AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

[Masake]

16 minutes ago, j0lt said:

To someone returning to the Hobby and having severe "Armyitis" FEC are quite good for the fact you don't need to jump through hoops to get an army.

Now how many start collecting boxes do I buy 😂

2xStart Collecting + 1xCarrion Empire is a great and solid start! hahahahahaha

Edited May 13, 2019 by Masake

[kenshin620]

Interesting that FEC is one of the "mercenaries" specifically pointed out for Forbidden Power.

If you can still summon I think a Archregeant would be a good magic option for non-death armies as he also packs in extra goons, unless they do something extra in terms of bringing them (like require a "50-100" point tax for mercs or something, or remove summoning)

[amysrevenge]

43 minutes ago, kenshin620 said:

Interesting that FEC is one of the "mercenaries" specifically pointed out for Forbidden Power.

If you can still summon I think a Archregeant would be a good magic option for non-death armies as he also packs in extra goons, unless they do something extra in terms of bringing them (like require a "50-100" point tax for mercs or something, or remove summoning)

I would wager instead that the restriction would be "you can add the following exact lineup of models/units for exactly XX points" and they could then control what you can bring very closely. 

 

But that's just a guess.

[kenshin620]

21 minutes ago, amysrevenge said:

I would wager instead that the restriction would be "you can add the following exact lineup of models/units for exactly XX points" and they could then control what you can bring very closely. 

 

But that's just a guess.

The only problem with that is that it's pretty easy to go over the ally limit. Heck they already talked about bringing Magadroths which eat more than 200pts already!

Unless mercenaries follow a different set of point allocations, which would seem even weirder.

 

Regardless I'm interested to see what FEC can bring to other armies even if they lose out on the spell lore, feeding frenzy, and deathless courtiers.

[Honk]

4 hours ago, kenshin620 said:

Regardless I'm interested to see what FEC can bring to other armies

An Archregent always comes free of charge, just gotta pay his 20 ghouls 😅 he‘s gonna be arch-mercenary pretty soo.

All the BCR and KO should need one, and then think about the fluff implications

🥳 FOR THE LADY🥳

Maybe they’re trying to make GAs great again, with some 40k battalion-detachment-however rules, or like @amysrevenge said, define model compositions, they’ll maybe throw out dedicated 400 point boxes of „brigand bands“ hopefully with cool rules

[Gwendar]

One question on the Courtiers: "Slain models can be returned to more than one unit, but each successful dice roll can only be used to return a model to a single unit"

I think I already know the answer, but want to be sure.. so am I interpreting this correctly to be: "Roll 6 dice for 1 unit, or roll 6 dice and for every 2+ (or 5+) you can return only 1 model to multiple units in range"?

I see this useful for Flayers\Horrors more than Ghouls obviously, so that would be helpful if my 1 Varghulf could get extra value for having multiple flayer units in range.

[XReN]

27 minutes ago, Gwendar said:

One question on the Courtiers: "Slain models can be returned to more than one unit, but each successful dice roll can only be used to return a model to a single unit"

I think I already know the answer, but want to be sure.. so am I interpreting this correctly to be: "Roll 6 dice for 1 unit, or roll 6 dice and for every 2+ (or 5+) you can return only 1 model to multiple units in range"?

I see this useful for Flayers\Horrors more than Ghouls obviously, so that would be helpful if my 1 Varghulf could get extra value for having multiple flayer units in range.

Yes, you can split your mustering on multiple units

[18121812]

@Gwendar I'll use an example to explain. 

Let's say there's 3 valid units in range of your courtier's ability, and you roll 3 successful 5+.

You can return one model to each, two models to one unit and one model to one unit while the third unit gets none, or three models to one unit. 

You do NOT return three models to all 3 units.

[Honk]

3 hours ago, Gwendar said:

but each successful dice roll can only be used to return a model to a single unit"

I play it differently than the regeneration in a LoN army. There I DIVIDE my dice from one deathly invocation instance unto different units FIRST, then I roll and am stuck with the result... then I choose the next DI instance.

With FEC, I ROLL my dice FIRST, then I distribute the results to the units how I see fit. That is especially a big difference, when you have knights and serfs in range for the muster. Of course one dice can only effect one unit...

[Gwendar]

2 hours ago, 18121812 said:

You do NOT return three models to all 3 units.

Right, that I knew. Good to know you can allocate the 6 dice between the units... I just assumed it was no more than 1 model per different unit despite how many 5+'s you rolled. Thanks!

