened

If I like the army I might invest in more Enlightened. I just was gifted 40+ Chaos Warriors and 5 Chaos Chosen. As well as a Curseling and a Fatemaster. Should I try to work any of these in? I might actually be able to reach close to 2000 now. 

[obmik1]

7 minutes ago, MrRoff said:

Ok, quick question. 

Can wizards cast arcane bolt without a target just to rank up easy faith points? 

Like if you have +10 spells a turn, and turn 1 you're to far away from the enemy, could just cast all arcane bolt without a target to get the spell successfully cast, to get free fp?

Seems fishy to me

Met a tzeentch player that did that in a noob in house "tournament" last week 

Pretty sure this is legit, the rules for spells state if successfully cast then pick a target in range. So you cast before measuring. 

[MrRoff]

7 minutes ago, obmik1 said:

Pretty sure this is legit, the rules for spells state if successfully cast then pick a target in range. So you cast before measuring. 

Not really my question. 

If he knows for sure that I'm 45+" away, but he just wants free faith points, can he just cast the spell without a target? And still get fp even when the spell dosent have a target. 

Because it's successfully cast before you choose a target. 

 

 

EDIT: ment Fate points. Not faith. 

Edited January 13, 2019 by MrRoff

[obmik1]

4 minutes ago, MrRoff said:

Not really my question. 

If he knows for sure that I'm 45+" away, but he just wants free faith points, can he just cast the spell without a target? And still get fp even when the spell dosent have a target. 

Because it's successfully cast before you choose a target. 

Yes, I believe so. You successfully cast a spell before choosing targets. If you successfully cast a spell you gain fate points. 

[Calypso2ts]

18 minutes ago, obmik1 said:

Yes, I believe so. You successfully cast a spell before choosing targets. If you successfully cast a spell you gain fate points. 

Yes you can cast and then if theres no target in range, nothing happens  it cannot be arcane bolt for them all afaik, it must be different spells.

[mmimzie]

27 minutes ago, MrRoff said:

Not really my question. 

If he knows for sure that I'm 45+" away, but he just wants free faith points, can he just cast the spell without a target? And still get fp even when the spell dosent have a target. 

yes you can

[obmik1]

Question. Does a unit 'wiped out' count as slain for the purpose of fate points. Ergo rolling a 1 with fold reality on a unit of pink horrors to generate blue horror points? 

Thanks, 

[obmik1]

Also, can anyone she'd some light on tzeentch rerolls vs bloodsevrators? Do I have to reroll all successful casting rolls even if I've already rerolled it?

[Lughaidh]

12 hours ago, newsun said:

I think it's better to have 6 enlightened than the battalion and myself I'd go for 15 chaos warriors instead of the Tzaangors and make it 9 enlightened.

Shouldn't I have at least some Tzaangors so I can use the Tzaangor Shaman's spell  to add more models to the unit?

[Asore23]

Hi guys! I'm runnibg around in this forum bothering people with questions while i figure out (or try to) which army i want to play.

Do you have any suggestions about tzeentch? I love the models but i heard the struggle i bit now. 

 

My main problem is that i don't have that big of a budget to spend, is tzeentch expensive? All those possible evocation leave me a bit dubious.

Thanks guys!

[mmimzie]

6 hours ago, obmik1 said:

Also, can anyone she'd some light on tzeentch rerolls vs bloodsevrators? Do I have to reroll all successful casting rolls even if I've already rerolled it?

Yeah you get the fate points.

 

6 hours ago, obmik1 said:

Also, can anyone she'd some light on tzeentch rerolls vs bloodsevrators? Do I have to reroll all successful casting rolls even if I've already rerolled it?

You can't reroll a die more than once for any reason.

 

3 hours ago, Lughaidh said:

Shouldn't I have at least some Tzaangors so I can use the Tzaangor Shaman's spell  to add more models to the unit?

Nah you dont need tzaangors. Probably won't even use his spell.

 

3 hours ago, Asore23 said:

Hi guys! I'm runnibg around in this forum bothering people with questions while i figure out (or try to) which army i want to play.

Do you have any suggestions about tzeentch? I love the models but i heard the struggle i bit now. 

 

My main problem is that i don't have that big of a budget to spend, is tzeentch expensive? All those possible evocation leave me a bit dubious.

Thanks guys!

Tzeentch isn't the cheapest option due to summoning. Means you need to have another 50% army ready and waiting. 

[obmik1]

6 minutes ago, mmimzie said:

Yeah you get the fate points.

 

You can't reroll a die more than once for any reason.

Thanks for your reply.

 

So my friends are referencing warscroll over rides core rules.  And saying that the fact loathsome sorcerery says 'must reroll' successful casting rolls means that if I reroll into a successful casting roll I still have to reroll, in spite of the reroll rules. I disagree But without a ruling it's hard to convince them,I have emailed the faq team. 

