AoS 2 - Flesh-eater Courts Discussion

[Btimmy]

Does anyone know if the battalion boxes being released with BR: Teclis are going to be a limited time thing? Or are they more like start collectings going forward? 

[Kiekeboe]

1 hour ago, Btimmy said:

Does anyone know if the battalion boxes being released with BR: Teclis are going to be a limited time thing? Or are they more like start collectings going forward? 

I purchased the Idoneth 2-shark box from BR:Morathi last week (from GW). It wasn't available in the local store but their webstore still sells it. Even if it may be limited, it'll be around for a while. 

[Drazhoath]

One question about our Terrogheist:

Yesterday a friend told me that when a flying Monster (or everything else what flies) moves and „land“ on a terrain piece than the model have to stand on it or it cant end the move on the terrain.

I think thats not true because I cant find anything about such a rule in the core rules or Generals Handbook🤔

[Honk]

2 hours ago, Drazhoath said:

cant find anything about such a rule in the core rules

 

from the recent core rules designers commentary. if a model is allowed to „hang on to a wall“ for consecutive turns, it should also be able to be placed upon it and wobbly model syndrome applies.

the „Place it or leave it“ rule is a houserule 

Edited April 9, 2021 by Honk

[Honk]

 

killer game with a true monster mash... tabled olynders sorry soiled bedsheets, but sadly lost on points 😓

Edited April 9, 2021 by Honk

[Urauloth]

I believe the rule about ending your move on terrain that your friend is thinking of is a WH40k rule from a previous edition. It's definitely a rule that existed in a GW tabletop game at some point, but it's not Age of Sigmar (and I don't believe it's anything currently in print).

[Joseph Mackay]

13 hours ago, Honk said:

 

from the recent core rules designers commentary. if a model is allowed to „hang on to a wall“ for consecutive turns, it should also be able to be placed upon it and wobbly model syndrome applies.

the „Place it or leave it“ rule is a houserule 

‘Place it or leave it’ was added to 9th edition 40K so it could have been confusion on the players part. Additionally I wouldn’t be surprised if that carries over to AoS in 3rd edition.

but as it currently stands, the rules allow you to place models where they couldn’t actually be physically placed as long as you have the movement to get it there

[Honk]

Disclaimer: model bases are off-limits, also during movement... you cannot weave through units, nor land on top of them, including Endless Spells.

[Drazhoath]

2 hours ago, Honk said:

Disclaimer: model bases are off-limits, also during movement... you cannot weave through units, nor land on top of them, including Endless Spells.

I dint talk about landing on units but landing on terrain.

[Kaizennus]

So I decided to go all in on FEC (and maybe expanding to soulblight in the future).

I was able to pickup 2 boxes of the Mortal Realms boxes and one box of the getting started set.

this gives me:

50 ghouls 

2 arch regeant 

9  Crypt Horrors/Crypt Flayers/Vargheists

1 terrorgeist with a hero

There’s a lot of choices for how to build the boxes, such as the obvious choices between   Crypt Horrors/Crypt Flayers/Vargheists.

However I’m a little confused about the other leader options and if I should build models for them.

I’m also quite limited in that there’s only two stores in my country (that I’ve found, I’m in Asia) that sells AoS. They don’t sell the crypt horror set so if I want more of those I’d have to buy another large box set.

My question is, how should I go about choosing my build options? I think I’ll try the magnetization for the terrorgeist/zombie dragon. Is this possible for other models?

Should I build two arch regeants or is there something else I could build one as?

Thanks in advance for any advice!

[Honk]

6 hours ago, Kaizennus said:

other leader options and if I should build models for them.

There is only ONE sprue/box for horrors/flayers/vargheists and which is also used for the courtiers... so you’ll need a bunch of „flayer/horror“ boxes.

There is only one build for the Archregent.

 

And a varghulf would be nice.

[Sception]

Yeah, only one arch reagent build.  I would have recommended the opposite selection - one Broken Realms box and two Start Collecting boxes.  Not a big problem either way, though.

In terms of expansion, more Start Collecting boxes is generally a good way to go.  Eventually you'll have enough ghouls and monsters, and then the only thing left to get unit wise is more flayer/horror boxes.

Apart from that, the only thing left is courtiers.  The Grymwatch warband box from Warhammer Underworlds can be used as its own bespoke mini unit, but IMO it works better as a selection of cool Crypt Ghast Courtiers that don't require you to eat into a box of Crypt Ghouls to make them.  Infernal and Haunter Courtiers will require you to eat into a Horror/Flayer set, but even if you only want one of each, at least there won't be as many models wasted afterwords.

