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AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

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50 minutes ago, Michealmas said:

Any tips?

Your list isn't very well structured, in that you've kind of just taken a random bunch of things.

You haven't mentioned  what spells you're taking, nor the mount trait for the Ghoul King on Terrorgheist.

I would recommend Feast Day with Ghoul Patrol with 2 x Ghoul King on Terrorgheist, Archregent, Crypt Ghast Courtier, 40/10/10 Ghouls and Chalice as a relatively simple and balanced starting list for FEC. You get a big block of ghouls which can be surprising punchy, and two huge threats with the Terrogheists. Make the Archregent your general and stick the casting trait and artefact for a reliable caster. Feast day means you can do all of your summoning without worrying about CP for Feeding Frenzy, or clutch battleshock immunity/charge reroll.

 

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5 minutes ago, Liquidsteel said:

No I haven't actually, though I do have one painted as I was using it in my Feast Day/Ghoul Patrol list for that +3/+2 Archregent and helping the two Terrorgheists get off their spells at +1.

Adding it would push the list to 5 drops, and I'm not sure how I feel about that. Most lists that go for low drop are 3 or less, so going from 4 to 5 doesn't make a huge difference I suppose.

FEC are still super CP hungry even with Hellish Orator as Blisterskin, and I daresay I'd prefer the safety net of an extra CP than +1 to cast, though it does offer an extra model to cap a home objective.

Nice feedback, thanks a lot mate!

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3 minutes ago, Liquidsteel said:

Your list isn't very well structured, in that you've kind of just taken a random bunch of things.

You haven't mentioned  what spells you're taking, nor the mount trait for the Ghoul King on Terrorgheist.

I would recommend Feast Day with Ghoul Patrol with 2 x Ghoul King on Terrorgheist, Archregent, Crypt Ghast Courtier, 40/10/10 Ghouls and Chalice as a relatively simple and balanced starting list for FEC. You get a big block of ghouls which can be surprising punchy, and two huge threats with the Terrogheists. Make the Archregent your general and stick the casting trait and artefact for a reliable caster. Feast day means you can do all of your summoning without worrying about CP for Feeding Frenzy, or clutch battleshock immunity/charge reroll.

 

The list is Feast Day,  but it started off as Blisterskin - my escelation league has some very strict rules for army construction (cant remove units between brackets except 1x unit at 1500, cant change spells/artefacts/CA/allegiances between games, no Anvil heroes, only one allegiance/army change each - yes its stupid, no i cant do anything about it) so the army has slowly changed away from Blisterskin throughout brackets as i learned the game and realised i really didn't enjoy being pigeon holed into one unit.

I cant actually take anything else out and what has been added has got to go in to meet point requirements per league bracket (500,750,1000,1250,1500,2000).  We are currently 2 games away from finishing the 1250 bracket (which is the same list but i have used my unit drop to remove x6 Horrors @ 1500 to add the AGK, AA, Berzerker) so i have two brackets left to play and the final bracket is worth double points.

The GKoTG has Gruesome Bite as a mount trait and as for spells, the list has a lot of access to magic due to running 4 wizards - Blood Feast (GKOTG), Spectral Host (Courtier), Derranged Transformation + Miasmal Shroud (AA), Monsterous Vigour (AGK).

Obviously it changes based on Battleplan and opponent but usual strategy in a vacuum would be to Buff as much as i can get off,  Flayers and Courtier attacks one flank, Terrorgheist attacks the other, use the AA to summon a Varghulf wherever he is needed on the table and then AA goes to support Terrorgheist. The 10 ghouls hold an objective on my side, AGK summons 10 more ghouls to reinforce them and then helps Flayers. GKoTG summons an additional 3 Flayers and then goes to attack a weak spot. Berzerker just goes wherever some extra killing power is needed.

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Ah yeah okay I understand now.

Do you have an example of the list you are planning for 2000 points?

Deadwatch is an option (never played it myself), as is Royal Mordants (stick the 6 horrors back in).

Are you allowed to merge the 6 flayers in to one unit?

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16 minutes ago, Liquidsteel said:

Ah yeah okay I understand now.

Do you have an example of the list you are planning for 2000 points?

Deadwatch is an option (never played it myself), as is Royal Mordants (stick the 6 horrors back in).

Are you allowed to merge the 6 flayers in to one unit?

