AoS 2 - Blades of Khorne Discussion

[Sleboda]

2 hours ago, Mikeymajq said:

On the Bloodthirsters, you can either build them as flying or on the ground with the right leg (literally the first step in the assmbly). I'm just wondering if the flying one makes him less stable? I'm guessing the on the ground one is better (also makes him slightly lower), but does anyone have any advice to which is better?

I built all if mine on the ground for stability.  I couldn't bring myself to trust the extra height.

[Sleboda]

24 minutes ago, twrightii said:

the question is can Tyrants of Blood trigger on Bloodthirsters outside of 3" but within 6" that are affected by the Unfettered Furys command ability?

I know it feels like there is a connection between these two rules, but factually there is not.

Rather unambiguously, the Tyrants rule requires a distance of no more than 3" to trigger. It would be different if it said something like "pick another dude that is eligible to pile in" but it doesn't. It says pick another dude within 3". The Fury ability does not change the physical distance between models.

[twrightii]

1 minute ago, Sleboda said:

I know it feels like there is a connection between these two rules, but factually there is not.

Rather unambiguously, the Tyrants rule requires a distance of no more than 3" to trigger. It would be different if it said something like "pick another dude that is eligible to pile in" but it doesn't. It says pick another dude within 3". The Fury ability does not change the physical distance between models.

Thats the impression I was under. I was just more surprised I couldn't find this question specifically asked before. Appreciate the response =D

[fwlr]

9 minutes ago, Sleboda said:

I know it feels like there is a connection between these two rules, but factually there is not.

Rather unambiguously, the Tyrants rule requires a distance of no more than 3" to trigger. It would be different if it said something like "pick another dude that is eligible to pile in" but it doesn't. It says pick another dude within 3". The Fury ability does not change the physical distance between models.

However. If you've got a 6" pile in, you're striking before the opponent has the chance to (ie you have to pile in for them to be allowed to activate) which in effect does the same thing as tyrants (but better, kind of) unless they have a similar ability.

Best of both worlds 

[Pathies]

Hey guys, just curious - I know that we’ll have a better idea once the ghb comes out (in terms of scenarios, deployments, etc.), but has anyone started thinking of possible meeting engagement lists? 

[TheArborealWalrus]

3 hours ago, Battlefury said:

Does that mean, it can only be used once? Or cna I stack it, until I have emptied my command points?

I'd say that since the pick is at the start of the combat phase that it would prevent you from doing it more than once. As far as I can tell it works something like this:

1: select unit(s) to benefit from the command ability. I'm throwing the other at the beginning of the combat phase abilities on this step, but you'd do the trading off thing as normal. (player who's turn it is goes, other player goes, ect)

2: Select a unit to pile in and fight.  If its one of the units that got the ability put on it then it immediately piles in again if it fits the necessary bubbles.

If you can get the bubbles right the tyrants ability would then let you have 2 piles in with three different thirsters before your opponent goes(assuming no activation shenanigans and you get that 4+ artifact to go off(big ifs)).  Admittedly not hard for an enemy to prevent this, but it'd be real cool that one time it happens. 

3: enemy activation 4: you select another unit who could be another of those who get the double pile in. Ect...

Wow. Laying it out like that really does make it sound like playing chess. So much planning ahead. *shrug* Such is the life of Khorne. Blood For The Blood God!!!

[Smooth criminal]

4 hours ago, Battlefury said:

Does that mean, it can only be used once? Or cna I stack it, until I have emptied my command points?

You technically can use it any amount of times, but each unit will only get 1 additional pile in since it mentions "for the first time".

Now the question that they didn't FAQ is if it means first time per combat phase or first time per game, so that part is debatable. But FEC got their ability with same wording FAQed to first time per combat phase.

12 minutes ago, TheArborealWalrus said:

If you can get the bubbles right the tyrants ability would then let you have 2 piles in with three different thirsters before your opponent goes(assuming no activation shenanigans and you get that 4+ artifact to go off(big ifs)).  Admittedly not hard for an enemy to prevent this, but it'd be real cool that one time it happens.

