AoS 2 - Hosts of Slaanesh Discussion

[azdimy]

8 hours ago, Black_Fortress_Immortal said:

Curious if a list like this would work (or is legal):

Pretenders Host - 2000pt

Exalted Greater Daemon of Slaanesh (General)
-Trait: Devotee of Torment
-Trait: Invigorated by Pain
Daemon Prince of Slaanesh
-Artifact: Breathtaker
Daemon Prince of Slaanesh
-Artifact: Doppelganger Cloak
Chaos Lord of Slaanesh
Chaos Warriors w/ Greatblades x 30
Chaos Knights w/ Glaives x 5
Chaos Knights w/ Glaives x 5
Chaos Warriors x 5
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh
Godsworn Champions of Ruin
 

3-drop list that focuses on abusing the Exalted Daemon's command ability (that can either go on the Daemon Princes to allow 2 immediate pile-ins when the enemy goes to attack), and 6" pile-in that allows safe positioning.  Breathtaker is for tying up a unit, while your other Daemon Prince with Doppelganger Cloak sits safe in the other unit that is forced to attack into a prince that they can't target.  Your Exalted daemon will pile-in last, and probably twice, wrecking whatever it hits, avoiding being hit from sitting outside of 3" but within 6" of the target.  The ability to kill an enemy hero within 3" on a 6 roll seems great.

Battalion allows free pile-in and attack of the knights/warriors/daemonprince as needed.  Command ability from the Lord will grant run + charge if you need it, on a unit of Knights or  your Daemon Prince.  Geminids are just for debuffing a threat further,  as needed.

The same way the everchosen battalions are no longer usable outside of grand alliances. The Godsworn champions of ruins battallion and all the units that are parts of it need to come from ally points despite being marked Slaanesh making that list illegal. Currently the only battalion we can use I believe is the beast of chaos Slaanesh one

[azdimy]

You also need 3 battleline at 2000pts and the chaos warriors are your only battleline units in your list

[Enoby]

As @azdimy said, you need some more battleline and the battalion can no longer be used (we really need some more battalions, wish the Start Collecting had a usable battalion). If you want to keep with mortals, I'd suggest Hellstriders for battleline (their debuff is great). If you're not bothered about mortal troops, you can't go wrong with loads of daemonettes.

[Black_Fortress_Immortal]

8 minutes ago, azdimy said:

The same way the everchosen battalions are no longer usable outside of grand alliances. The Godsworn champions of ruins battallion and all the units that are parts of it need to come from ally points despite being marked Slaanesh making that list illegal. Currently the only battalion we can use I believe is the beast of chaos Slaanesh one

Oof, that's garbage.

I still think that a Pretender's host with Doppelganger Cloak on a Daemon Prince, and Devotee of Torment on the Exalted Daemon seems fun.  I'll have to run with Daemonettes and an Exalted Chariot for greater effect.  Thank you.

[firebat]

Also the Daemon Prince ability only works if it hasn't already attacked in that phase so it can't use it to attack twice in a row with the command ability.

[Carnith]

With the exalted keeper it could, when you make an attack, you can immediately pile in and attack again, it's not a separate activation like the regular keeper of secrets.

[firebat]

Ah fair enough. I haven't used one so I missed it was immediate. I should try one out really as I can't decide if I like it or not on paper. I don't think it's bad or anything but it feels like the only real gain is a slightly more durable general and and extra spell cast and dispel. The immediate pile in is nice (now I know about it) but I can't help but feel i'm just consolidating more eggs into one target and either losing a character that has more depravity point potential (in more wounds you can just throw away) or losing a unit and having the bare minimum of actual troops and so losing a lot more damage and wounds.

180 points on the Exalted over the Keeper gets you 5 wounds and about 5 extra damage. Fiends might not be popular but they get you 12 wounds and about the same damage for 40 points less. 180 points of Seekers (7.5 models) gets you 15 wounds and about 7.5 damage. A Herald on an Exalted Chariot gets you 9 wounds (and possibly 8 depravity points) and again does about 5 wounds. Of course that's a really basic comparison as it's leaving out armour saves, rend and other abilities but I guess I just don't feel, at least at 2000pts, the Exalted Daemon is very Slaanesh. 

Hmm, now i'm wondering if a Keeper, 5 Exalted Chariots and 100 Daemonettes might be a way to go. Bit boring though.  