Toying adding either of these at the moment but honestly don't know what's a good way to go with the armies I have to play against. I really struggle to deal with saves, theirs are too high or mine are too low:

- GKoZD (because once the Terrorgheist dies i cant seem to kill anything)
- 50 ghouls and a chalice (so i have a pile of bodies to throw around)
- Deadwatch/6x Flayers/Chalice (for the extra artefact/CA)
- Gatebreaker Gargant (because flavour and i want a zombie giant to stomp things with)

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Basically your options are awkward (as I'm sure you know) because you have redundant parts of the list regardless of how you change it.

I would get a second Ghoul King on Terrorgheist, because after this escalation is done you will want to run two of them at some point. Buff them with the extra attacks and hope for 6's for those MW's.

Once the league is done you can write and take more cohesive lists.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Liquidsteel said:

Basically your options are awkward (as I'm sure you know) because you have redundant parts of the list regardless of how you change it.

I would get a second Ghoul King on Terrorgheist, because after this escalation is done you will want to run two of them at some point. Buff them with the extra attacks and hope for 6's for those MW's.

Once the league is done you can write and take more cohesive lists.

 

 

My first instinct was to take the GKoZD (or the new gatecrasher gargant for flavour) so I have another big threat on the table to divide focus away from the TG and just go full on shock n awe but i can't help but wonder if having a big brick of ghouls to tarpit half the table is a better strategy. From a competitive standpoint am I better off trying to kill my opponent or trying to make it so they can't kill me?

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As FEC my understanding is that you build to kill the opponent and/or pin him in his deployment whilst you win the game over the first 3 turns. That way if you don't kill them they only have 2 rounds to score and can't catch you up.

 

Theres no reason you can't have two terrorgheists (or a TG and a ZD) alongside a block of 40. In your current list you have points tied up in units that you don't want (2x3 flayers, foot King, crypt infernal) but you can ditch them going forward if you plan to stick with the army.

 

I have 3 lists I'm experimenting with, all slightly different and its a blast.

 

 

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28 minutes ago, Liquidsteel said:

As FEC my understanding is that you build to kill the opponent and/or pin him in his deployment whilst you win the game over the first 3 turns. That way if you don't kill them they only have 2 rounds to score and can't catch you up.

 

Theres no reason you can't have two terrorgheists (or a TG and a ZD) alongside a block of 40. In your current list you have points tied up in units that you don't want (2x3 flayers, foot King, crypt infernal) but you can ditch them going forward if you plan to stick with the army.

 

I have 3 lists I'm experimenting with, all slightly different and its a blast.

 

 

I haven't yet entered into the 1500 bracket, there's a couple of games left so it's not completely set in stone. I could drop any 1 unit from my current and add units up to 1500. The AGK, AA and Berserker were just my current selection for it.

Current army is:

1x GKoTG

1x Internal Courtier (General to make Flayers battleline)

1x10 Ghouls

2x3 Flayers

1x6 Horrors

Battleline requirement is 3@1500 and 4@2000

Edited by Michealmas

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4 battle line at 2000? Interesting... why have they decided that? 

I would drop the horrors and go deadwatch with the below maybe? Any chance you can go back to Blisterskin?

 

 

TGA.PDF

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4 minutes ago, Liquidsteel said:

4 battle line at 2000? Interesting... why have they decided that? 

I would drop the horrors and go deadwatch with the below maybe? Any chance you can go back to Blisterskin?

 

 

TGA.PDF 554.95 kB · 0 downloads

No idea, guess it just stops people taking too many monsters. Could probably go back to Blisterkin but honestly I much prefer the way Feast Day plays. That being said, taking a block of 9 flayers could be interesting...I'll try to test your suggestion out.

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Both would probably work.

Blisterskin gives you that crazy speed and allows you to relocate flying units for a CP. Vs shooting armies or those with threat of double turn you can null deploy at the board edge then reposition as needed.

Feast day gives you freedom on the traits and artefacts and also up to 10 CP a game.

Try both! 

Also look at two varghulfs, and 20 more ghouls for summoning. With 2 varghulfs you can bring the 9 flayers back to full time and time again.

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On 9/27/2020 at 1:14 PM, Liquidsteel said:

Overall I finished third, and had I won that prio in game 2 I actually would have won the tournament. Having said that, it wasn't a super serious outing and wouldn't really have been a "proper" tournament victory.

Still I learned a lot about this list and have plenty to build upon moving forward.

I quite like your list and well done on the good result - they all count!

What changes are you thinking  for your list? How did you find the Horrors?