It won't stack with tyrants ability because both mention "for the first time". It will stack with strike fist ability.

Edited June 17, 2019 by Smooth criminal

[PivotalCar]

34 minutes ago, Pathies said:

Hey guys, just curious - I know that we’ll have a better idea once the ghb comes out (in terms of scenarios, deployments, etc.), but has anyone started thinking of possible meeting engagement lists? 

So, Meeting Engagements, here's my idea

Spearhead

1-bloodstoker

5-blood warriors

5- wrathmongers

Main Body

1-bloodsecrator-general with all the goretide things

1-slaughterpriest-killing frenzy

10-blood warriors

20-blood reavers

Rearguard

1-khorgorath

 

Plan

First you protect your wrathmongers and the stoker with your warriors, and try to sit on the objective without your important units dying. Then, when the main body comes in, you can use the goretide command ability and sent your warriors and reavers up the field, these guys will have +2 attacks from the secrator and the mongers and hopefully +1 to hit from the priest. Your main assult will hopefully clear out most of their force, while your heroes and the 5 warriors can camp objectives. Then your khorgorath can run around and clean up remaining enemies, as these guys are powerful against lone units. 

I have no idea how good this list is, but it seems like a lot of fun and it looks pretty inexpensive, what do you guys think? feedback welcome.

 

 

[Darksteve]

1 hour ago, Smooth criminal said:

You technically can use it any amount of times, but each unit will only get 1 additional pile in since it mentions "for the first time".

Now the question that they didn't FAQ is if it means first time per combat phase or first time per game, so that part is debatable. But FEC got their ability with same wording FAQed to first time per combat phase.

It won't stack with tyrants ability because both mention "for the first time". It will stack with strike fist ability.

1) The first time per game versus combat phase arguement feels silly because using the same logic I could take it to mean first time that model ever fought since being purchased, which is obviously ridiculous.

@TheArborealWalrus

2) It does stack up nicely with Tyrants in a few ways. Depending on how you read the clarification on multiple abilities triggering either you just can use both in amy order, as they both were allowed to trigger but are different abilities. Or if your issue is that tyrants cant trigger after the second reapers attack then because you pick the order just do tyrants first. Then reapers still is occuring "after the model fought for the first time." 

The reapers/tyrants interaction was discussed a few pages back with this same conclusion. 

Edited June 17, 2019 by Darksteve
Added tag

[Pathies]

1 hour ago, PivotalCar said:

I have no idea how good this list is, but it seems like a lot of fun and it looks pretty inexpensive, what do you guys think? feedback welcome.

 

 

Looks like a pretty cool list to me! I was thinking of using a goretide list myself, but I was also thinking that skullfiend might also be useful (I tend to skew towards mortal units) for getting blood tithe given the possibility that 1000 points may limit the number of units on the field. The list that i’m Kicking around is:

Spearhead:

Juggerlord - master decapitator and crown cleaver

Khorgorath x 1

wrathmongers x 5

main body:

slaughterpriest - axe, and can’t decide between killing frenzy and bronze flesh

bloodsecrator

skullcrushers x 3 with glaives

rear guard:

skullcrushers x3 with glaives

 

My thought is that the juggerlord and khorgorath are both fairly tanky and have decent enough damage output (especially with the skullfiend command ability) so I would try to get them stuck in with the wrath mongers buffing one of them and then have the waves of skullcrushers come in and help with any combats lasting too long for my liking! My only worry is that it could be too elite and I won’t be able to play objectives all that well. I’d love to hear what you all think! 

[MOMUS]

18 hours ago, Battlefury said:

I would have another question.

The Reapers of Vengeance ( is it command ability ) allows a demon unit to pile in once more. The rules says:

"You can use this command ability at the start of the
combat phase. If you do so, pick 1 friendly REAPERS
OF VENGEANCE DAEMON unit wholly within 8" of a
friendly DAEMON model with this command ability.
After that unit has fought in the combat phase for
the first time, if it is within 3" of an enemy unit it can
immediately make a pile-in move and then attack
with all of the melee weapons it is armed with for a
second time."

