AoS 2 - Hosts of Slaanesh Discussion

[Kramer]

On 6/29/2018 at 6:53 PM, kenshin620 said:

So how much would the chaos mammoth fit in with slaanesh armies?  It'll be a good hard hitter but might be eating a lot of points that could be used for heroes.

Looking into that as well, shame there is no leader option anymore! 21 depravity points anyone? ?

still good option though. Double pile in might be massive on that model. 

[Enoby]

Reckon we'll be seeing top tables anytime soon? I feel our summoning is incredibly strong, but we're still lacking in too many other departments to reach the top - I'd like to hear other people's opinions though. 

[Azurious]

3 hours ago, Enoby said:

Reckon we'll be seeing top tables anytime soon? I feel our summoning is incredibly strong, but we're still lacking in too many other departments to reach the top - I'd like to hear other people's opinions though. 

I played Slannesh against Fyreslayers, 2 kroak lists, Nurgle and DoK this weekend and actually think the faction is in a pretty ok state. 

Now it is definitely not top tier in line with the latest tombs but theres not a lot of change really needed to elevate them.  

A couple of big things that stand out to me are the 4/4 statline on all their non hero melee attacks, if this was 3/4 it would make a massive difference and bring them in line with the latest daemons and cc based forces.

Our heros are very basic.  They bring no buffing outside of locus activation or the Keepers command trait.  They are also very much scrolls of old, keepers with 10 wounds and mediocre dmg output feel very flat in comparison to their 3 relatives.

Overall though I think the army is pretty sound mechanically and just needs brought up to date with decent support / force multiplier rules and profile adjustments.

Edited July 10, 2018 by Azurious

[Carnith]

@enoby what was your list? How did you manage so much depravity against moonclan grots? 

I played a 4k (two 2k teams) and only managed 32 by turn 3. Granted my keeper got screwed on combat, but I felt it was fairly low for doing as much damage as I did. 

[Enoby]

5 hours ago, carnith said:

@enoby what was your list? How did you manage so much depravity against moonclan grots? 

I played a 4k (two 2k teams) and only managed 32 by turn 3. Granted my keeper got screwed on combat, but I felt it was fairly low for doing as much damage as I did. 

 

List:
Host: seekers 
- 1 exalted greater daemon of Slaanesh (blade of symmetry atifact)
- 1 keeper of secrets (general with devotee of torment) 
- 1 chaos sorcerer lord 
- 1 daemon prince of Slaanesh
- the Masque 

- 30 daemonettes 
- 30 daemonettes 
- 5 hellstriders

-5 seekers (would have traded for another prince but didn't have the model on me)

I can't remember their list exactly, but they did have a colossal squig which my keeper killed, and two (including the one that spawned after the colossal squig's death) units of squigs. Most depravity points came from my models being hurt - all of the heroes that were there originally died.

[Carnith]

Fair enough then.  I have no problem fighting stormcast at the moment. I'm trying not to bring artefacts that give fly due to my gw store having a few citadel woods for line blocking. It allowed me to keep a keeper of secrets safe, since I deployed it in woods, and had a -1 to hit artefact, + -1 to hit in combat, and hellstriders nearby. Makes it obnoxious to fight.

[Tzeentchmike]

Hi all

 

Long time lurker here but finally with the drop of aos2 decided to get involved a bit more in the community. Been playing slaanesh now since December and have racked up around 50 games with them so far.

With the new addition we are in a very strong place and hopefully a podium won’t be too far away we were close in the last addition because of the surprise factor. We have a very strong summoning mechanic and some great units to really help in this edition.

i have had to tweak my list for the new edition  but here it is

seeker host

General chaos sorcerer lord on manticore with supremely vain

exalted keeper with -3rend weapon on the scythes

herald on exalted chariot

chaos sorcerer lord

2 x30 daemonettes

2x 5 helstriders

10 seekers

been performing well so far but blackout will be its first tournament test. The old list which had a herald and an exalted chariot instead of the manticore performed well in the last 6 months, 7th at heat 2, 28th at scgt and 5th at the doggers invitational. 