Varghulf Courtiers, though... you could just get the actual model, but it's a bit stiff and awkward, and it's resin (yuck), and it's out of stock online (in the US anyway), so you might not be able to get it anyway.  You could try converting a horror/flayer into one, check out this post from a few pages ago:

If you just want one Varghulf, then one of that, one haunter courtier, and one infernal courtier will put you back into the no-models-wasted range with your horrors/flayers.

Alternatively, there's the 'Vargskyr' from the new Cursed City box:

It looks good, and pretty Varghulfy, and it's the right size, and in plastic.  No wings though, and the Cursed City box is way too expensive if you're only getting it for this one model.  That said, it currently seems to be going for less than the price of a Varghulf on ebay, so this is probably what I would do.  Though if you're handy with conversions, you might want to add wing-flaps to its arms, perhaps from the horror/flayer kit.

.....

On the other hand, there is some open question whether right now is the best time to invest heavily in FEC.  There's some rumors that we might get rolled into the upcoming Soulblight Gravelords faction (not really what anyone wants to see, but judging by how pestilens and BCR made out it wouldn't necessarily be the worst thing that could happen), and even if that doesn't happen there still some currently unaccounted for rumour engine pics that look relatively FEC-y, along with some rather persistently out of stock items online (varghulf, terrain), suggesting the possibility of some sort of update in the not-too-distant-future regardless.  The current FEC battletome isn't so old that we're 'due' for another one, but with Lumineth getting two battletomes in less then a year the expected rules and schedule are kind of out the window.

[Kaizennus]

9 hours ago, Sception said:

Yeah, only one arch reagent build.  I would have recommended the opposite selection - one Broken Realms box and two Start Collecting boxes.  Not a big problem either way, though.

In terms of expansion, more Start Collecting boxes is generally a good way to go.  Eventually you'll have enough ghouls and monsters, and then the only thing left to get unit wise is more flayer/horror boxes.

Apart from that, the only thing left is courtiers.  The Grymwatch warband box from Warhammer Underworlds can be used as its own bespoke mini unit, but IMO it works better as a selection of cool Crypt Ghast Courtiers that don't require you to eat into a box of Crypt Ghouls to make them.  Infernal and Haunter Courtiers will require you to eat into a Horror/Flayer set, but even if you only want one of each, at least there won't be as many models wasted afterwords.

Varghulf Courtiers, though... you could just get the actual model, but it's a bit stiff and awkward, and it's resin (yuck), and it's out of stock online (in the US anyway), so you might not be able to get it anyway.  You could try converting a horror/flayer into one, check out this post from a few pages ago:

If you just want one Varghulf, then one of that, one haunter courtier, and one infernal courtier will put you back into the no-models-wasted range with your horrors/flayers.

Alternatively, there's the 'Vargskyr' from the new Cursed City box:

It looks good, and pretty Varghulfy, and it's the right size, and in plastic.  No wings though, and the Cursed City box is way too expensive if you're only getting it for this one model.  That said, it currently seems to be going for less than the price of a Varghulf on ebay, so this is probably what I would do.  Though if you're handy with conversions, you might want to add wing-flaps to its arms, perhaps from the horror/flayer kit.

.....

On the other hand, there is some open question whether right now is the best time to invest heavily in FEC.  There's some rumors that we might get rolled into the upcoming Soulblight Gravelords faction (not really what anyone wants to see, but judging by how pestilens and BCR made out it wouldn't necessarily be the worst thing that could happen), and even if that doesn't happen there still some currently unaccounted for rumour engine pics that look relatively FEC-y, along with some rather persistently out of stock items online (varghulf, terrain), suggesting the possibility of some sort of update in the not-too-distant-future regardless.  The current FEC battletome isn't so old that we're 'due' for another one, but with Lumineth getting two battletomes in less then a year the expected rules and schedule are kind of out the window.

First of all, thank you for the detailed post, it’s very appreciated!

I have a few follow up questions if you don’t mind.

My buying options are a little limited because I’m in Asia (but will be immigrating back in the next year or two).

The only GW exclusive store has a pretty limited catalog. For example, they are sold out on the start collecting box and the flayers kit (there is a gundam store that sells the start kit but it’s up priced about $20).

However, they do have the Warcry boxes and they are sold at the same price as the flayer box. Out of curiosity, would it make sense for me to pick up the warcry boxes since they come with 3 flayers and 10 ghouls? Or am I missing something obvious. I’m considering two boxes since they’re a little less than $50 each at the moment but are on the “last chance” list (which I believe means they won’t be restocked).