Does that mean, it can only be used once? Or cna I stack it, until I have emptied my command points?

It can be used to affect a unit once per phase but still can be used multiple times to affect multiple units.

[MOMUS]

21 hours ago, Charleston said:

I like the idea of an pinned FAQ but I do not know if the people who are able to change the initial post have the ressources to gather these questions together

We (the frequent users of the thread) would gather the questions and answers together and then message the mod (gaz) who has the first post to amend it with our FAQ.

 

If anyone is interested in helping out or has noticed a question frequently popping up PM me.

Edited June 18, 2019 by MOMUS

[Smooth criminal]

On 6/16/2019 at 4:19 PM, ledha said:

to be fair, the skullcanon is much faster, more resilient (can't be crew sniped), have a respectful melee profile and also shoot in the melee phase (including the opponent's) if he kill someone in melee.

I'm interested in each dwarf artillery being 2 separate units. 2 cannons will give you 4 blood points, that's 10 letters, half a thirster or something moving/fighting. Also cannon itself is a nice target for dumping blood sacrifice mws.

I'll probably try it out at some point.

[Patches]

22 hours ago, Darksteve said:

1) The first time per game versus combat phase arguement feels silly because using the same logic I could take it to mean first time that model ever fought since being purchased, which is obviously ridiculous.

Moreover, the exact wording on every wizard is "This model is a WIZARD. It can attempt to cast 1 spell in your hero phase, and attempt to unbind 1 spell in the enemy hero phase. It knows the Arcane Bolt, Mystic Shield and Acquiescence spells." If anyone forces us to use RoV ability once per game, becourse of no 'every combat phase'  phrasing, we shall force them to cast 1 spell per wizard per game for exactly the same reason.

[twrightii]

Battle Report Time! Just had a 2k game and Tyrants of Blood did work.

Spoiler

My list was Reapers of Vengeance:

 1 of each BT including Skarbrand (Crown of Command on Unfettered Fury)

2x Slaughter Priest (Killing Frenzy and Bronzed Flesh)

2x10 Reavers

1x5 Flesh Hounds

Axe and Icon Judgements
 

Spoiler

His list:

3xStonehorns (Frostlord w/Thermal Rider cloak and 2 Huskgards)

1x4 Mournfang

2x2 Mournfang

1x4 Sabretusks

A battalion that I'm not sure what it did.

Rolled for mission, got Relocation Orb Greased up Goblin.

I deploy front and center with the Reavers around the skull alter, priests behind that. Deployed diagonally are the 4 Thristers and the  doggo's way out to the side to move should the objective go that way.  He is deployed all mournfangs up front with the Stonehorns behind and kitties front and center ready to push for the objective turn one.

He has less drops, gives me first turn. I get both judgements off, put them up front to block movement but be within 8" after movement to hopefully stay on the board going into turn 2. Reavers move up to screen priests and cap the objective. Only put two models in range to force him to come into my lines, Reavers are not going to hold out against the charge anyway so no point in over committing. Bloodthirsters push forward just a tad. Doggos run up and screen Skarbrand who is swinging around the far flank around terrain. I end my turn, 1 point.

He pushes up his mournfang and kitties, Stonehorn's hang back, neither one of us wanted to commit turn one. The 2 packs of 2 mournfang charge my Doggos the others fail their charge or don't charge. I activate with crown of command a 6" pile-in that all my Thirsters are in range of. He attacks, kills some Doggos, Skarbrand piles in, not super angry as it is turn one, I contemplate keeping him back to be angry next turn but wanted to push him back so went in. I manage to get carnage off with an 8 but only 1 other wound gets through, one Mournfang left on 1 wound. He then piles in with the other mournfang, kills off the rest of the Doggos. Insensate Rage BT is also just in 6", hops in, no explodie but 9 wounds on 2D6 damage. He gets the objective with kitties, scores 3 points.