35 minutes ago, Honk said:

With FEC, I ROLL my dice FIRST, then I distribute the results to the units how I see fit. That is especially a big difference, when you have knights and serfs in range for the muster. Of course one dice can only effect one unit...

I think I've been reading it more along the lines of "Pick a unit and roll 6" rather than "Roll 6 then allocate". The last bit of the Muster wording just threw off a bit. I appreciate you all clearing it up... that really helps my Flayer\Horror heavy list decisions to not include extra Courtiers.

 

Another thing as I've seen some conflicting things on: Savage Strike - If it's MY combat phase he attacks first, then I can FF and go again.. and then I pick one of my own units to go (essentially getting in 3-4 attacks before they go to) or does my opponent choose after the Savage Strike goes? Again.. this combat activation thing is newer to me since I mostly play magic\shooting based things where I don't need to worry about that.

I just assumed since it "gets to fight first" that still counts as my first activation and therefore they get the next one. At the same time, it specifically states "before players pick any units" which leads me to think I can go with another unit right after. Just want to get all this cleared up before anyone complains since I'm the only one playing FeC around here.

[Masake]

1 hour ago, Gwendar said:

Right, that I knew. Good to know you can allocate the 6 dice between the units... I just assumed it was no more than 1 model per different unit despite how many 5+'s you rolled. Thanks!

I think I've been reading it more along the lines of "Pick a unit and roll 6" rather than "Roll 6 then allocate". The last bit of the Muster wording just threw off a bit. I appreciate you all clearing it up... that really helps my Flayer\Horror heavy list decisions to not include extra Courtiers.

 

Another thing as I've seen some conflicting things on: Savage Strike - If it's MY combat phase he attacks first, then I can FF and go again.. and then I pick one of my own units to go (essentially getting in 3-4 attacks before they go to) or does my opponent choose after the Savage Strike goes? Again.. this combat activation thing is newer to me since I mostly play magic\shooting based things where I don't need to worry about that.

I just assumed since it "gets to fight first" that still counts as my first activation and therefore they get the next one. At the same time, it specifically states "before players pick any units" which leads me to think I can go with another unit right after. Just want to get all this cleared up before anyone complains since I'm the only one playing FeC around here.

You do not "get to attack first" - you attack in some sort of weird pre phase. Somewhere between the end of CHARGE PHASE and real COMBAT PHASE!

That way, when the real combat phase begins, if it is your turn - you are allowed to choose an unit to attack!

The difference is that this unit still counts as it got to fight in the COMBAT PHASE, so you are not allowed to choose it again.

[18121812]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/03/21/who-fights-first/

If you have a unit that gets to fight at the "start of the phase" and your opponent does not, you will get to fight twice before your opponent fights once, before we take any other special rules into account. Once with the "start of the phase" unit, and then your choice of regular units.

If your opponent also has a "start of the phase" unit, say Fanatics, then it would go your "start" unit, then the Fanatics, then one of your regular units.

Feeding Frenzy can be activated as normal, so if you had the command points, and your opponent does not have any "start of the phase" units, you could fight 4 times before they go once.

[Gwendar]

5 minutes ago, 18121812 said:

If your opponent also has a "start of the phase" unit, say Fanatics, then it would go your "start" unit, then the Fanatics, then one of your regular units.

Right, I remember reading that article and exclusively remembering that if both players have this type of they, essentially, cancel each other out\dependent on which players turn it is. Thanks for the clarification.

So far, not too many armies around here where that is the case, but I see combat phase shenanigans becoming more prevalent in general. Only a matter of time. 

...man, I think even once I explain this to people before the match begins, they won't be too happy about it. It's a semi-competitive environment around here, but I sometimes feel like apologizing after wiping units since I got into FeC before the update (just never had time to play them until recently) but the power level feels so radically different than other things. I guess the stats prove that.

[Masake]

So guys - after many list building, lots of training and learning - I'm going to my first tournament with FEC!

It will be some sort of HOUSE RULE about list building. Something between Vanguard and Battlehost (1500pts / 3+ Battleline / 1-5 Leaders / 0-3 Artillery and Behemoth / 300pts Allies).