They also have the Grymwatch set for about $35 and is also last chance. Do you think it would be worth it to pick them up and use as you suggested?

Generally speaking, what’s a good number of ghouls to have? It seems lists are pretty “knight” heavy these days. I have 50 atm and could have 70 if I pick up the warcry boxes. I know that there is summoning though so I’m guessing you need a few extra?

Finally, I do agree about the Soulblight consideration. They were actually my first choice but I don’t think I’ll be able to pick up the models for a long while (cursed city and the new warband were sold out before the pre orders even went out, so I’m not confident they’ll be readily available and might have to wait until I’m fully back in N.America in the future).

Thanks again.

[Honk]

7 hours ago, Kaizennus said:

Generally speaking, what’s a good number of ghouls to have?

That depends on what you want to play...

for my deadwatch list (flayers, regent, GkoTg) I’ll need 20, if I feel like summoning some with the regent, but usually I summon a varghulf. And forget to summon with my GkoTg or don’t have a spare CP...

Double royal mordants list needs 2x10 and depending how you roll courtwise maybe a third unit for battleline... (+summoning) there you have your 50 ghouls.

but if you want to field a more fluffy and casual horde list ... 2x40+10 you‘ll be at three digits easily 

how you‘ll pick and match your minis is a bit your personal trouble, considering your living situation. Sometimes you’ll want a second GkoTg or for fluff a GkoZd. Or you‘ll go full ****** with a Gristlegore list, then you’ll need 5 🙈

the start collecting box is great for something like this, the Warcry box sounds good to add knights...

all depends on what you want and need and what is available 

[Ulfast]

Had my first fight in a long time with my FEC this saturday and I had a lot of fun. Me and a friend have restarted AoS and I play FEC and he plays ironjaws. Both the  armies and the game was intersintg and fun. I will contuie to play (and paint) as I feel the army was very intersting with tactical options. Also AoS was really fun and strategical, much better then I remember it (have mostly played 1:ed) which usually eneded in a big brawl in the middle of the board.

 

Just one question after the game, can a varghulf courtier bring back more then one model to a unit? Because I was lucky to get three dice in one round to become 5+ and we played it that it could bring back 3 models to a horror unit. But is that right? Feels powerful.

[zombiepiratexxx]

Yes, you played that right, the Warscroll specifically say Knight models are returned on a 5+. 

[Sception]

It's potentially quite effective, but not terribly reliable, and the Varghulf itself is pretty vulnerable to being picked out.  Strong, but not so strong that you should feel bad running it.

[Honk]

6 hours ago, Ulfast said:

But is that right? Feels powerful.

4 hours ago, Sception said:

the Varghulf itself is pretty vulnerable to being picked out.

FEC are extremely hero dependent, for ward save, feeding frenzy and regeneration... and the 5+ armor is nothing to write home about.

So if he is able to kill your support hero, their power level will drop significantly

[Ulfast]

Thanks for your quick answer and if feels good that we played is right. Now I know. Powerful ability but as several of you have said, as soon as our heros dies then we start to lose power. 

 

but I really like the army and it was so fun. The fun aspect actually surpised me as I have played so much 40k the last couple of years and in my gaming group both AoS and FEC had a bad reputation (bad game system and few and ugly models). But when I playe dit was the oppositet for me. I love the models, they where intersting and fun to game with and the gamesystem was strong. So I´m happy to give it a new chance and I´m allreaady looking forward to another game.

 

Now I just need to find a throne, seems most places has sold out of them, even GW.

[zombiepiratexxx]

Trying to finally make a decision about whether to play DoK or FEC, this is more than likely going to be playing against Nurgle or OBR predominantly. We're not competitive players but I want an army that's fun to play and doesn't stomp or get stomped. Both the DoK and FEC seem like fast armies that are fragile and that fits with me nicely. 

List I have designed is here for feedback on any of the points I've mentioned. AoS is just way harder to choose an army for compared to 40k as I like so much of the stuff, but enjoy the fact that it seems far more casual and more "fun". 

Allegiance: Flesh Eater Courts
- Grand Court: Blisterskin

Leaders
Abhorrant Archregent (240)
- General
- Command Trait: Hellish Orator
- Artefact: The Dermal Robe
- Lore of Madness: Blood Feast
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Terrorgheist (420)
- Artefact: Eye of Hysh
- Lore of Madness: Spectral Host
- Mount Trait: Gruesome Bite
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Zombie Dragon (440)
- Lore of Madness: Monstrous Vigour
- Mount Trait: Necrotic Fangs

Battleline
6 x Crypt Flayers (340)
20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)
10 x Crypt Ghouls (100)

Units
3 x Crypt Horrors (130)

Battalions
Royal Mordants (120)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 101
 

It's based off 2 Start Collecting Sets and the new BR box. Yes, more models needed for Summoning, especially a Varghulf. 