The objective moves two places towards the Skarbrand combat, good for me. My axe goes away but the icon stays on the table. I win initiative and give him the turn. He wasn't in a position to capitalize on the double turn so now was the best time to give it away. Also, I want 3 points.

Everything of his moves up and commits. Charges, clears out my screens, hurts my WoK BT down to 5 wounds then I go full Tyrants of Blood on him. IR and Skarbrand kill one Stonehorn, WoK puts 7 wounds on another. By the end of the combat phase IR BT down to 7, Skarbrand only takes 1 and I loose a Slaughter Priest and all my Reavers. He scores 1 point by chasing the objective with the kitties and scores, total 4 points.

My go I cast the axe and move the icon, do a few mortal wounds a Stonehorn in the middle and kill 3 kitties. Bloodthirsters kill 1 Mournfang holding Skarbrand back with shooting so he can charge. All the Bloodthirsters then charge in and activate. I use Reapers CA to attack twice with the UF BT, but first WoK attacks, does a few wound, nothing big. Skarbrand kills the last of the 2x2 Mournfang clearing the flank and UF BT with two pile in's kills the Stonehorn. He kills my WoK , kitties flee to battleshock and I get the objective, 3 points, total 4 all now.

Objective moves further back in the flank, now far away and behind Skarbrand. He wins initiative and kind of needs it, so takes it.

His 4 pack of Mournfang and remaining Stonehorn charge in and kill my Priest and IR BT with impact hits, I'm outside of 6" with everything else so that ends that. No points, 4 all still.

I however am sitting on 8 blood tithe, summon a Bloodthirster because, well, why not. Skarbrand and UF BT charge in. Skarbrand goes ham with Carnage, rolls a 6, even halving the damage the Stonehorn couldn't handle 8 mortal wounds. He calls the game with 4 Mournfang left.

 

In retrospect, not like this is news, but Tyrants of Blood is nice. Also, Crown of Command on Unfettered Fury is nice.  Prior to this game I wasn't sure how the command points would shake out. By turns 2 and 3 I had the command points to attack twice where I didn't need them turn one, but the free per battle round 6" is very nice and helps keep things flexible. Stonehorns are annoying with the half damage, but ultimately are just too expensive.

Khorne feels very adaptable. The blood tithe system despite resetting when used seems very flexible to help us adapt to the flow of the game.  I am currently loving this book, very fun times. Oh and Blood for the Blood God!

[ledha]

6 hours ago, Smooth criminal said:

I'm interested in each dwarf artillery being 2 separate units. 2 cannons will give you 4 blood points, that's 10 letters, half a thirster or something moving/fighting. Also cannon itself is a nice target for dumping blood sacrifice mws.

I'll probably try it out at some point.

don't play ****** units to hope your ennemy will kill it so you'll have blood tithe points. 

Play good units instead. Making a summon-focused khorne list is a waste of time.

Plus why summon 10 bloodletters when you can make your skullreapers attack in the hero phase ?

Edited June 18, 2019 by ledha

[MortalRealmMike]

30 minutes ago, ledha said:

don't play ****** units to hope your ennemy will kill it so you'll have blood tithe points. 

Play good units instead. Making a summon-focused khorne list is a waste of time.

Plus why summon 10 bloodletters when you can make your skullreapers attack in the hero phase ?

Because sometimes you dont need to attack in the hero phase, and you need to summon bodies to take an opponent's backfield objective.  There is no putting someone down for picking one chart over the other.  Both are useful just depending on what the mission and situation requires.   In my last game I summoned a skull cannon and attacked in my opponent's herophase.

Edited June 18, 2019 by MortalRealmMike

[Lord Krungharr]

Anyone try TuskGor Chariots in a Brass Despoilers Khorne army?  I was looking at them, just because I have bits to make one, and they get 7 attacks of various sorts normally, plus 1 attack for all weapons on the charge, and if we can maintain Wrathmonger and Bloodsecrator range, that's 28 attacks per model on the charge....and a unit of 4 chariots is 240 points, 6 wounds each at 4+.   That seems pretty spicy to me.   Slaughterpriest could maybe jack that up a notch too.  I'd probably ally in a Bray Shaman for the extra 3" move too.