Coming back to that list again the Doppelganger cloak on a Daemon Prince feels a bit pointless if i've got it right. The whole point of a Slaanesh Daemon Prince is to attack first and interrupt the enemy without it costing you a pick. Since you can't choose to not attack you can't sit him in combat protected, you're just negating the effect of the Mark of Slaanesh. The only time it would have any benefit would be if he was involved in a combat where you had other units and you really wanted to prevent any wounds being taken by the DP so you could pick him last after the enemy had already attacked your other units but then I feel you're better off putting it on the general. I think you want Slaanesh hero's taking wounds though so healing might be better. 

[Carnith]

I'm a fan of the Gryph-charm feather from Ghur. It allows us to get that -1 to hit our monsters cant get via look out sir, and it makes them faster.  Barring that, and going with a combat orientated artefact, Blade of ending from Shyish on a hero with supremely vain would allow them to trigger the artefact on 5+'s, which could be super devastating. Or a simple -3 rend on the keepers claws to really make them shred elite enemies or annoying seraphon with ignoring rend 1, or dwarves, orks, and tree people who like to ignore some rend.

[Enoby]

3 hours ago, carnith said:

Blade of ending from Shyish on a hero with supremely vain would allow them to trigger the artefact on 5+'s

I've lost my book currently. What does the blade of ending do? Is it mortal wounds on a 6+? 

[Carnith]

+2 damage on hits of 6+.

There is the Banshee blade that each hit roll of a 6+ makes you roll 2d6 against the unit and if you roll above their bravery, do d3 mw.

[Enoby]

29 minutes ago, carnith said:

+2 damage on hits of 6+.

There is the Banshee blade that each hit roll of a 6+ makes you roll 2d6 against the unit and if you roll above their bravery, do d3 mw.

Thanks for the info. That does sound good, but I think the -3 rend is better as it's all the time; unfortunately -1 to hit is pretty common (though I think we are one of the best armies at giving -1s to hit). 

The feather charm sounds pretty nice as well, but I wonder if it's worth investing in defences when we could go on the all out offense and summon back. I find we don't have enough to back up our defences, so it's better to go for an all out offense. 

 

By the way, for anyone who has played Beasts of Chaos, do they have anything that is worth using for us? It looks like BoC play very similarly to us (a bit slower, and probably more defensive), so they may not be able to fill any unfulfilled niches that we currently lack. That said, I've not tried to use them so I couldn't say if that's true.   

[Elazar The Glorified]

Not played with my Beasts in my Slaanesh list yet. I can see some merit in Ungor Raiders as a screen with some shooting and a character for a cheap Depraved Drove at the very least. The +1 CP and artefact certainly can be useful for us! 

[firebat]

I wanted to try something like this:

Allegiance: Slaanesh
 - Host: Pretenders

LEADERS
Dragon Ogor Shaggoth (180)
Keeper Of Secrets (260)
Daemon Prince Of Slaanesh (160)
Daemon Prince Of Slaanesh (160)
Herald Of Slaanesh on Exalted Seeker Chariot (160)
The Masque Of Slaanesh (80)

UNITS
30 x Gors (210)
-Gor-Blades & Beastshields
1 x Tuskgor Chariots (60)
1 x Tuskgor Chariots (60)
3 x Dragon Ogors (140)
30 x Daemonettes Of Slaanesh (270)
5 x Hellstriders Of Slaanesh (100)
-Claw spear
- Enrapturing banner

BATTALIONS
Depraved Drove (150)

TOTAL: 1990/2000 EXTRA COMMAND POINTS: 1 WOUNDS: 147
LEADERS: 6/6 BATTLELINES: 3 (3+) BEHEMOTHS: 3/4 ARTILLERY: 0/4

I'd wanted a dragon ogre themed army a while back (like 7th.ed while back) but game changes when 8th came out put it on hold so this was trying to fit some stuff into my daemon army with half converted models I had stuffed in a box. No artifact choices or anything but the idea being it split into the 2 halves of the beasts being one blob and the daemons the other with the Shaggoth as the general. I used to really like a unit of pleasureseekers in oldhammer as a grindy unit to tie things up which is the dragon ogres here with the Shaggoth in a position to support them while trying to take wounds and then heal them up again to generate depravity points.