I record a brief summary of my tournament games on my Twitter @tzeentchmike if anyway is interested.

Mike

[Enoby]

12 hours ago, Tzeentchmike said:

Hi all

 

Long time lurker here but finally with the drop of aos2 decided to get involved a bit more in the community. Been playing slaanesh now since December and have racked up around 50 games with them so far.

With the new addition we are in a very strong place and hopefully a podium won’t be too far away we were close in the last addition because of the surprise factor. We have a very strong summoning mechanic and some great units to really help in this edition.

i have had to tweak my list for the new edition  but here it is

seeker host

General chaos sorcerer lord on manticore with supremely vain

exalted keeper with -3rend weapon on the scythes

herald on exalted chariot

chaos sorcerer lord

2 x30 daemonettes

2x 5 helstriders

10 seekers

been performing well so far but blackout will be its first tournament test. The old list which had a herald and an exalted chariot instead of the manticore performed well in the last 6 months, 7th at heat 2, 28th at scgt and 5th at the doggers invitational. 

I record a brief summary of my tournament games on my Twitter @tzeentchmike if anyway is interested.

Mike

That sounds very interesting! Good luck at Blackout

[Popisdead]

Manticore sorcerer lords seem to be more popular now.  He has a lot of good utility to add to the army?  

Any tips on using one would be appreciated

Thanks,

[Enoby]

11 minutes ago, Popisdead said:

Manticore sorcerer lords seem to be more popular now.  He has a lot of good utility to add to the army?  

Any tips on using one would be appreciated

Thanks,

To take a guess, I think he's more popular because his spell does decent damage (and we have very little access to mortal wounds), and he has a lot of wounds so generates decent depravity points when injured. 

[Tzeentchmike]

Thanks Enoby

popisdead. He has a decent spell which can generate a lot of mortals plus depravity points if you choose the right target. He is a great support character as you don’t want to get him into combat so can easily summon of him. A few of the new missions make wizards key so to have one that flys quickly and is semi survivable is really useful, allows the keeper to just go and kills things. Also oracular visions is now  a free mystic shield which no one can stop so very useful. In the list above I have 2x visions daemonic power and a shield if needed. So it helps buff a fragile army.

[Sigmalthus]

Havent seen an Archaon/Slaanesh list recently! So I threw together a fun little list to take.  Archaon lets the heroes all pop off their abilities every turn. Fun double pile in and attack with Archaon and Varanguard, and I threw the hero on foot to buff the Varanguard; extra attacks generated on 6s, but, they are +1 to hit because Archaon is on the field. They each have 6 swings, so 18 swings extra attacks on 5s and can pile in and attack twice. Just thought it'd be a fun list to try out! I haven't played enough Slaanesh to pick artifacts and traits and all that yet.  And I dont quite understand what the Invaders host does now that all heroes can use command abilities for CPs.

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Seekers
Mortal Realm: Ulgu
Chaos Lord Of Slaanesh (100)
Keeper Of Secrets (260)
- General
- Trait: Invigorated by Pain 
Lord Of Slaanesh On Daemonic Mount (140)
Archaon (660)
20 x Daemonettes Of Slaanesh (200)
20 x Daemonettes Of Slaanesh (200)
5 x Hellstriders Of Slaanesh (100)
- Claw spear
3 x Varanguard (280)
- Ensorcelled Weapon
- Allies
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (40)
Soulsnare Shackles (20)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 280 / 400
Wounds: 107

[Enoby]

40 minutes ago, Sigmalthus said:

Havent seen an Archaon/Slaanesh list recently! So I threw together a fun little list to take.  Archaon lets the heroes all pop off their abilities every turn. Fun double pile in and attack with Archaon and Varanguard, and I threw the hero on foot to buff the Varanguard; extra attacks generated on 6s, but, they are +1 to hit because Archaon is on the field. They each have 6 swings, so 18 swings extra attacks on 5s and can pile in and attack twice. Just thought it'd be a fun list to try out! I haven't played enough Slaanesh to pick artifacts and traits and all that yet.  And I dont quite understand what the Invaders host does now that all heroes can use command abilities for CPs.

