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AoS 2 - Grand Host of Nagash Discussion

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@Snoogens congrats on the win, thanks for reporting back.

I've finally succumbed and bought 30 Grimghast Reapers, dreading putting them together but it'll be nice to play with something "competitive"

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What about this list for the lulz and memes?

 

Allegiance: Grand Host of Nagash

Leaders
Nagash Supreme Lord of the Undead (880)
- General
- Lores of the Dead Spell 1: Vile Transference
- Lores of the Dead Spell 2: Overwhelming Dread
- Lores of the Dead Spell 3: Amaranthine Orb
Knight of Shrouds on Ethereal Steed (120)
Necromancer (130)
- Lore of the Deathmages: Fading Vigour
Guardian of Souls with Nightmare Lantern (130)

Battleline
10 x Chainrasp Horde (80)
10 x Chainrasp Horde (80)
10 x Chainrasp Horde (80)

Units
30 x Grimghast Reapers (420)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Umbral Spellportal (70)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 0
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 92



Basically buff the Reapers into the sun with the heroes and just watch the bodies fly. With so much regen on them, they'll basically never die, and if they do, just CP them back to life. Use Nagash as a distraction carnifex and hero nuker.

Edited by LordPrometheus

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57 minutes ago, LordPrometheus said:

What about this list for the lulz and memes?

Can't really fault it. As GHoN lists go it's about as good as it gets. 

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What are peoples thoughts on yet another buff to one of our units in a different army?

We have now had nagash go back up in points whilst losing abilities and a battalion ability and becoming much better in a different army, Arkhan doing the same, hexwraiths becoming dirt cheap for a different army but not for us and now both types of morghasts are cheaper for a different army but not us.

 

New tome inbound splitting off from the typical Legions?

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34 minutes ago, Grimoriano said:

In theory the same unit cannot have different points

Is this a rule? Hexwraiths in the GHB 2020 profiles for legions are 140, whislt in the same book they are 130 for nighthaunt, so I assume they can have different profiles (I hope I'm wrong).

 

Nagash is still yet to receive an FAQ to make his battalion ability work and it's been like a year now? So I honestly think they're not bothering as they will likely release an updated tome/soulblight this year (I hope).

 

My understanding is that if I want to make a matched play army I must use the most up to date pitched battle profiles for that army, not from a different one... its just usually they update the points for a unit for all factions, this is the first time I've come across a change for one faction and not another I think...

Edited by Ghoooouls

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14 minutes ago, Ghoooouls said:

Hexwraiths in the GHB 2020 profiles for legions are 140, whislt in the same book they are 130 for nighthaunt

Nice pick, I didn't see that.

Anyway, I'll assume this is a typo. All unit always have same price and same warscoll no mater army.

We have seen in the past that when an unit go up in point becaus of a specific bonus in an army, it always impact all army (Nagash more expensive due to OBR, Grimghast Reapers going up in point due to usage in LoN impacting also Nighthaunt despit theire poor performance)...

So I will assume this is same sort of  mistake GW did page 3 same book, saying that Liberator cost 100 when later it is show they now cost 90, and by so assume that Hexawraiths supposed to be 130 (for both LoN and Nighthaunt).

I've send a request to GW support to have clarity on this point.

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3 minutes ago, RedMax said:

Nice pick, I didn't see that.

Anyway, I'll assume this is a typo. All unit always have same price and same warscoll no mater army.

We have seen in the past that when an unit go up in point becaus of a specific bonus in an army, it always impact all army (Nagash more expensive due to OBR, Grimghast Reapers going up in point due to usage in LoN impacting also Nighthaunt despit theire poor performance)...

So I will assume this is same sort of  mistake GW did page 3 same book, saying that Liberator cost 100 when later it is show they now cost 90, and by so assume that Hexawraiths supposed to be 130 (for both LoN and Nighthaunt).

I've send a request to GW support to have clarity on this point.

Yeah let's hope so, as now both morghasts are also more expensive for legions (210) than for bonereapers (190) as per the bonereaper faq.

Let me know if they get back to you!

Edited by Ghoooouls

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17 minutes ago, Ghoooouls said:

also more expensive for legions (210) than for bonereapers (190) as per the bonereaper faq

I've send a 2nd request to confirm that OBR FaQ new point for this 2 units also apply to LoN (I assume yes).