Planning on the following list and I'd like to hear your opinions:
Allegiance: Flesh Eater Courts
- Court: Delusion / Feast Day
Mortal Realm: Ghur

Leaders
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Terrorgheist (400)
- Artefact: Gryph-feather Charm
- Lore of Madness: Miasmal Shroud
- Mount Trait: Gruesome Bite
Abhorrant Archregent (200)
- Artefact: The Dermal Robe 
- Lore of Madness: Blood Feast
Crypt Infernal Courtier (120)
- General
- Trait: Dark Acolyte
- Lore of Madness: Deranged Transformation

Battleline
3 x Flayer (170)
3 x Flayer (170)
3 x Flayer (170)

Battalions
Deadwatch (110)

Endless Spells
Chalice of Ushoran (40)
Chronomatic Cogs (60)

Summon
3 x Flayer 
20 x Ghouls 

Total: 1440 / 1500
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 300
Wounds: 63

Summary
- Tried Blisterskin and Delusion Feast Day. The 10CPs plus the freely Artefact choosing and being able to have another Wiz with Dark Acolyte is to much for me in comparison with what Blister give me.
- I'd love to have more models in my Flayer unit. Having only 3 models is hard to capitalize those buffs and survive in order to being able to use Mustering abilities. But points don't let me get more, and I cannot see taking off the BATTALION and loosing the extra Artefact, extra CP (so its cost only 60pts for me) and the fewer Drops (it is a 3 Drop list).
- GKoTG Ethereal Amulet vs Gryph-feather Charm: Tried both, still not sure if GFC is the best option but the extra 1" move won me a couple of games.
- Archregent with Dermal Robe: Well, what else can I say - giving +1 cast to cast so I can get D3 Attacks and Cogs much easier is awesome.
- Chalice + Ghouls will be my Objective holder and some sort of TARPIT if need. That way I won't need some COURTIER for them.

[18121812]

They don't quite cancel out. It's true that if you've got one unit that fights first and he's got one, you end up alternating like normal. 

Where it gets weird is when someone has multiple 'start of the phase' abilities. You resolve *all* of your start of the phase abilities, then your opponent gets his.

The place you'll see this most often is Idoneth. Their tide lets their entire army fight first. In the Idoneth players turn, that means his entire army would fight before your guy who fights first. 

[Honk]

37 minutes ago, Gwendar said:

man, I think even once I explain this to people before the match begins,

Search for the faq and the errata that explains how the „first strike“ rule works. Needless discussions and salt are the alternative. But the „at the start of“ rule is widely spread and gets more common with each book. imo some Khorne artifact, gobbo fanatics and fyreslayer command ability. Don’t really know about idoleth, but the ruling was clarified....

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/03/21/who-fights-first/

[Gwendar]

42 minutes ago, Honk said:

Needless discussions and salt are the alternative.

I always let my opponents know how my armies work beforehand so there aren't any surprises, but that's largely due to our community mix of casual and some competitive players. Either way, people kind of know what FeC are capable of and are often demoralized to play against them right from the get-go.

All in all, I think I'm more or less talking about a few specific local players who are the type of people that get annoyed when one of their units dies (I can't tell you how many times I've explained how the Warp-Lightning Cannon works to have it called "BS" when it 1-shots a hero because they didn't pre-measure ranges\hide it) but will cheer if one of mine dies, no matter which army I play... but hey, they'll just blame it on FeC as a whole rather than work on what they could've done. To be honest, I kind of enjoy playing against people like that since most others wont.

Anyway, I appreciate everyone's advice here. I'm playing 1-3 games Friday depending on turnout and another on Saturday at 750. Probably going to stick with the below and I can have a GKoTG next week at 1k. Considered dropping the Chalice for the extra but unsure. Considering what I have painted, 3 Flayers and a Varghulf will be what gets summoned in most likely.

Spoiler

Allegiance: Flesh Eater Courts
- Grand Court: Morgaunt
Abhorrant Archregent (200)
- General
- Trait: Savage Chivalry 
- Artefact: Decrepit Coronet 
- Lore of Madness: Spectral Host
Abhorrant Archregent (200)
- Lore of Madness: Miasmal Shroud
20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)
10 x Crypt Ghouls (100)
Chalice of Ushoran (40)

Total: 740 / 750

 

[Sometimes]

Hey guys! I have literally no expirience in warhammer or age of sigmar. After checking the factions and the tournament resoults I kinda decided on FEC.

I don't have any idea on how the game works but me and my friend are trying to join the local scene. I do play lots of TCG(MTG mostly) and I usually try to get the strongest competitive list (just the way I am x.x ) and play to win. The issue is that information on AoS and FEC is fairly limited and I can't even find the latest tournament lists. Therefore I can't tell much of the difference in the list since I can't test them IRL or get info on them to know how much credibiliaty they hold.