I'm undecided between Seekers and Pretenders though. It used to be Pretenders all the way but with summoning now the extra move means the difference between a newly summoned unit likely making a charge roll instead of failing.

[Carnith]

2 units of tzaangor enlightened on foot and a tzaangor shaman could be good. It's a bit slower for sure, but it could be quite hardy. An alternative, is 20 bestigors and a shaman. 

[Black_Fortress_Immortal]

On 11/1/2018 at 2:00 AM, firebat said:

Ah fair enough. I haven't used one so I missed it was immediate. I should try one out really as I can't decide if I like it or not on paper. I don't think it's bad or anything but it feels like the only real gain is a slightly more durable general and and extra spell cast and dispel. The immediate pile in is nice (now I know about it) but I can't help but feel i'm just consolidating more eggs into one target and either losing a character that has more depravity point potential (in more wounds you can just throw away) or losing a unit and having the bare minimum of actual troops and so losing a lot more damage and wounds.

180 points on the Exalted over the Keeper gets you 5 wounds and about 5 extra damage. Fiends might not be popular but they get you 12 wounds and about the same damage for 40 points less. 180 points of Seekers (7.5 models) gets you 15 wounds and about 7.5 damage. A Herald on an Exalted Chariot gets you 9 wounds (and possibly 8 depravity points) and again does about 5 wounds. Of course that's a really basic comparison as it's leaving out armour saves, rend and other abilities but I guess I just don't feel, at least at 2000pts, the Exalted Daemon is very Slaanesh. 

Hmm, now i'm wondering if a Keeper, 5 Exalted Chariots and 100 Daemonettes might be a way to go. Bit boring though.  

Coming back to that list again the Doppelganger cloak on a Daemon Prince feels a bit pointless if i've got it right. The whole point of a Slaanesh Daemon Prince is to attack first and interrupt the enemy without it costing you a pick. Since you can't choose to not attack you can't sit him in combat protected, you're just negating the effect of the Mark of Slaanesh. The only time it would have any benefit would be if he was involved in a combat where you had other units and you really wanted to prevent any wounds being taken by the DP so you could pick him last after the enemy had already attacked your other units but then I feel you're better off putting it on the general. I think you want Slaanesh hero's taking wounds though so healing might be better. 

The reason you'd pay for the Exalted daemon is purely for the Command Ability, and that it's currently the strongest Daemon option for a General.  If you can give it a 6" pile in that can activate in combat within 6" instead of 3".. along with an immediate double pile-in?  Combine with Supremely Vain and throw out over 30 wounds in 1 phase.  You're going to keep it safe by positioning right outside of their pile-in range.

[Black_Fortress_Immortal]

8 hours ago, Elazar The Glorified said:

Not played with my Beasts in my Slaanesh list yet. I can see some merit in Ungor Raiders as a screen with some shooting and a character for a cheap Depraved Drove at the very least. The +1 CP and artefact certainly can be useful for us! 

So something along these lines would work?

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Pretenders
Mortal Realm: Ulgu
Great Bray Shaman (100)
Exalted Greater Daemon of Slaanesh (440)
- General
- Trait: Devotee of Torment 
- Slaanesh Allegiance Option: Supremely Vain (Second Command Trait)
- Artefact: Sword of Judgement
Daemon Prince Of Slaanesh (160)
- Artefact: Doppelganger Cloak 
Daemon Prince Of Slaanesh (160)
30 x Gors (210)
- Gor-Blades & Beastshields
30 x Gors (210)
- Gor-Blades & Beastshields
30 x Ungors (180)
- Mauls & Half-Shields
30 x Bestigors (300)
Depraved Drove (150)
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (40)

Total: 1950 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 156

They would all benefit from reroll 1's for Pretenders, and benefit from run + charge.  Because of that, you can benefit from Gors with the shields for the +1 save, rather than dual weapons.  2 extra cp would help to stymie battleshock, as well as helping out with pulling some multi-pile-in tricks with the Daemons.  I think it's also viable to have Sword of Judgment on the Exalted Greater Daemon and her claws, as 2 pile-ins would be 14 attacks, where 5+ (supremely vain) would inflict the d6 mortal wounds... so on average 4-5d6 mortal wounds on a hero/monster for 1cp.