Today LoN FaQ and Designers commentary are completly outdated. e.g.:

Q: Nagash and Arkhan know the spells that other Wizards know. Can Hexgorger Skulls make them forget the spells?A: Only if there are no other Wizards in range for them to ‘relearn’ the spell from.

new warscroll no more allow Nagash to learn any spell making this faq entry completly meanless.

I hope a new FaQ will be release for LoN to clarify this points. Anyway, as soon as I got feedback from GW on this points, I'll post it here.

Edited by RedMax

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43 minutes ago, RedMax said:

I've send a 2nd request to confirm that OBR FaQ new point for this 2 units also apply to LoN (I assume yes).

Today LoN FaQ and Designers commentary are completly outdated. e.g.:

Q: Nagash and Arkhan know the spells that other Wizards know. Can Hexgorger Skulls make them forget the spells?A: Only if there are no other Wizards in range for them to ‘relearn’ the spell from.

new warscroll no more allow Nagash to learn any spell making this faq entry completly meanless.

I hope a new FaQ will be release for LoN to clarify this points. Anyway, as soon as I got feedback from GW on this points, I'll post it here.

That's the trouble (which is what makes me think they're just gonna outright redo legions sooner rather than later)... they have multiple things like that, that dont make sense anymore. See nagashs battalion for instance, it gives him something for an ability which he no longer has. Lots of outdated points that they could easily have updated in an faq like the rest as well.

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1 hour ago, Ghoooouls said:

Is this a rule? Hexwraiths in the GHB 2020 profiles for legions are 140, whislt in the same book they are 130 for nighthaunt, so I assume they can have different profiles (I hope I'm wrong).

It's faqed that the LoN Hexwraith warscroll is not valid and use the Nighthaunts one instead. Does it apply for points too?

Greetings

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1 hour ago, ACBelMutie said:

It's faqed that the LoN Hexwraith warscroll is not valid and use the Nighthaunts one instead. Does it apply for points too?

We are supposed to have a single point cost for same unit, even in differents alligence. At least it was case so far.

For now I would assume this is a typo, and as previous value was 140, I guess correct one is 130pts.

Now, let's wait for GW feedback on that.

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Quick question - where do people tend to put their gravesites? I was thinking about creating a sort of 12" square on the board with them to create lots of overlapping areas for healing units.

Interested to hear what others do!

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5 hours ago, VonSmall said:

where do people tend to put their gravesites?

Really depends on the mission and your army, as well as your opponent.

usually I go for a crooked flat diamond shape:

                                   *
             *                                           *
                                   *
the left and Right tight around the middle line, the upper one as far as I dare and the bottom one as resurrection point in the middle of my deployment zone.

Since this is an Grand Host discussion, no legion of night backfield ambush madness 😈.

Depending on the battleplan, you could deploy a unit in the grave, run up a hero, vamplord in nightmare is extra fast, and then call up a big blob, which then kinda got as far as double or triple their movement speed.

always the question where the moshpit will escalate, where you’re going to need your units, if your opponents rushes forward, ironjawz really outran and blocked my forward deployment once.

but 3/4 of the time I end up with that Diamond shape, as tight/flat/wide as I think is best. Maybe 4/5...

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6 hours ago, VonSmall said:

Quick question - where do people tend to put their gravesites? I was thinking about creating a sort of 12" square on the board with them to create lots of overlapping areas for healing units.

Interested to hear what others do!

I always start with my "safety" gravesite.  It's my last line of defence in case everything has gone poo.

I typically consider the objectives next.  I want the opportunity to summon a unit such that it's within objective grabbing range.  (Throughout the game occasionally measure distance between objective and gravesite, whilst mumbling incoherently under your breath for added effect)

Once I've done that, I pretty, much end up  with something similar to what Honk drew.

I've been using a flying VL with various speed up buffs recently, it's quite fun when he covers half the board and summons back some DireWolves to threaten an objective.  I've over played my hand though, most of my regular (which are very few atm) know my tricks and are ready for it.