[mrteige]

3 hours ago, zombiepiratexxx said:

Trying to finally make a decision about whether to play DoK or FEC, this is more than likely going to be playing against Nurgle or OBR predominantly. We're not competitive players but I want an army that's fun to play and doesn't stomp or get stomped. Both the DoK and FEC seem like fast armies that are fragile and that fits with me nicely. 

List I have designed is here for feedback on any of the points I've mentioned. AoS is just way harder to choose an army for compared to 40k as I like so much of the stuff, but enjoy the fact that it seems far more casual and more "fun". 

Allegiance: Flesh Eater Courts
- Grand Court: Blisterskin

Leaders
Abhorrant Archregent (240)
- General
- Command Trait: Hellish Orator
- Artefact: The Dermal Robe
- Lore of Madness: Blood Feast
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Terrorgheist (420)
- Artefact: Eye of Hysh
- Lore of Madness: Spectral Host
- Mount Trait: Gruesome Bite
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Zombie Dragon (440)
- Lore of Madness: Monstrous Vigour
- Mount Trait: Necrotic Fangs

Battleline
6 x Crypt Flayers (340)
20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)
10 x Crypt Ghouls (100)

Units
3 x Crypt Horrors (130)

Battalions
Royal Mordants (120)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 101
 

It's based off 2 Start Collecting Sets and the new BR box. Yes, more models needed for Summoning, especially a Varghulf. 

unfortunately your army is ilegal because you need a Vargulf for the battalion.

I would probably look to take out the GKoZD and 10 ghouls (from the 20 block. 20 ghouls are nice to summon in but i wouldnt bother paying the extra 100 points for them).

Then i would add 1 Vargulf, 1 Abhorrant ghoul king, 3 horror to the unit of 3 and an extra command point.

That should get your army to 1950 points and that will almost always give you a triumph

Edited April 20, 2021 by mrteige

[Btimmy]

5 hours ago, zombiepiratexxx said:

Trying to finally make a decision about whether to play DoK or FEC, this is more than likely going to be playing against Nurgle or OBR predominantly. We're not competitive players but I want an army that's fun to play and doesn't stomp or get stomped. Both the DoK and FEC seem like fast armies that are fragile and that fits with me nicely. 
 

This is probably the wrong thread to be putting forth this particular opinion, but DoK is  considered to be the "best" book in terms of balance and power level at the moment. Meaning that the DoK book allows a DoK player to play essentially any supported style or models, and they are pretty good while doing it. By contrast, FEC is mostly relegated to Alpha strikes and summoning, so there is substantially less flexibility in list building, and arguably power level as well. There is no doubt that FEC can be fun to play, and is much cheaper to acquire though!

[Svalack]

I would never buy the single boxes for horrors/flayers, just buy more start collecting and sell the minis you don't need. Lots of new soulblight players will want those dragons, the ghouls are always popular because they fit in lots of game systems too. I used to get a chunk of money back just from trading the remaining vampire lord bits that came in the zdragon kit aswell.

FEC are easily the cheapest army in AoS and one of the few armies i enjoyed painting hordes of.

 

As for the cursed city model, still no idea why everyone loves that. Since it got revealed FEC players have been all over it but as a general rule of thumb i wouldn't proxy a flying creature with one that has no wings. I guess you could say its jumping around? i don't think its exactly wysiwyg.

There are some great third party varghulfs out there too, i have one original gw metal and then a few alt sculpts. The same goes for the courtiers if you dont feel like kitbashing / painting one to stand out.

Edited April 23, 2021 by Svalack

[Kink]

Hey all, long time lurker/player, first time poster/competitive player!

I've played a decent amount of FeC in the past year or so, all friendly games (mainly against GSG, LRL, Sylvaneth, KO) using mostly either Blisterskin (pretty common lists) or sometimes Morgaunt (lots of ghouls, lots of attrition/summoning/regen, mostly doesn't work which seems to be the consensus here also).

I'm looking at entering Battle of Copenhagen this year. This would be my first tournament and I would be using FeC. Now, I'm definitely not trying to win (a laughable idea) but I would like to win *one* game and generally not get tabled, so I'm wondering what the current consensus on strongest tournament meta is for FeC right now?

My assumption is either smash bat, or a strong Blisterskin list.