I'm more of a monster mash (triple dragons...) kind of guy so curious for your thoughts on the core units.

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I actually wouldn't change it, though I'll see how I get on with it. 

 

I have tried gristlegore with 2x TG and 1x ZD mounted kings, plus AAR and 3 x 10 ghouls. It's certainly very fun also. Running Royal Family battalion for the 4 drops. 

 

As to which I prefer, still too early to say. I only have around 20 games with FEC overall and the new lockdown measures here in Liverpool aren't helping.  

 

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As for the Horrors, I really liked them! They can do decent damage with just a hero nearby and make for a good counterpunch unit.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Liquidsteel said:

As for the Horrors, I really liked them

Against low save enemies and with a king in range... pretty brutal. GkoZd aura mean rerolling everything 🥳

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I love horrors. They´re quite cheap, they´re fast with Royal Mordants, and they have a good damage pool vs low save enemies (and they can reroll to hit vs armies like tzeench or neferata -1hit pools).

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This might be a dumb question but I haven't found the answer trying to search for it via reddit\google etc. I've been running a Blisterskin list for a while now with my friends and I can't figure out how the rules work for Lord of The Burning Skies. Specifically can I use this Command Ability on a unit that's tied up in combat? I don't see anything contradicting that, but to me it sounds kind of busted to be able to essentially teleport a unit that's in danger to safety for 1 CP.

Here is the rules text for reference: You can use this command ability at the start of your movement phase. If you do so, pick 1 friendly BLISTERSKIN unit that can fly and which is wholly within 12" of a friendly BLISTERSKIN HERO, or wholly within 18" of a friendly BLISTERSKIN HERO that is a general. Remove that unit from the battlefield and then set it up again anywhere on the battlefield more than 9" from any enemy units. It may not move later in that movement phase.

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35 minutes ago, Shibumi said:

This might be a dumb question but I haven't found the answer trying to search for it via reddit\google etc. I've been running a Blisterskin list for a while now with my friends and I can't figure out how the rules work for Lord of The Burning Skies. Specifically can I use this Command Ability on a unit that's tied up in combat? I don't see anything contradicting that, but to me it sounds kind of busted to be able to essentially teleport a unit that's in danger to safety for 1 CP.

 

It is not against the rules as written and it is well established that Seraphon can LoSat out of combat and that it is not a retreat.  Sylvaneth can also navigate the realmroots out of combat (that used to be clarified in a FAQ/errarta but doesn't seem to be there anymore) so I would think FEC could telelport out of combat as well.  Movement shenanigans is a thing in this game and it can offer advantages to an army that has it. I started with Seraphon and not being able to LoSaT twice each turn anymore completely changed the way I play.

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11 hours ago, Shibumi said:

I don't see anything contradicting that, but to me it sounds kind of busted to be able to essentially teleport a unit that's in danger to safety for 1 CP.

It is a cool ability, but technically speaking with the +2“ movement a running retreat can get you far far away too... (14+d6~17“)

so your paying 1CP for tablewide teleportation and the long charge. Not so overpowered, since your spending a CP instead of summoning a new unit or activating feeding frenzy, while also leaving behind some poor hero, who had to stay within 12“...

But it opens up nice set up phase shenanigans, where you’re setting up one strong side with GkoTg and 6Flayers and when your opponent counter deploys, you’ll just switch sides (since the king kinda suicide charges most of the time anyway), or backstabbing together with a summoned varghulf...late game objective grabbing and with deadwatch you’ll might even punch in some faces, before getting out of there...

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Posted (edited)

Hello beautiful Feccers - former Order player here. I'd like to pick your collective brain about 2 potential lists I'd like to run at an upcoming event. I've played a fair bit of FEC  but never at an event, so I want to do this right.

I've been studying tournament lists for FEC and the best performing 2 options seem to be feast day with 2 big birds + 40-10-10 ghouls, or blisterskin deadwatch with lots of flayers. Personally I'm really attracted to feast day (and I don't like painting flayers) so I'm opting to go with feast day. When toying around in warscroll builder I found a way to have a 2-drop list, which is the first option I'd like to present:

