AoS 2 - Bonesplitterz Discussion

[broche]

4 hours ago, Die Gruenhaut said:

 Which commandtraits do i use to „double their damage

it's savage big boss  command ability, but you need to combine with a +1 to hit. Base he generate an extra attack on 6+ , so with the spell (brutal beast spirit) it's on a 5-6. So an extra 1/3 attack per CP. Spend 3  so each 5-6 generate 3 extra attack and there you go.

[Die Gruenhaut]

That sounds pretty amazing. Ill try it! 

I this somewhere written down that i can stack his CA?  Or do i just need 2-3 Savage Big bosses ?  Or can i just stack every CA? Unless it says „one time use“

 

 

[mcbrain]

It was not addressed in the faq, and doesn’t say on the scroll that it can only be used one time. So you can use several command points to give the same savage big boss’ command ability to the same unit multiple times. 

[broche]

however don,t take that for granted, next FAQ is january there is a odd that stacking might get limited for some command

 

[mcbrain]

28 minutes ago, broche said:

however don,t take that for granted, next FAQ is january there is a odd that stacking might get limited for some command

 

I’ve had confirmation from someone in the know that the FAQ will be released prior to 1 January. So, it’s a little sooner than we anticipated. 

[5kaven5lave]

So, I realise the answer to this question is probably ‘it depends’, but what’s the best way to build my 2 boxes each of Boys and Boarboys? Was thinking 10 of each type for the Boars? Cheers. 

[PlasticCraic]

On 11/25/2018 at 6:05 AM, 5kaven5lave said:

So, I realise the answer to this question is probably ‘it depends’, but what’s the best way to build my 2 boxes each of Boys and Boarboys? Was thinking 10 of each type for the Boars? Cheers. 

Generally the Maniaks are better, even at the points.  A unit of 10 Maniaks is a really solid Battleline choice.  You can buff it up and fling it forward, clearing off their chaff screens and generally causing havoc, while you develop the board and move into position.

I occasionally find use for basic Boarboys as the cheapest Battleline, but quite rarely.

You could always magnetize?  It's pretty easy with these guys. 

Edited November 25, 2018 by PlasticCraic

[broche]

21 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

You could always magnetize?  It's pretty easy with these guys. 

Maniak and Boarboys fill a different role. Maniak is more a core unit, Regular are more support. Boar are super cheap and great way to spend left over point. They fill the important role of mobility and late objective graber, and they are super cheap. 

It's the unit that gave me the most victory when things looked grim. Retreat and charge is one of the most powerfull ability in the game. 

Personnaly i find magnetazing tedious (tried once took me 3 hours to magnetize a griffin head and empire general so i abandonned lol). So what i do is i just glue the secondary weapon lightly. So if i decide for a tournament i need maniak i just removed the shield and will paint/glue the secondary hand weapon. 

When you play casual or local tournament count as are generally accepted anyway, so unless you play 4-5 major tournaement per year and change your army every time, i'm not sure magnetizing is that necessary

 

 

[5kaven5lave]

Thanks for the responses. I’ve decided to build 30 Arrowboys and get some Big Stabbas and Savage Orruks for the boys kit and building at least 10 Maniaks initially, will build the rest without left arms and play some practice games. 

Built my Rogue Idol, Wurrgog, Wardokk, Maniak Weirdnob and (Morka)Boss over the weekend so ready to get painting Destruction in the new year!! Gotta love all the finger glueing occurring when making resin models. 

[Mikeymajq]

Of the new gloomspite 'Monsters" does anything in particular stick out as a good ally?

I'm running lots of Morboys so I'm always looking for a good monster to send in. I'm terrible at seeing how good anything is on paper sadly

But the Dankhold Troggoth seem nice, quite tanky, maybe that's bad if I want a monster to die and buff my boys? Mangler squigs might be better off? 

[PlasticCraic]

@Mikeymajq surprisingly, the Dankhold doesn't have the Monster keyword.

Manglers are kickass.  I'd still consider the Colossal a better standalone Kamikaze unit thought (Mangler benefits a lot from the Commant Trait, and the Command Ability is better when there are multiple Squig units in range to benefit).  So as good as it is, I think it needs the Allegiance to be optimised.

You could take the basic Mangler with no character, but with the free summoning the Colossal works out slightly cheaper in points.

So I'd still be looking at the Colossal for a missile, or the Gargant if you just want a cheap Monster who will die quickly.

[Requizen]

Hey all, I was looking at Bonesplitterz as a possible new army but I'm not really sure how the army functions now that Kunnin Rukk is nerfed. Should it be hordes of boys pushed across the table? Should it be cheeky MSU units trying to get good value each? It doesn't seem like they're super good at weight of dice type combat in the way Skeletons are, or super durable blobs like Nurgle. How are you building them lately? 

[Skabnoze]

At this point in time I honestly am shelving my Bonesplitterz until they update their book.  They are a very early AoS faction and it seems that the game itself and modern army book design has shifted greatly since they made the Bonesplitterz battletome.

Personally, as an old Orcs & Goblins player with a fairly large Savage Orc army I never honestly cared for how the Bonesplitterz book came out.  It feels very much like an army that missed the mark of what GW wanted to do, but that had an accidental strong conbo (kunnin rukk) that carried it through for a long time.