And I can't really afford to pay 200+€ to buy a list that might not work or be subpar just to play test /learn. I am willing to add extra units and change as I see fit or when they add new patch(?) ~ But not from the get go.

I found this list : 

 1. Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Terrorgheist (400 pts) 

General Command Trait: Savage Strike

Artefact: Ghurish Mawshard

 Mount Trait: Gruesome Bite

Lore of Madness: Spectral Host Abhorrant

2. Ghoul King on Royal Terrorgheist (400 pts)

Lore of Madness: Spectral Host

3. Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Zombie Dragon (440 pts)

Lore of Madness: Spectral Host

4. Abhorrant Archregent (200 pts)

Lore of Madness: Spectral Host Units

5. 10 x Crypt Ghouls (100 pts)

6. 10 x Crypt Ghouls (100 pts)

7. 10 x Crypt Ghouls (100 pts)

8. Endless Spells Chronomantic Cogs (60)
(1800/2000 ?) <-(no idea why it isnt 2k/2k)

Any ideas/tips/comments/help would and will be much appreciated.

[XReN]

7 hours ago, Sometimes said:

I don't have any idea on how the game works but me and my friend are trying to join the local scene. I do play lots of TCG(MTG mostly) and I usually try to get the strongest competitive list (just the way I am x.x ) and play to win. The issue is that information on AoS and FEC is fairly limited and I can't even find the latest tournament lists. Therefore I can't tell much of the difference in the list since I can't test them IRL or get info on them to know how much credibiliaty they hold.

And I can't really afford to pay 200+€ to buy a list that might not work or be subpar just to play test /learn. I am willing to add extra units and change as I see fit or when they add new patch(?) ~ But not from the get go.

If you are looking for super strong list - hold your horses, General's Handbook 2019 is upon us and it may come with big changes.

For starting FEC army you can't go wrong with a Start Collecting box or 2 and a FEC half from Carrion Empire box (You have to have archregent) 
The list you found is short of 200 points because FEC need Command Points really bad to be really good. It's a resource that allows us to use our core abilities, you get 1 each turn and 1 for each 50 points you have not spent on your list (also 1 per each battalion, but this is not the case with that list)

And welcome to the court!

[GeneralZero]

Why you guys are giving advice with Carrion Empire box? This dual army box is long gone. Not available anymore. The best you can do is praying to find some arch regent on ebay or second hand one. I know that this box was super good (got 2 myself), but it is a bit misleading to speak about it to a beginner or at least, tell them how to find it (the super priority being the arch regent).

[Gwendar]

14 minutes ago, GeneralZero said:

Why you guys are giving advice with Carrion Empire box? This dual army box is long gone. Not available anymore. The best you can do is praying to find some arch regent on ebay or second hand one. I know that this box was super good (got 2 myself), but it is a bit misleading to speak about it to a beginner or at least, tell them how to find it (the super priority being the arch regent).

It may be long gone online but it's clearly still worth mentioning if they can find one. If you don't at least mention it, they could walk into their FLGS or local GW that have one still available and not know that it would be a good choice.

Hell, I have 2 FLGS around here that still have 1 box of Empire and a Looncurse since a large portion of my community is 40k and don't care about the AoS boxes.

[XReN]

35 minutes ago, GeneralZero said:

This dual army box is long gone. Not available anymore.

I can walk to a local retailer and grab one of the shelf, so, it depends on where this person lives

Edited May 16, 2019 by XReN

[exliontamer]

Has anyone tried playing a 4 archregent 4 terrorgheist Gristlegore list? I feel like crapping out 800 pts of ghouls for free turn 1 seems good...but I am not sure if giving up the utility of certain delusions or battalions is worth it...

[Rikk1980]

1 hour ago, Gwendar said:

It may be long gone online but it's clearly still worth mentioning if they can find one. If you don't at least mention it, they could walk into their FLGS or local GW that have one still available and not know that it would be a good choice.

Hell, I have 2 FLGS around here that still have 1 box of Empire and a Looncurse since a large portion of my community is 40k and don't care about the AoS boxes.

 

55 minutes ago, XReN said:

I can walk to a local retailer and grab one of the shelf, so, it depends on where this person lives

Please someone tell me where.....

I'm scrounging everywhere for this set

Rik

[XReN]

1 minute ago, Rikk1980 said:

 

Please someone tell me where.....

I'm scrounging everywhere for this set

Rik

It's a shop in Russia, might not be easy to buy from there