[medivouk]

7 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:

Anyone try TuskGor Chariots in a Brass Despoilers Khorne army?  I was looking at them, just because I have bits to make one, and they get 7 attacks of various sorts normally, plus 1 attack for all weapons on the charge, and if we can maintain Wrathmonger and Bloodsecrator range, that's 28 attacks per model on the charge....and a unit of 4 chariots is 240 points, 6 wounds each at 4+.   That seems pretty spicy to me.   Slaughterpriest could maybe jack that up a notch too.  I'd probably ally in a Bray Shaman for the extra 3" move too.

I have used 2 single chariots to threaten flanks in my brass despoilers list. They generally roam around looking for support models and artillery to murder or objectives to camp while my bullgors/ghorghon/reapers Prince and bestigor make a mess of my opponents army

[Darksteve]

8 hours ago, Lord Krungharr said:

Anyone try TuskGor Chariots in a Brass Despoilers Khorne army?  I was looking at them, just because I have bits to make one, and they get 7 attacks of various sorts normally, plus 1 attack for all weapons on the charge, and if we can maintain Wrathmonger and Bloodsecrator range, that's 28 attacks per model on the charge....and a unit of 4 chariots is 240 points, 6 wounds each at 4+.   That seems pretty spicy to me.   Slaughterpriest could maybe jack that up a notch too.  I'd probably ally in a Bray Shaman for the extra 3" move too.

How do you get 28? 7 base from three sources. +3 for charge, +3 for wrathmongers, +3 for bloodsectrator = 16 attacks per model if you can keep all those slowpokes up with your chariots.

[Lord Krungharr]

I must have been low on caffeine, my math suffers badly without it!  

But I think medivouk's roving lone chariot usage is a good one.  Probably hard to get 4 in a single unit to strike another single unit most of the time too.

 

[Roark]

Yeah, the Tuskgor Chariot is a great little roving unit. M10 and a little self-buffing from rerolling charges is awesome. I actually really like Centigors too. Compare them to any other 80 point unit (Warhounds lol). They're a bargain.

[Battlefury]

I am having issues using the BT of IR atm. It is such a gambling, he just does nothing and his 280 points feel totally wasted.
So therefore I was switching to 3 Khorgoraths instead of him, usinf the Skullfiend Slaughterhost to have them buffed. Should be more reliable.

Even though it was already saied, those radnom damage values really fu** up the game experience.
I was wondering why GW descided to use stuff like that and came to the conclusion, that they agve a lot of D3 & D6 damage values to models and units, that are and where not easy to balance.

Sounds just lazy imo.

[Sneeto]

1 hour ago, Battlefury said:

I am having issues using the BT of IR atm. It is such a gambling, he just does nothing and his 280 points feel totally wasted.
So therefore I was switching to 3 Khorgoraths instead of him, usinf the Skullfiend Slaughterhost to have them buffed. Should be more reliable.

Even though it was already saied, those radnom damage values really fu** up the game experience.
I was wondering why GW descided to use stuff like that and came to the conclusion, that they agve a lot of D3 & D6 damage values to models and units, that are and where not easy to balance.

Sounds just lazy imo.

Had the same issue, but I use him in a mortal list. Ended up dropping him for the 280, added Wrathmongers 10 reavers and a bloodstoker (only list was 1990)

[Zamik]

5 hours ago, Battlefury said:

I am having issues using the BT of IR atm. It is such a gambling, he just does nothing and his 280 points feel totally wasted.
So therefore I was switching to 3 Khorgoraths instead of him, usinf the Skullfiend Slaughterhost to have them buffed. Should be more reliable.

 

I'm eager to hear your experience subbing Khorgoraths for the BT, because there's a lot of potential. I mean, a 24-wound unit with the same 4+ save, but flinging 15 2-damage attacks--then add Skullfiend rerolls, bloodsecrator, Skulltake battalion so those 6s to wound are 3 damage apiece etc. Yes.