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AoS 2 - Gutbusters Discussion


Chris Tomlin

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Hi All! I just ordered my first batch of Ogors and I'm really excited to join the GutBuster family. I have some noob questions, and sorry if I am repeating things already on here.

-Can the Butcher take The Cleaver and Tenderiser with the Cauldron or does he have to take the Stump Blades?

-What is the correct size of the base for the Butcher with the Cauldron?

-I'm relatively new to AoS, could a more seasoned player explain some basic tacis on how to use Grot Screens and then charge our Heroes and Ironguts with 2 inch range? I wasn't entirely sure of that interaction.

Cheers!

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21 minutes ago, Warbossironteef said:

Hi All! I just ordered my first batch of Ogors and I'm really excited to join the GutBuster family. I have some noob questions, and sorry if I am repeating things already on here.

-Can the Butcher take The Cleaver and Tenderiser with the Cauldron or does he have to take the Stump Blades?

-What is the correct size of the base for the Butcher with the Cauldron?

-I'm relatively new to AoS, could a more seasoned player explain some basic tacis on how to use Grot Screens and then charge our Heroes and Ironguts with 2 inch range? I wasn't entirely sure of that interaction.

Cheers!

Greetings and welcome! 

  • According to the warscroll the Butcher can take one or the other. There is no mention of them having to take one set of weapons if they take the cauldron. 
  • According the official FAQ regarding base sizes (found here) the base size for the Butch w/ Cauldron is 105 x 70mm.
  • I'm not quite sure what you mean here. Typically screens are used as a "speed bump" to prevent enemy units from attacking high priority units in your army. As far as charging is concerned, in order to declare a charge your unit has to be outside of 3in of an enemy. Also remember that you cannot end a movement in the movement phase within 3in of an enemy unit. Once you are within 3in of an enemy, either by charging or by piling in, they are considered to be in combat with that unit. 

Edited by CaptainSoup
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1 hour ago, CaptainSoup said:

Greetings and welcome! 

  • According to the warscroll the Butcher can take one or the other. There is no mention of them having to take one set of weapons if they take the cauldron.

I always read the warscroll (at least on the app) as tenderiser OR stumps and cauldron.  I don’t think you can take tenderiser and cauldron, as it says “some butchers instead fight with a pair of stump blades... whilst dragging a cauldron ...”

Anyway, @Warbossironteef, welcome to the firepit of hope 😄 Pull up a pile of meat.

Edited by Baron Wastelands
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6 minutes ago, Baron Wastelands said:

I always read the warscroll (at least on the app) as tenderiser OR stumps and cauldron.  I don’t think you can take tenderiser and cauldron, as it says “some butchers instead fight with a pair of stump blades... whilst dragging a cauldron ...”

Ah I see. I read that incorrectly. You are correct then, my mistake. 

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3 hours ago, CaptainSoup said:

Greetings and welcome! 

  • According to the warscroll the Butcher can take one or the other. There is no mention of them having to take one set of weapons if they take the cauldron. 
  • According the official FAQ regarding base sizes (found here) the base size for the Butch w/ Cauldron is 105 x 70mm.
  • I'm not quite sure what you mean here. Typically screens are used as a "speed bump" to prevent enemy units from attacking high priority units in your army. As far as charging is concerned, in order to declare a charge your unit has to be outside of 3in of an enemy. Also remember that you cannot end a movement in the movement phase within 3in of an enemy unit. Once you are within 3in of an enemy, either by charging or by piling in, they are considered to be in combat with that unit. 

Thanks for the response. I was more asking for general tips on how to either absorb a charge with the Grots and then charge Ironguts with 2 inch range behind them?

I'm assuming you keep the grots in 1 unit rows so that the Ironguts can pile in and are within 2, but I wasn't sure if people had any general tips on how to deploy or move your grots to keep this option available. 

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23 minutes ago, Warbossironteef said:

Thanks for the response. I was more asking for general tips on how to either absorb a charge with the Grots and then charge Ironguts with 2 inch range behind them?

I'm assuming you keep the grots in 1 unit rows so that the Ironguts can pile in and are within 2, but I wasn't sure if people had any general tips on how to deploy or move your grots to keep this option available. 

I'm still trying to picture what situation your talking about, but I'll try my best lol. 

If you got a unit of grots in combat with something and your goal is to get your heroes and iron guts in combat as well, your best bet is to preemptively create an opening with the grots so your other units can charge into.  Even if the enemy charges first they most likely wouldn't purposely trap their own units into your grots so you should have room to get other units in. Also as long as the grots are not touching an enemy base they can move around during the pile in so long as they end up closer to the enemy by the end of the pile in. 

One thing you need to remember is in order to get a successful charge the unit charging needs to be within 1/2" of the enemy unit. With that rule it is impossible to successfully charge your unit behind another unit to get in combat with the enemy unit in front of them. 

I hope that helps. Sorry if I still don't quite understand your question!

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It is difficult but by no means  impossible. if the grots are 1 row deep and spaced .99" apart, especially if the enemy base is between them a little bit,  it should be quite possible to pile an irongut in to 0.5.  Remember you only need 1 such gap, the others can just get within 2". 

Edited by sorokyl
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3 hours ago, Warbossironteef said:

Thanks for the response. I was more asking for general tips on how to either absorb a charge with the Grots and then charge Ironguts with 2 inch range behind them?

I'm assuming you keep the grots in 1 unit rows so that the Ironguts can pile in and are within 2, but I wasn't sure if people had any general tips on how to deploy or move your grots to keep this option available. 