Option 2 would be grabbing Chronomantic Cogs instead, and taking 40 Ungors.  With Supremely Vain, you'll be casting on a 6, and with Arcane terrain (if lucky), a 5.  With +3" movement from the Great Bray Shaman, +2" from the Cogs, you'll be looking at an 11" movement for a horde, with a 6" run, and +2" to charge would mean that your Bestigors and Daemons will be in their face turn 1, if you wanted.  Your Greater Daemon could run and hang within 6" of something and pile-in to combat rather than having to charge.  Pop your Exalted Excess of Violence on all 3 Daemons, and have fun.

Edited November 2, 2018 by Black_Fortress_Immortal

[PensivePanther]

9 hours ago, Black_Fortress_Immortal said:

So something along these lines would work?

Allegiance: Slaanesh
- Host: Pretenders
Mortal Realm: Ulgu
Great Bray Shaman (100)
Exalted Greater Daemon of Slaanesh (440)
- General
- Trait: Devotee of Torment 
- Slaanesh Allegiance Option: Supremely Vain (Second Command Trait)
- Artefact: Sword of Judgement
Daemon Prince Of Slaanesh (160)
- Artefact: Doppelganger Cloak 
Daemon Prince Of Slaanesh (160)
30 x Gors (210)
- Gor-Blades & Beastshields
30 x Gors (210)
- Gor-Blades & Beastshields
30 x Ungors (180)
- Mauls & Half-Shields
30 x Bestigors (300)
Depraved Drove (150)
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (40)

Total: 1950 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 156

They would all benefit from reroll 1's for Pretenders, and benefit from run + charge.  Because of that, you can benefit from Gors with the shields for the +1 save, rather than dual weapons.  2 extra cp would help to stymie battleshock, as well as helping out with pulling some multi-pile-in tricks with the Daemons.  I think it's also viable to have Sword of Judgment on the Exalted Greater Daemon and her claws, as 2 pile-ins would be 14 attacks, where 5+ (supremely vain) would inflict the d6 mortal wounds... so on average 4-5d6 mortal wounds on a hero/monster for 1cp.

Option 2 would be grabbing Chronomantic Cogs instead, and taking 40 Ungors.  With Supremely Vain, you'll be casting on a 6, and with Arcane terrain (if lucky), a 5.  With +3" movement from the Great Bray Shaman, +2" from the Cogs, you'll be looking at an 11" movement for a horde, with a 6" run, and +2" to charge would mean that your Bestigors and Daemons will be in their face turn 1, if you wanted.  Your Greater Daemon could run and hang within 6" of something and pile-in to combat rather than having to charge.  Pop your Exalted Excess of Violence on all 3 Daemons, and have fun.

I think you're on the right track. Looks like a fun list.

Option 2: I find endless spells to be, for the most part, unreliable at best. Between most brayherd being able to run and charge and the bray-shaman's speed boost I'm not sure cogs is really going to be giving you much. I'd consider simply running this army as a seeker host if you want to play around with pure, unrestrained speed. Just my two cents.

If I were to change anything I'd consider adding in a unit of hellstriders. Their debuff is just too clutch and easy to use. Also, don't forget your depraved drove bonuses! On top of all your previously mentioned boons, a large chunk of your army could also be getting reroll's on their charge rolls depending on where your opponent puts their artifacts! If you're going to pay that battalion you should make sure you make those points back.

[kenshin620]

New Fiends previewed alongside flesh hounds for the khorne vs slaanesh box. From the video it'll be herald (dont know if mounted or foot), lesser daemon, mounted lesser daemon, and daemon beast for each side

 

[azdimy]

Are these fiends on 2 different  base size?

One seems to be on a 40mm round and the other on an oval base

[Enoby]

2 minutes ago, azdimy said:

Are these fiends on 2 different  base size?

One seems to be on a 40mm round and the other on an oval base

I think it's just perspective. 

[Carnith]

The Harpanette! Slaanesh Herald?

[Carnith]

Specifically, this one. 

[Enoby]

I really wonder what that harp player will do. I'm really hoping she's a caster.

[firebat]

Priest would be a good fit actually with some different tunes to play.

[Enoby]

2 minutes ago, firebat said:

Priest would be a good fit actually with some different tunes to play.

I hope she can change tunes to do different (de)buffs - so maybe a song that lets you go faster, a song that lets you hit more, and a song that debuffs the enemy.