Spoiler

wP5STId.png

This runs 2 terrorgheists for maximum bites and buffing their attacks with archregent/ghoul king on foot. I specifically went with 2 TGs instead of zombie dragon because while the wound reroll aura is nice - it doesn't increase the chance to get bite mortal wounds so I'd rather have the extra TG (if zombie dragon has a place here, do let me know why). The main thing I'm trying to do here is have 2 battalions that allow for a 2-drop so you can give your opponent first go. I also think that every unit and hero in these battalions have value, none of the inclusions feel like a 'tax'. The list is light on battleline but the archregent and ghoul king on foot bring in 30 more ghouls and I can use the msu ghouls to cover the home objectives while the TGs have fun on the other side of the table. Having 2 battalions gives enough CP to do all summons and have one CP left so both TGs can use feast day if they both get into combat turn 1. The crypt ghast courtier will be deployed through ghoul patrol with the 20 ghouls from the summon, this gives them a hero over there, too. There's 50 points spare and I have a spare cast each turn so I may end up putting a purple sun in there (or any other useful endless spell, or an extra CP).

Thoughts about this one? Between this one and the next I think I like this one the most. (I see a lot of Royal Family legality discussions earlier in this thread but RAW (and probably RAI) this battalion is legal with mounted kings so I'm writing this list as if it is.)

 

The second list is a more traditional one.

Spoiler

IxqWaG0.png

I don't think this list needs much explanation. If you feel a zombie dragon has its place in this list instead of a second TG I'd love to hear why, looking at their scrolls I haven't been able to decipher why you would bring something less powerful for more points (apart from when you have a very specific summoning need with the courtier he brings and you can't get it from the archregent).  The other minor difference from the cookie cutter feast day list is the mortis engine. I have played with corpse cart and mortis engine and prefer the mortis engine over the cart. The reason why is that the cart has a hard time keeping up with the dragons and really dies to a stiff breeze. The engine is super speedy and has a bit of distraction carnifex going on, he can take a few hits too. His bravery ranged attack is useless more often than not but the 4d6 range damage/heal has pretty much always been a welcome ability. I also may swap the Chamon artifact with the -2 bravery Grim Garland one. I like the ignore -1 rend but this list has flayers/mortis engine/2 TGs that all potentially benefit from the Grim Garland. My worry with it is the short range of the attacks and the short range of the artifact, that they'll never overlap.

This list leans heavily into magic while the meta is really hostile towards magic users, so including either of those 2 options feels like a must when you want to rely on spells. (thinking out loud right now I guess you can run a list with both the cart and the engine? Back to warscroll builder after this post...). 

 

This post was lengthier than I imagined upfront, sorry about that. Thank you if you made it all the way through and I'm looking forward to any critique and feedback. Thanks!

 

Edited by Kiekeboe

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Feedback from my side is that you seem to have everything figured out, lists look good for sure.

Definitely good to take two Terrorgheists, before a Zombie Dragon, for the Mortal Wounds potential.

2-drop is legal as you say and is something I toyed with in Azyr myself, though haven't had a chance to run it myself.

I would opt for the extra CP in list 1, as you will be looking to Feezing Frenzy with both Terrorgheists as much as you can.

You could also try the list out as Gristlegore, as the Strike First trait is really valuable, along with the exploding 6s, and being able to safely charge in and delete something, knowing that if the opponent counter charges you in their turn you can activate when you die, is really strong!

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3 hours ago, Liquidsteel said:

I would opt for the extra CP in list 1, as you will be looking to Feezing Frenzy with both Terrorgheists as much as you can.
Yeah agreed, that's probably the safest bet. 

You could also try the list out as Gristlegore, as the Strike First trait is really valuable, along with the exploding 6s, and being able to safely charge in and delete something, knowing that if the opponent counter charges you in their turn you can activate when you die, is really strong!
Good one, in all my feast day excitement I completely skipped over Gristlegore... I kind of assumed you only want Gristlegore if you want to run dragons as battleline but obviously it can do much more. Thanks!

 

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11 hours ago, Kiekeboe said:

I'm looking forward to any critique and feedback.

As stated above, seems legit. The real test is getting used to them in cut-throat games and playing the objective/point game.

Sadly the Dragon is just worse, exploding MWs are just too good and the poor thing is also 20pts more expensive.

Only thing is the Chamon artifact, I thought the realm items got busted in GHB‘20 🧐

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1 hour ago, Honk said:

Only thing is the Chamon artifact, I thought the realm items got busted in GHB‘20 🧐

Thanks :) Yeah I'm unsure about that one but I was looking for something defensive now that we've lost the gryph feather charm. I feel like a lot of lists run mainly -1 rend at this time so it's worth a try. Also the artifacts in the book unfortunately aren't real game changers on TGs in my opinion :(

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