You probably shouldn't say "and then charge Ironguts.." - because you'd be looking to pile-in, not charge ;) Very important distinction, and one that probably lead to the confusion above. If you have a line/bubblewrap of grots tied up in combat in front of your Ogors/Ironguts/Leadbelchers, there's normally no opportunity for you to charge at all, because the grots would be in the way. Therefore you need to ensure that your Ironguts/Ogors are put in combat in other ways so that they're able to make use of their pile-in movement to maneuver into a good fighting position.

For that purpose, what you want to do is set up a small unit of grots (20) in front of, let's say Ironguts, and make sure that by charging your grots (finishing a charge move within 0,5 inches of the grots), they'd put themselves within 3 inches of your Ironguts standing right behind them. At that point you just need to make sure you activate the Ironguts -after- whatever unit they charged your grots with, so that your grots take casualties that allows you to open up the line and freely pile your Ironguts into ideal combat positioning as a response. 

Something like this;

1.

(Enemy) (Enemy) (Enemy) (Enemy)                      <---- Enemy charges your Grot line
(Grot) (Grot) (Grot) (Grot) (Grot)

(Irongut) (Irongut) (Irongut)

2.

(Enemy) (Enemy) (Enemy) (Enemy)                        <----- Enemy kills some of your Grots
(Grot)                                              (Grot)

(Irongut) (Irongut) (Irongut)

3.
(Enemy) (Enemy) (Enemy) (Enemy)   <---- (Ironguts pile into the open space to smash the enemy. More grots die to lost unit cohesion.)
(Grot) (Irongut) (Irongut) (Grot)

                        (Irongut)

 

Does that answer your question?

Edited by Mayple
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Been messing around with this list. Got three games in with it last couple days. Lost a nail biter to DoK and went 1-1 against Gnarlroot. Learning to handle predatory spells is a damn mini game on its own. Still on the fence with the pendulum. It’s got such a small range. Also learning to use the BSBs has been interesting. Don’t feel like I can move them because I need them to do work every round. But damn can they do some much needed ranged damage. Going back to MSU has been good I will admit. Hope to get a video out over the weekend.

6D803FBA-ABED-4523-B7A5-9A082C9F32E4.png

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37 minutes ago, Jetengine said:

So if MSU is the standard loadout to avoid battleshock shenanigans do you turn the 3 ogres into the full command ?

Well,there are 4 parts of ogors command. Technically there are no rules that you can't combine them (leader is also bellower) but I am not sure if everyone would be cool with that.  

 

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37 minutes ago, Jetengine said:

So if MSU is the standard loadout to avoid battleshock shenanigans do you turn the 3 ogres into the full command ?

There's no disadvantage, so yeah I do. But MSU is not really standard in my mind. 6 or 9 ogor units are amazing in my opinion. 

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Finally built my Gutgouger tyrant (pics to follow once he has some paint on him) and was wondering about kit for him. 

I know the consensus is Ghyrstrike+ might is right but I'm quite interested in trying 2 swigs of battle brew+wild fury for potential 5 attacks with the same 4+ proc for a turn which seems pretty wild but unreliable. Anyone had some fun times running this?

 

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22 hours ago, Jetengine said:

So if MSU is the standard loadout to avoid battleshock shenanigans do you turn the 3 ogres into the full command ?

With minimum units of Ogors, I take the Champion, Musician, and Tribal Banner with Lookout Grot. These guys are meant to be cannon fodder so giving them the damage prevention save against shooting is the most important to me. Also good to tie up shooting units with.

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15 hours ago, LemursInParadise said:

Hey, I'm very new to this, but I've noticed that no one runs gorgers in their lists. They seem like they could add a lot of flexibility, but maybe I am just a noob?

 

14 hours ago, amysrevenge said:

The 12" setup is pretty crippling.  Most other special deployment setups are 9".

They've won me a few games actually. The 12" setup just means you won't be using them to assassinate or alpha-strike, but your opponent is more likely to let their guard down since it is not an immediate threat, which allows for some sticky situations where the Gorger gets to run + charge onto a poorly defended backfield objective, or even tie up an artillery piece or ranged unit. For 60 points, you get a lot of value out of it - even if they allocate resources to kill it, they have to use firepower that should be spent on your frontline, or even send a unit the wrong way to deal with it. It also means your opponent can't just push his lines forward with the belief that his objectives will be safe, since you can just take them if that happens. Tactical flexibility.

Not as killy as deepstriking units like, for example Gutter Runners, but far from useless. Different tool, different job ;)

Edited by Mayple
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1 hour ago, Mayple said:

 

They've won me a few games actually. The 12" setup just means you won't be using them to assassinate or alpha-strike, but your opponent is more likely to let their guard down since it is not an immediate threat, which allows for some sticky situations where the Gorger gets to run + charge onto a poorly defended backfield objective, or even tie up an artillery piece or ranged unit. For 60 points, you get a lot of value out of it - even if they allocate resources to kill it, they have to use firepower that should be spent on your frontline, or even send a unit the wrong way to deal with it. It also means your opponent can't just push his lines forward with the belief that his objectives will be safe, since you can just take them if that happens. Tactical flexibility.

Not as killy as deepstriking units like, for example Gutter Runners, but far from useless. Different tool, different job ;)

Aha, that's great to hear! I had a "gut" feeling that they would be useful, just not the experience. How many would you recommend taking, since just one feels pretty flimsy at range?

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8 hours ago, Warbossironteef said:

Does anyone think that the new Grots will be an ally with Gutbusters? I saw they are combining Trogoths with Grots, and I believe Trogoths are currently a Gutbuster Ally.

Will have to wait and see bud. Everything is up in the air right now.

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