Milford Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 Quote ... not sure about the dreadblade harrows. What are they supposed to add to your game? They are not part of LoN, so they don’t get deathless and whatever... Hi, Honk. Thanks for the response so far. I should stress to everyone that I am a complete beginner when it comes to *playing* warhammer (that is, I have yet to play a game!). So forgive me if what I write seems naive. This list was my first attempt at expanding my small army of 15 blood knights and one vampire lord (on nightmare). I wanted to develop the army in a way that was tactically interesting and not so one dimensional (as to whether I achieved that, or if idd it can be achieved, is another question). First, the straightforward: Reikenor is there to, amongst some other things, guarantee that cogs go off with his Corpse Candle ability; the dire wolves are there as screens and fast objective cappers; and the bats are there to respond to shooting threats. Next, the dreadblades are there primarily for their Phantasmal Discorporation: "If this model is more than 3" from any enemy models at the start of your movement phase, instead of making a normal move, you can remove it from the battlefield and then set it up anywhere on the battlefield" I like the threat that this poses to the opponent, and the flexibility it gives to the list. Lastly, I included a 40 man blob of chainrasps (accompanied by a necromancer) for board presence. Some worries: - If anything, I was least sure about the inclusion of the rasps. Perhaps it would be better if I included multiple smaller units of them to camp objectives? - I was also unsure about the direwolves as screens. I'm tempted to take hexwraiths instead (still meeting battline reqs some way), given their ability to fly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honk Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 1 hour ago, Milford said: So forgive me if what I write seems naive. Nope, no forgiveness granted XD ... 3x5 Knights are brutal, if used right (welcome to the board noob, get ready to fail mightily). The list is pretty elite, and skilled enemies will outplay you. Little reikenor is a pretty decent choice as an ally, if you like the model for building/painting there is nothing wrong with fielding him... the points might be better spend elsewhere, but f it 1 hour ago, Milford said: Next, the dreadblades are there primarily for their Phantasmal Discorporation: Yes, highly mobile hero choice, but a 5hp lone rider somewhere in enemy territory, is just dead meat (sheets). Without synergies, charging into the enemy will get your heroes killed ASAP. The whole charging into the fray is not really for our heroes. Lord on Dragon might get away with it, but statistics alone show, how fast they go down. So pinpoint overwhelming force or bring the hordes for the grind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macarian Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 On 12/27/2018 at 8:35 PM, Milford said: Next, the dreadblades are there primarily for their Phantasmal Discorporation: Has anybody tried the Dreadblades to taxi a big unit forward as an immediate threat using the Unquiet Dead? I have been toying with something like this: Allegiance: Legion of Blood LEADERS Neferata Mortarch Of Blood (400) - General - Lore of the Dead : Overwhelming Dread (Deathmages) Vampire Lord (140) - Nightmare - Artefact : Orb of Enchantment - Lore of the Vampires : Soulpike Dreadblade Harrow (100) - Allies UNITS 15 x Blood Knights (720) 30 x Grimghast Reapers (360) 5 x Dire Wolves (60) 5 x Dire Wolves (60) 5 x Dire Wolves (60) 1900 points Basically force your opponent to deal with the 30 Grimghasts as a distraction so the Blood Knights can move up unscathed. Neferata and the Lord should probably be swapped for a VLoZD. Simple but effective (?) Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honk Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 4 hours ago, Macarian said: Thoughts? Why isn’t the vampirelord using the unquiet dead rule?! In my meta they are all Alpha-Strike crazy, so I like to have my bodies on the board, not somewhere in the gravesite. but a jump-around hero sounds interesting for backstabbing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macarian Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 14 hours ago, Honk said: Why isn’t the vampirelord using the unquiet dead rule?! Well, the idea I had was to keep the Vampire Lord, Neferata and the Blood Knights relatively safe during the first turn. Maybe deploy them in a central position in the deployment zone and then move them up to whichever side of the opponent's army I feel is weaker. The Grimghasts put pressure on the other flank so it's more difficult to respond for my opponent. I suppose the Vampire Lord could do the same but that would limit the maximum distance I can place the Gravesite markers away from the Vampire Lord to 25" (10 move+6 run+9 distance from the marker). I must admit that writing it out like this, I kinda feel like that covers the area between both deployment zones on most tables 😅 So by cutting the Dreadblade I gain 2 command points and have a drop less. What are your thoughts on the general strategy of using the Grimghasts as a throwaway-pressure unit? Is it viable at all? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honk Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) 7 hours ago, Macarian said: Is it viable at all? Nothing is viable... if you have pinions on the VL he moves 10“+5“, with a 24“ no mans land in most scenarios your set for first turn summoning. But your opponents might only falls once for this trick. Far out gravesites are suspicious, but if you position two far out on the flanks and he moves to block them, he weakens his centre. And why throw away?! 30 grimghast in front of a vamp with a gravesite...might even survive. And if not, one command point later, they are back on the table XD it is something to remember while setting up the game and a cool tactical option, but still need to be used right... Edited January 17, 2019 by Honk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sartxac Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) Hello, i'm new in this forum. I have a battle versus blades of khorne of 2000 points with aleatories objectives. This is my list of legion of Blood: Allegiance: Legion of Blood LEADERS Neferata Mortarch of Blood (400) - General - Lore of the Dead : Vile Transference (Vampires) Vampire Lord (140) - Flying Horror - Artefact : Orb of Enchantment - Lore of the Vampires : Amethystine Pinions Necromancer (110) - Lore of the Deathmages : Fading Vigour Abhorrant Ghoul King on Terrorgheist (400) - Allies UNITS 5 x Blood Knights (240) 10 x Black Knights (240) 40 x Skeleton Warriors (280) - Ancient Spears 10 x Zombies (60) 5 x Dire Wolves (60) TOTAL: 1930/2000 EXTRA COMMAND POINTS: 1 My think is use dark mist spell of Neferata in Blood Knighst for a good charge from behint the black knights. Combining with de orb of enchantment and blood feast of the vampire lord i think that is possible kill a strong monster of khorne with a relative security. I want use a strategy focused on rest bravery, do combo -2 or -4 of bravery with mortal bounds of Abhorrant Ghoul King more 3 crypt flyers summoned. Also, Twilight’s Allure and vile transference work as a good help for the Abhorrant Ghoul King on Terrorgheist. *I use the necromancer in order to use dance macabre in the unit of 40 skeleton warriors that rest -2 bravery in blood legion, more other -2 bravery of the zombie standard barrier. This rest a good -4 bravery to 6''. What do you think about my army list? Edited January 21, 2019 by Sartxac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 7 hours ago, Sartxac said: What do you think about my army list? Pretty good so far. The two Knight units should be able to do some damage while neferatas CA should keep everybody relativly save from harm, if I remember correctly Blades of Khorne goes for super buffed bloodletters who do extra mortal !on a roll of a 6! not 6+ anymore...but still deadly. your bravery debuff is wrong though... you will only get -2; -1 for any Death banner (1,2 or 3 banner doesn’t matter) and -1 for the legion. Then maybe another -1 from the necromancers overwhelming dread spell, if you choose it, if you cast it with a roll of 9+ you can resolve it 2x for another -1 debuff (also -2 to hit then). against a demon army with bravery 10 it is not that great, reducing to bravery 8 when in range of a banner. The terrorgheist might do damage with the scream (d6-2) but the flayers scream is wasted. If you want the summoning to go against rabble as screen consider taking some horrors, reavers and letters have bad armor. the heroes might have good armor, so it’s flayer time again... you can decide while declaring a summon so look what your aiming for. personally I would throw out the 10 zombies and take more dogs, the rule supreme good luck 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sartxac Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 Hello Honk. your bravery debuff is wrong though... personally I would throw out the 10 zombies and take more dogs, the rule suprem But my idea is do work the skeletons and zombies togheter. All enemy units near 6'' to this units will have a debull of -2 for skeletons and other -2 for zombies, and other -1 because will have the necromancer to 3'' of skeletons in order to use the ability Undead Minions. Totally, i want a debuff of -5 bravery with this formation. I think that will fight mortal khorne enemy that use Skarbrand, 40 bloodreavers, might use a artillery cannon of khorne and soul grinder, wrathmongers, etc. 😄 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honk Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 8 hours ago, Sartxac said: All enemy units near 6'' to this units will have a debull of -2 for skeletons and other -2 for zombies, Sorry, but that is not how it works. the debuff will only be -2 in total. Undying majesty gives -1 for enemy units within 6“ of any number of legion units and the Death banner gives -1 for enemy units within 6“ of any number of death banners... example: unit of wolves next to an enemy unit -1 bravery from the legion ability. Now a bunch of skellis move in, but the death banner is far away (7“) from the enemy unit. The enemy unit still only has -1 bravery. Black knights charge in with banner up front, NOW the enemy unit gets -2 bravery, -1 for a death unit within 6“ another one for the banner. Zombies charge afterwards with their banner...still -2. whatever else happens...-2 bravery, till morghast charge in... -3 bravery overwhelming dread...