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Seekers
Mortal Realm: Ulgu
Chaos Lord Of Slaanesh (100)
Keeper Of Secrets (260)
- General
- Trait: Invigorated by Pain 
Lord Of Slaanesh On Daemonic Mount (140)
Archaon (660)
20 x Daemonettes Of Slaanesh (200)
20 x Daemonettes Of Slaanesh (200)
5 x Hellstriders Of Slaanesh (100)
- Claw spear
3 x Varanguard (280)
- Ensorcelled Weapon
- Allies
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (40)
Soulsnare Shackles (20)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 280 / 400
Wounds: 107

Sounds like a really interesting list. The combo with the varanguard sounds cool. I think the only issue is that the opponent may be able to stop/slow down the varaguard before they make it into combat. Also, kind of by the by, but I wish Archaon had a Slaanesh head, otherwise he looks quite misplaced in the army I get why he doesn't in the lore, but that's stopped me from buying the model. 

[Carnith]

So what artefacts have people been using?

Blade of Ending from Shyish is good

Rend -3 artefacts are good for the keeper or the lord on mount.

The Flying Cloak from metal is good for a chance to do more mortal wounds... however, as I learned, not having fly and terrain with citadel woods makes the keeper stupidly good for visibility blocking. 

Lens and Brooch from light are just all around good and not just for slaanesh.

And the -1 to hit and +1" move charm from Ghur is stupidly. good. 

Ghyran weapon of +1 hit, +1 wound is good as well as regular keeper gets rerolls to wounds of 1 anyways. Or put it on the exalted keeper and take the chaos sorc for daemonic power to give pretty much full rerolls.

[Enoby]

45 minutes ago, carnith said:

So what artefacts have people been using?

Blade of Ending from Shyish is good

Rend -3 artefacts are good for the keeper or the lord on mount.

The Flying Cloak from metal is good for a chance to do more mortal wounds... however, as I learned, not having fly and terrain with citadel woods makes the keeper stupidly good for visibility blocking. 

Lens and Brooch from light are just all around good and not just for slaanesh.

And the -1 to hit and +1" move charm from Ghur is stupidly. good. 

Ghyran weapon of +1 hit, +1 wound is good as well as regular keeper gets rerolls to wounds of 1 anyways. Or put it on the exalted keeper and take the chaos sorc for daemonic power to give pretty much full rerolls.

At first I went with the artifact that gave +1 damage on the sword of the exalted keeper, but found that it was too swingy. I like the -3 rend on the claws, mostly to deal with 3+ save pests. 

I would consider sticking the d6 mortal wounds on a 6+ onto the Chaos lord of Slaanesh on foot, as he has +1 to hit against heroes. It likely isn't worth it in any competitive sense, but it could be fun. It may be good on the claws of the keeper, as if it piles in, it'll almost certainly get 1d6 mortal wounds.  The only issue is how common -1 to hit is 

[Tzeentchmike]

1 hour ago, carnith said:

So what artefacts have people been using?

Blade of Ending from Shyish is good

Rend -3 artefacts are good for the keeper or the lord on mount.

The Flying Cloak from metal is good for a chance to do more mortal wounds... however, as I learned, not having fly and terrain with citadel woods makes the keeper stupidly good for visibility blocking. 

Lens and Brooch from light are just all around good and not just for slaanesh.

And the -1 to hit and +1" move charm from Ghur is stupidly. good. 