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2 hours ago, WinnerDave said:

Throughout the game occasionally measure distance between objective and gravesite, whilst mumbling incoherently under your breath for added effect

That’s the real trick I guess...

measure and mumble just to distract your opponent 😂👍

flying vlozd with „called forth“ flank support is a valid option, but of course depends on circumstances. The flat diamond is the boring „one size fits all“ approach, funky madness needs to be learned the hard way through trial and (mostly devastating) error 🤣

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So, I was playing Starstrike in a tournament and as you don't know where the objectives are going to be I strung all 4 gravesite along the mid way line so I could move towards where ever the objectives arrived.  I spent most of the game then berating myself for such stupid taking the risk and not giving myself a "safety" GS.  Especially when I got down to 2 models left (Nagah and a Wight King), somehow I managed to 'hand of dust' through the spell portal and broke a unit's coherency, then Nagatling Gun & Shoot & Fight  the far right GS clear.  Survived the next turn (we're talking major Hail Mary stuff here) and summoned back 20 GraveGuard,  10 Black Knights and 5 Dire Wolves. 

Despite what on paper looked like a terrible use of GSs...appeared to be a stroke of genius.  I wouldn't recommend it though :D

Edited by WinnerDave
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11 hours ago, WinnerDave said:

what on paper looked like a terrible use of GSs...

High risk... high rewa-got crushed 😂

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How does everyone go about keeping the big man (Nagash) alive during games whilst making the most of him points wise?

 

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8 minutes ago, VonSmall said:

How does everyone go about keeping the big man (Nagash) alive during games whilst making the most of him points wise?

 

You don't, you moan about how overcosted in LoN he is to your opponent, then you laugh together because he's not even costed appropriately for Petrifex Elite anymore.  Then back to moaning because you HAVE to have him as your general so you've got to keep him back for summoning duties.

Personally I've not had too much luck with him.  Occasionally the Nagatling Gun will pull out something amazing and decimate a horde of somethings and you'll remember that Grots have a bravery of 4 so yes you can actually use soul stealer for once.  The best I've managed from him, is using a regular Vampire Lord to give him +1A and also using Supreme Lord of Death to get the re-roll 1s, but that's 2 command points.  It was also a scenario with 1 or 2 objectives, any mission with a handful of objectives that require us to spread out...that's tough.

However...I've not been using ghosties up till now.  So my screens of Skeletons/Dire Wolves have been not challenging enough to fight through.  I've caved and bought 30 Grimghast Reapers, which I'm hoping will turn the tide.  Although I'm eyeing up Legion of Blood and basically sticking snuggles in the display cabinet until he drops a few points.

Sorry probably not what you wanted to hear, perhaps someone has a more positive point of view.

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Yeah - I kinda figured that one. His huge positive is that he has a tool for just about every situation imaginable. If only he didn't die so quickly though!

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On 7/21/2020 at 7:16 PM, Ghoooouls said:

Hexwraiths in the GHB 2020 profiles for legions are 140, whislt in the same book they are 130 for nighthaunt

Hi, good news!

FaQ confirmed this is a typo : https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/YlH5dYMq3VCRtmgb.pdf

Page 13 – Legions of Nagash, Hexwraiths Change the points value to ‘130’.

Page 13 – Legions of Nagash, Morghast Archai Change the points value to ‘190’.

Page 13 – Legions of Nagash, Morghast Harbingers Change the points value to ‘190’.

So FaQed point of OBR were intended to by apply to LoN as well as Nighthaunt one.

So we are still in a system where a single unti have always same point cost no mater the army (as expected)!

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Think I know the answer to this one but wanted to hear from others. When bringing back models from gravesites/Nagash/Heroes can I conga them out in such a way that they get within 3" of an enemy unit (thereby tagging them in combat) if:

A) My unit being healed is already in combat with a DIFFERENT unit.

B) My unit being healed is not in combat with anyone

It doesn't have a restriction in the book but I may be missing something.

Cheers!

Edited by VonSmall

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6 hours ago, VonSmall said:

It doesn't have a restriction in the book but I may be missing something.

Yeah, somebody posted something like that around here... Maybe in FEC 🤔

setting up models within 3“ while unengaged seems to be a nono.

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Yeah I just asked this question so I know the answer! You cannot. You can only place a model within 3 inches of an enemy unit if the unit that the model is being returned to is already within 3 inches of that same enemy unit. There is text in the night haunt tome with this ruling. 

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