-4(/-5) bravery 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sartxac Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) Oh!!! I'm very grateful to you, i have a big army of nagash but little practice (i'm a skaven player). With this correction: Do you think that is better change the ghoul king on terrorgeist with his strategy with flayers for a vampire lord on zombie dragon? I think is better the terror because is hard to use the command point of the campire lord (1970 points) due to i will use the command point of neferata every turn (except the first tourn with lucky). *use prince Vordrai implies more changes in my units and i need the orb of enchantment for Skarbrand. Edited January 21, 2019 by Sartxac 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honk Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 10 hours ago, Sartxac said: i need the orb of enchantment for Skarbrand. I kinda like the idea of sneaking in some horrors through the ghoulking... the trouble is, that you‘ll need to punch skarbrand into the face, hard and ugly. You might need the extra attacks from the vampire CA... you could throw out the vampire, and the ghoulking and bring in a vamplord on dragon, who‘ll carry the orb into skarbrand, and an extra necromancer (1940pts) who can cast things like decrepify (hero gets -1 to wound and -1 dmg all melee weapons) or fading vigor (-1 attack, only 1d6 charge) also possible... since skarbrand cannot fly if I remember correctly, you can screen your units with zombies or wolves, cast neferatas spell and (suicide-)charge things into him (knights). Then resurrect the black knights one turn later if needed...40 skellis with van hels can also devestate a monster like skarbrand, you just have to strike first, before he kills like 10-20 of them Positioning, target priorities and countercharge... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baudelaire Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 Long time lurker, first time poster. 😊 After playtesting this list out for a few weeks, I think I have found what I want to build for my initial 2000 point list. So far, I'm 3-0, but I've only played against Stormcast and a weird Idoneth list. I'm curious as to your thoughts for how it may fare against a wider variety of lists. LEADERS General: Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (Aura of Dark Majesty, Soulbound Garments, Overwhelming Dread) Necromancer (Overwhelming Dread) Necromancer (Overwhelming Dread) Tomb Banshee Tomb Banshee Tomb BansheeBATTLELINE 20 Skeletons, full command 5 Dire Wolves w/ Doom Wolf 5 Dire Wolves w/ Doom WolfTROOPS 5 Black Knights, full command 2 Morghast Harbingers w/ HalberdsBEHEMOTHS Mortis Engine Terrorgheist Exactly 2000 points on the nose. Like I said, I've been pretty successful so far, albeit in a pretty controlled environment. So far, this army has been the Zombie Lord, the Terrorgheist, and their backup dancers. 😆 It also requires me to be very disciplined - my army has to stay together, so they move at a slightly slower pace for the first turn or two before striking. If I'm within 15ish inches at the start of any turn, this army is BRUTAL pretty quickly. It's the first turn that has made me nervous in all three of my games... Anyway, thoughts? I have only bought the skeletons and the dire wolves, so other things could theoretically still be adjusted while I begin assembly... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honk Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, Baudelaire said: Anyway, thoughts? List looks pretty cool!!! Except for the VloZd he can’t take the dread spell! Has to choose from the Lore of vamps... maybe vile transference to heal morghast or himself I have too much demons in my local meta to really go that way, 😢 Edited January 23, 2019 by Honk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baudelaire Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 Quote Except for the VloZd he can’t take the dread spell! Has to choose from the Lore of vamps... maybe vile transference to heal morghast or himself "All WIZARDS in a LEGION OF BLOOD army know an additional spell from one of the Lores of the Dead." "A Vampire Lord on a Zombie Dragon is a WIZARD." I can't see where it specifiies which Lore of the Dead a Vampire Lord has to be. Is this in a FAQ somewhere? (Sidenote: I should probably go read the FAQ for this book...) Can you give me a page number or a reference? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neinball Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 6 hours ago, Baudelaire said: "All WIZARDS in a LEGION OF BLOOD army know an additional spell from one of the Lores of the Dead." "A Vampire Lord on a Zombie Dragon is a WIZARD." I can't see where it specifiies which Lore of the Dead a Vampire Lord has to be. Is this in a FAQ somewhere? (Sidenote: I should probably go read the FAQ for this book...) Can you give me a page number or a reference? Pg. 70 under the Lores of the Dead. Deathmages can only pick from the Lore of Deathmages. Vampires can only pick from the Lore of Vampires. Deathlords can pick from both. And just in case you were wondering, a Guardian of Souls in LoN cannot pick from either Lore as it is not a Deathmage, Vampire, or Deathlord. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutter Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 12 hours ago, Baudelaire said: Anyway, thoughts? Are you aware of the fact that every spell can only be cast once per turn? Just asking, because there really is not much use in having all your casters taking the same spell (apart from the aforementioned fact that the vamp can't take OD). Some redundancy might be okay, if it is a really powerful spell, but the choice just seems odd. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baudelaire Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 Quote Pg. 70 under the Lores of the Dead. Thanks for that. I missed it. It appears I owe some playtesters a minor apology... 😆 That's unfortunate. Lore of the Vampires sucks. Maybe Amaranthyne Orb then? Maybe Vile Transference? Bleh. Quote Are you aware of the fact that every spell can only be cast once per turn? Just asking, because there really is not much use in having all your casters taking the same spell (apart from the aforementioned fact that the vamp can't take OD). Some redundancy might be okay, if it is a really powerful spell, but the choice just seems odd. I am. This army relies on that spell being successful every turn. There is some strategy to casting order that can be employed (go ahead and block it, and I'll cast Van Hels instead, and won't THAT be fun?) and also the redundancy is important in case a necromancer falls unexpectedly. I can't afford to have that spell become unavailable at all. In the specific context of my list, that is a really powerful spell. My army can regularly stack up to -4 Bravery for 5 or more Mortal Wound screams. Against most non-daemonic armies, that is devastating. Having it on both necros and the VLord was successful because at the very least, that VLord is super hard to kill. But since that's no longer an option, having had that rule pointed out to me, it's even more important that the redundancy be there. At any rate, what do people think of the non-hero choices? I've tried to balance out the things that scream with things that can fight, and one large-ish block to hold really important objectives. I think it's pretty balanced, but again, I've only played three games with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutter Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 Did you play any games against lists that had hard alpha strikes? To me, the list seems to lack 'meat', and might crumble pretty fast if hit hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sartxac Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 (edited) 15 hours ago, Baudelaire said: LEADERS General: Vampire Lord on Zombie Dragon (Aura of Dark Majesty, Soulbound Garments, Overwhelming Dread) I think that Soulbound Garments are out of phase artefact. If you want a better tank replace this from ethereal amulet from reign of Shyish. With this artefact rend don't affect your dragon and this will have save +3 forever. Edited January 23, 2019 by Sartxac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baudelaire Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 45 minutes ago, Mutter said: Did you play any games against lists that had hard alpha strikes? To me, the list seems to lack 'meat', and might crumble pretty fast if hit hard. I haven't. I could get more "meat" in the list by taking out the Morghasts. They're most in there for modeling purposes (I think they look cool), and they bring another source of -1 Bravery, but they're not the most durable unit in the world. Taking them out would let me do some more "meatier" things: increase the skeletons to 40? Increase the Black Knights to 10? Second Mortis Engine? What would you suggest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutter Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 Big skeletons, big black knights (more like 15 then, though), big unit of chainrasps, or, like everybody does, a big unit of grimghasts, I'd suggest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honk Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 7 hours ago, Baudelaire said: and they bring another source of -1 Bravery If you’re going for the bravery debuff, you‘re not playing super try hard and have an unique approach... still valid and pretty cool. Not really things to reduce or cut points off, maybe the terrorgheist (second engine and max skellis) or the third banshee 40 skellis with grimghast is so 2018, so meta against alpha strikes you will have to ace your positioning, speedbump with the wolves and counterstrike like Chuck Norris. The vampirelord on dragon would probably benefit from vile transference, orb sounds devastating, but just too unreliable. I had Deathstar destroyer moments and disco lightball moments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justinian Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 This is a list I’m keen to try build as a reasonably competitive starting point 2000pt matched play. Any big gaps or things that I’ve missed and should watch out for? LEADERS VLoZD - General, Aura of Dark Majesty, Ethereal Amulet, Vile Transference Prince Vhordrai Necromancer Spirit Torment BATTLELINE 5x Direwolves 5x Direwolves 5x Direwolves OTHER 20x Bladegheist Revenants 20x Grimghast Reapers 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evil Bob Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 Bladegheists are an ally option with LoB so they don’t get the Allegence abilities Immortal Majesty and Deathless Minions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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