Ghyran weapon of +1 hit, +1 wound is good as well as regular keeper gets rerolls to wounds of 1 anyways. Or put it on the exalted keeper and take the chaos sorc for daemonic power to give pretty much full rerolls.

I have always gone for the -3 rend now that the slaanesh +1to hit bubble icon has now changed to models. The d6 mortal wound is ok but only works against monster and heroes whilst the -3 rend works against everything 

[Tzeentchmike]

5 hours ago, Sigmalthus said:

Havent seen an Archaon/Slaanesh list recently! So I threw together a fun little list to take.  Archaon lets the heroes all pop off their abilities every turn. Fun double pile in and attack with Archaon and Varanguard, and I threw the hero on foot to buff the Varanguard; extra attacks generated on 6s, but, they are +1 to hit because Archaon is on the field. They each have 6 swings, so 18 swings extra attacks on 5s and can pile in and attack twice. Just thought it'd be a fun list to try out! I haven't played enough Slaanesh to pick artifacts and traits and all that yet.  And I dont quite understand what the Invaders host does now that all heroes can use command abilities for CPs.

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Seekers
Mortal Realm: Ulgu
Chaos Lord Of Slaanesh (100)
Keeper Of Secrets (260)
- General
- Trait: Invigorated by Pain 
Lord Of Slaanesh On Daemonic Mount (140)
Archaon (660)
20 x Daemonettes Of Slaanesh (200)
20 x Daemonettes Of Slaanesh (200)
5 x Hellstriders Of Slaanesh (100)
- Claw spear
3 x Varanguard (280)
- Ensorcelled Weapon
- Allies
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (40)
Soulsnare Shackles (20)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 280 / 400
Wounds: 107

Nice list but i believe archaon has to be the general to use his command trait which means you lose the invigorated by pain on the keeper. Always tempted be archaon in a list though but have never been able to see past the exalted 

[Carnith]

So what are people's thought on Prismatic Pallisade? I didn't realize how big of a base it is. Could be great to dropping in front of an enemies gun line and watch them spend a turn or 2 moving dudes to get move dudes to see anything to shoot. Or even just dropping it in front of an objective that you don't them near. For example, that new shifting objectives. You could place it  to force your opponent to run around it to gain control. Seems like a nice utility spell that could be useful depending on what armies will be popular. Unfortunately, doesn't stop abilitys that just pick units, but does stop spellcasters who have to pick visible units.

 

[Enoby]

55 minutes ago, carnith said:

So what are people's thought on Prismatic Pallisade? I didn't realize how big of a base it is. Could be great to dropping in front of an enemies gun line and watch them spend a turn or 2 moving dudes to get move dudes to see anything to shoot. Or even just dropping it in front of an objective that you don't them near. For example, that new shifting objectives. You could place it  to force your opponent to run around it to gain control. Seems like a nice utility spell that could be useful depending on what armies will be popular. Unfortunately, doesn't stop abilitys that just pick units, but does stop spellcasters who have to pick visible units.

 

Might be really good control with the Masque; you could place it in such a way that, when their movement is reduced to something like 2", they'd only be able to get one more model in LoS after movement. The only thing is that it's easy to dispell, so it'd probably be removed before doing anything. 

[Carnith]

True, I wish we had access to cheaper casters that weren't slaves to darkness or the keeper of secrets. Hopes for the future, we get some sort of caster support daemon, or a caster mortal.

[Enoby]

8 minutes ago, carnith said:

True, I wish we had access to cheaper casters that weren't slaves to darkness or the keeper of secrets. Hopes for the future, we get some sort of caster support daemon, or a caster mortal.

Fully agree. Kind of wish our heralds were casters (with a points increase, of course), because they don't really do all that much at the moment - not even a unique buff to daemonettes. It'd be cool to have a caster that could wound themselves to get better at casting for a turn. I think one of the things that would really make Slaanesh shine, and will probably be one of the most likely things to be added in the new faction, are more buffing heroes/abilities/spells in general. 