This is what I pieced together from some 20 or so pages of this thread as to how to build smash bat (I have never played this). Am I way off or is this about right? And if the latter, where should the last 100 points go?

Spoiler

Allegiance: Flesh Eater Courts
- Grand Court: Hollowmourne

Leaders
Abhorrant Archregent (240)
- General
- Artefact: The Dermal Robe
- Lore of Madness: Deranged Transformation
Varghulf Courtier (160)
- Artefact: The Bilious Decanter
Crypt Haunter Courtier (120)
- Artefact: Corpsefane Gauntlet

Battleline
6 x Crypt Horrors (260)
6 x Crypt Horrors (260)
6 x Crypt Horrors (260)
20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)

Units
3 x Crypt Flayers (170)

Battalions
Attendants at Court (110)
Royal Mordants (120)

Total: 1900 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 125

And this is an apparently strong Blisterskin tournament list I found elsewhere on the internet (which I have played before with some success). Is this still considered to be generally the right make up for this sort of list?

Spoiler

Allegiance: Flesh Eater Courts
- Grand Court: Blisterskin

Leaders
Abhorrant Archregent (240)
- General
- Command Trait: Hellish Orator
- Artefact: Eye of Hysh
- Lore of Madness: Deranged Transformation
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Terrorgheist (420)
- Lore of Madness: Spectral Host
- Mount Trait: Gruesome Bite
Varghulf Courtier (160)
- Artefact: The Bilious Decanter

Battleline
20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)
6 x Crypt Flayers (340)
6 x Crypt Flayers (340)

Units
3 x Crypt Horrors (130)

Battalions
Royal Mordants (120)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Extra Command Point (50)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 109

Which would you consider to be the all round stronger list? Or would you play something completely different?

Thanks in advance for your help!

[mrteige]

49 minutes ago, Kink said:

Hey all, long time lurker/player, first time poster/competitive player!

I've played a decent amount of FeC in the past year or so, all friendly games (mainly against GSG, LRL, Sylvaneth, KO) using mostly either Blisterskin (pretty common lists) or sometimes Morgaunt (lots of ghouls, lots of attrition/summoning/regen, mostly doesn't work which seems to be the consensus here also).

I'm looking at entering Battle of Copenhagen this year. This would be my first tournament and I would be using FeC. Now, I'm definitely not trying to win (a laughable idea) but I would like to win *one* game and generally not get tabled, so I'm wondering what the current consensus on strongest tournament meta is for FeC right now?

My assumption is either smash bat, or a strong Blisterskin list.

This is what I pieced together from some 20 or so pages of this thread as to how to build smash bat (I have never played this). Am I way off or is this about right? And if the latter, where should the last 100 points go?

  Reveal hidden contents

Allegiance: Flesh Eater Courts
- Grand Court: Hollowmourne

Leaders
Abhorrant Archregent (240)
- General
- Artefact: The Dermal Robe
- Lore of Madness: Deranged Transformation
Varghulf Courtier (160)
- Artefact: The Bilious Decanter
Crypt Haunter Courtier (120)
- Artefact: Corpsefane Gauntlet

Battleline
6 x Crypt Horrors (260)
6 x Crypt Horrors (260)
6 x Crypt Horrors (260)
20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)

Units
3 x Crypt Flayers (170)

Battalions
Attendants at Court (110)
Royal Mordants (120)

Total: 1900 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 125

And this is an apparently strong Blisterskin tournament list I found elsewhere on the internet (which I have played before with some success). Is this still considered to be generally the right make up for this sort of list?

  Reveal hidden contents

Allegiance: Flesh Eater Courts
- Grand Court: Blisterskin

Leaders
Abhorrant Archregent (240)
- General
- Command Trait: Hellish Orator
- Artefact: Eye of Hysh
- Lore of Madness: Deranged Transformation
Abhorrant Ghoul King on Royal Terrorgheist (420)
- Lore of Madness: Spectral Host
- Mount Trait: Gruesome Bite
Varghulf Courtier (160)
- Artefact: The Bilious Decanter

Battleline
20 x Crypt Ghouls (200)
6 x Crypt Flayers (340)
6 x Crypt Flayers (340)

Units
3 x Crypt Horrors (130)

Battalions
Royal Mordants (120)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Extra Command Point (50)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 109

Which would you consider to be the all round stronger list? Or would you play something completely different?

Thanks in advance for your help!

If you go Hollowmourne i would for sure make the Vargulf the general for the extra punch. I am also thinking of running a Hollowmourne list for Battle of Copenhagen so would love to spitball ideas if you want to