What happens if I uses wellspring of arcane might? I successfully cast a spell with a 6 and a 1. Loathsome sorcerery says reroll. But I can reroll the 1 first meaning I don't have to reroll a reroll? 

 

Also, any chance you can point me in the direction of the fate point ruling on the roll of a 1 for fold reality? Does it specifically say count as slain somewhere?

Edited January 13, 2019 by obmik1

[mmimzie]

20 minutes ago, obmik1 said:

saying that the fact loathsome sorcerery says 'must reroll' successful casting 

If this were the case when would you stop rerolling. There is no FAQ need warscrolls only override when they directly contradict the rules and explicitly state as much. As you be compelled to infinity reroll your successes until you fail. In which case it should just make you fail. 

 

20 minutes ago, obmik1 said:

Also, any chance you can point me in the direction of the fate point ruling on the roll of a 1 for fold reality? Does it specifically say count as slain somewhere?

I'll put it this way. I play in tournament and have had no such issues with them having been slain. As otherwise the unit was never destroyed as per the FAQ. Meaning your opponent can't claim victory pts on the unit, and you can never be tabled. As destoryed units is described as all models being slain/fleeing. So *shrug*

 

Heck for some missions like artifacts you could count and still controling yhe objective with your not destroyed unit???

Edited January 13, 2019 by mmimzie

[Grotruk]

Hey guys !

 

What do you think about this like "a base" for 2000 pts ?

 

Allegiance: Chaos

Leaders
Ogroid Thaumaturge (180)
- Lore of Fate: Glimpse the Future
The Blue Scribes (140)
- Lore of Change: Fold Reality
Kairos Fateweaver (380)
- Lore of Change: Tzeentch's Firestorm
Gaunt Summoner and Chaos Familiars (180)
- General
- Trait: Arcane Sacrifice
- Lore of Change: Bolt of Tzeentch

Battleline
10 x Pink Horrors of Tzeentch (200)
- Lore of Change: Unchecked Mutation

Units
9 x Tzaangor Enlightened on Disc (420)

Endless Spells
Chronomantic Cogs (60)
Quicksilver Swords (20)

Total: 1580 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 8
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 78
 

I thought kairos was good to cast the ogroid spell (wich has around 50% chance to fail if he casts himself)

So you have 2 spells (kairos and ogroid) to generate annoying bodies.

I'm still wondering how to finish this list (2 lines are needed and an artefact is still available: maybe wellspring of arcane might could "replace" the blue scribes)

 

 

What are your feelings about this ? Good evening !

[Kharneth]

Just to clarify, Pink and Blue Horrors do not generate points when they flee because fleeing is not the same as being slain, right?

In regards to Fold Reality, the spells specifically says if you roll a 1 than every model in the unit is slain. You get 2 blue horror points for every remaining Pink Horror in a unit that rolled a 1 with Fold Reality.

[mmimzie]

35 minutes ago, Kharneth said:

Just to clarify, Pink and Blue Horrors do not generate points when they flee because fleeing is not the same as being slain, right?

In regards to Fold Reality, the spells specifically says if you roll a 1 than every model in the unit is slain. You get 2 blue horror points for every remaining Pink Horror in a unit that rolled a 1 with Fold Reality.

It is the same as slain as per the rules for battleshock

 

[Kharneth]

Oh good to know. 

[Drib]

12 hours ago, Kharneth said:

Just to clarify, Pink and Blue Horrors do not generate points when they flee because fleeing is not the same as being slain, right?

In regards to Fold Reality, the spells specifically says if you roll a 1 than every model in the unit is slain. You get 2 blue horror points for every remaining Pink Horror in a unit that rolled a 1 with Fold Reality.

"[...] On a roll of 1, the unit is wiped out!" -Battletome p.83

It does not specifically say that ever model is slain.

[Kharneth]

1 hour ago, Drib said:

"[...] On a roll of 1, the unit is wiped out!" -Battletome p.83

It does not specifically say that ever model is slain.

That's what wiped out means. 

In order for them to mean anything else they'd have to specify like "the unit is removed from the table but does not count as destroyed." Given the idea of what Fold Reality is doing, it's possible the unit is not destroyed but simply is relocated but the wording of the rules makes it clear that the models in the unit die and aren't merely relocated. 

Edited January 14, 2019 by Kharneth

[obmik1]

20 minutes ago, Kharneth said:

That's what wiped out means. 

In order for them to mean anything else they'd have to specify like "the unit is removed from the table but does not count as destroyed." Given the idea of what Fold Reality is doing, it's possible the unit is not destroyed but simply is relocated but the wording of the rules makes it clear that the models in the unit die and aren't merely relocated. 

 

While I agree that is probably the intention, it would be nice for this to be put in the designers commentary or something just so that it is explained and there's no confusion . Why would they not just write, the unit is slain.... 

[newsun]

1 hour ago, Drib said:

"[...] On a roll of 1, the unit is wiped out!" -Battletome p.83

It does not specifically say that ever model is slain.

Do you see where "wiped out" is specifically explained?