[Carnith]

We need a more unified mechanic for slaanesh. What is their best aspect? Khorne is supposed to be fighting, Tzeentch is magic, nurgle is resiliency and debuffing, is slaanesh just fast? Cause our debuffs can be devastating, but I end up feeling like a hodgepodge of ideas from the other factions. We have the rend of khorne and the ability to fight, we have barely any magic, but can get a plus to it, albeit one character, we can stack negative modifiers such as -1 to hit and rerolls with our basic troops, and we're quick. Doesn't feel like any specific theme. 

[Enoby]

11 minutes ago, carnith said:

We need a more unified mechanic for slaanesh. What is their best aspect? Khorne is supposed to be fighting, Tzeentch is magic, nurgle is resiliency and debuffing, is slaanesh just fast? Cause our debuffs can be devastating, but I end up feeling like a hodgepodge of ideas from the other factions. We have the rend of khorne and the ability to fight, we have barely any magic, but can get a plus to it, albeit one character, we can stack negative modifiers such as -1 to hit and rerolls with our basic troops, and we're quick. Doesn't feel like any specific theme. 

I kind of hope they're throwing ideas at the wall and seeing what sticks, and to exemplify that in the battletome. 

From what I can gather, our core design philosophy is:

- fast (everything in the army)

- lots of decent attacks (not bad to hit or wound, and army wide rend) (pretty much everything in the army has this, and the keeper's command ability amplifies this)

- debuff (the hellstriders, the chaos lord of Slaanesh on boobsnek, the daemonette loci, the allure of Slaanesh command trait, the fiends of Slaanesh)

- paper thin defence as a weakness (all Slaanesh specific non-hero units have a 5+ save, and we have no way to boost our defences besides debuffing)

This would suggest we were meant to be a controll/finesse army - like assassins. We get into a weak spot, throw a load of stuff at it before it can respond, kill it, and stop them getting a hit back through debuffing. To compare the Chaos gods to D&D style classes, Khorne would be the fighter/barbarian, Tzeentch would be the wizard, Nurgle would be the cleric, and Slaanesh would be the rogue. Unfortunately GW has yet to find a way to have this translate well to the table, but I think it could if everything was amplified on a charge (more attacks, more rend, more debuffs) like a rogue's sneak attack, and we had a way to escape combat effectively (a retreat and charge rule would be great, as would always strike first on a charge). 

Edited July 11, 2018 by Enoby

[Carnith]

Always strike first would be amazing. Maybe if the slaanesh trait was 40k charge rules? Slaanesh units that charge can attack before the enemy? The keeper would allow those units to pile in later on in the phase. Some sort of negative on turn 1 as slaanesh has beguiled the enemy into not recognizing the threat in front of it?

[Enoby]

1 minute ago, carnith said:

Always strike first would be amazing. Maybe if the slaanesh trait was 40k charge rules? Slaanesh units that charge can attack before the enemy? The keeper would allow those units to pile in later on in the phase. Some sort of negative on turn 1 as slaanesh has beguiled the enemy into not recognizing the threat in front of it?

Yeah, stuff like that could be awesome. Slaanesh seems like it should be the opposite of Daughters of Khain - while they end with their best abilities, we should start with ours and lose them as we go on. So we have the tools to kill quickly, but must sieze the opportunity. It would also create an interesting interaction with depravity points, where we get a load of them to begin with, and should use them to reinforce ourselves when we grow weaker. 

In the end, it'll probably be nothing like this and GW will give us some totally random ability as they seem to be confused about what to do with Slaanesh in most areas. I feel it will be something to do with the hosts, and their abilities may be expanded upon. I really like the idea of the hosts, but I hope it's more along the lines of the legions in Legions of Nagash than it is just splitting a set of abilities between three sub allegiances. I suppose Nighthaunt's abilities changed loads from the GHB to their battletome, so we could see a large shift. 

That makes me think - I wonder what endless spells we'll get.