 All of the fluff in that book describes an army with powerful wizards that lead a massive swarm of angry goons that want to beat the enemy down with sticks, rocks, or their bare hands.  The archers are not neglected in the fluff, but they are not nearly as prominent as the rest of the army.  But the warscroll s and units just don’t really function well as a combat horde army.  There are better forces for that and GW probably needs to rethink what they want the core playstyle theme for this army to be.

[amysrevenge]

I'm playing my Bonesplitters in a store slow-grow campaign.  I always tell my opponents:  "let me tell you this at the start -  no Rend, 1 damage - that's basically all it's going to be, and you'll make me sad if you keep making me repeat it".

[Requizen]

2 minutes ago, amysrevenge said:

I'm playing my Bonesplitters in a store slow-grow campaign.  I always tell my opponents:  "let me tell you this at the start -  no Rend, 1 damage - that's basically all it's going to be, and you'll make me sad if you keep making me repeat it".

Yeah, that's what I'm seeing overall. However, Big Stabbas are really interesting, especially in a Teef Rukk. 8 wounds with the squiggly saves for only 100 points isn't too bad, and with Hand of Gork to shove them up quickly, they can get up and mess things up quickly. 

The more I look at it, I feel like you really need to ally something in for punch. Luckily, they have some pretty good options with Troggoths, Rogue Idol, Loonboss on Mangler, Spiders, and even Brutes.

[amysrevenge]

I'm adding an Orruk Warboss on Wyvern at the next increment, so that I can roll even MORE no Rend, 1 damage attacks.  That will surely make the difference!

[svnvaldez]

I still think lists like this work just fine. You play for the objectives with board control. The boys die in droves so you have to be careful with positioning... really you should be trying to avoid combat as much as possible and dumping arrowzboys' shots in to soft targets your opponent has... prioritize killing there high model count scoring units and try to win the game that way.

Or you can build the list around Maniak boarboyz. Same principles... avoid most combats, kill soft scoring units, board control.

Allegiance: Bonesplitterz
Mortal Realm: Shyish

Leaders
Savage Big Boss (120)
- General
- Trait: Squirmy Warpaint 
- Artefact: The Ragged Cloak 
Maniak Weirdnob (120)
- Artefact: Ju-ju Wotnotz 
- Lore of the Savage Waaagh: Brutal Beast Spirits
Maniak Weirdnob (120)
- Lore of the Savage Waaagh: Hand of Gork or Mork
Loonboss on Mangler Squigs (300)
- Allies

Battleline
30 x Savage Orruks (300)
- Stikkas
30 x Savage Orruk Arrowboys (420)
30 x Savage Orruk Arrowboys (420)

Battalions
Kunnin' Rukk (200)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 300 / 400
Wounds: 210

[Davros]

The biggest problem with bonesplitters imo is the fact that they have so little access to rend. That coupled with the fact that their infantry is less effective than gitmob grots.

Just a look at the base stats of mor boys and savage orruks and compare them to grots.

Savage orruks are just as durrable but with half the attacks, and those attacks aren't too different.

Morboys have the same number of attacks, but are much harder to get all the attacks in range and are still more expensive.

And gitmob have easy access to rend as well.

 

Bonesplitterz have a few more tricks up their sleave but i fail to see why they have no access to rend outside of big stabbas.

[Davros]

Double post

Edited January 18, 2019 by Davros

[PlasticCraic]

Agreed with the points on this post, the army generally does not function very well as a combat army.  Most units have a low volume of terrible attacks on large bases.

I think the idea was that multiple pile ins would make up for the low damage output, but it's an expensive way to get nowhere fast, because the core stats are that bad.

That being said:

- Big Stabbas are indeed excellent

- The Boarboy Maniaks can put out some hurt on units with bad armour saves. Use their high movement to pick your fights wisely while you develop the table

- Keep an eye out for Ian Spink's UK Masters list.  He is extremely experienced and successful at running melee focussed Boneplitterz, starring a Teef Rukk

Kunnin Rukk is still very strong (even post-nerf), and I believe it matches up well against top armies in the Meta (you can one-shot Nagash and a Cauldron).

The problem is that it is utterly soul-destroying to play.

Something I'd like to see in an update: Casting on doubles can never be unbound, in addition to the other bonuses it confers.  Would need tight wording for its interaction with Auto unbind artefacts / abilities, but that should be achievable. 

Really between that and a points drop on Big Stabbas, you could see a them becoming a viable melee 'n' magic army (with some shooting support), which I think is what they are meant to be.

That being said, I'm also up for a completely new book!  Just don't think that's gonna happen any time soon.

[PlasticCraic]

@Requizen I wouldn't put anyone off collecting them, I've played them off and on since launch and I'm still winning games and enjoying the army. 

As mentioned above they have some excellent Allies to pick from which helps keeps things fresh.  

TBH I would netlist Ian Spinks's Masters list as a starting point, he always uses exciting builds and has proven you can do well with them.

[PlasticCraic]

This is @Kanamorf's Masters list, which I hope he doesn't mind me repeating here.

Also to be found in the pdf on the main Masters thread on here.

You could pump up the Big Stabbas further if you prefer, to get more juice out of the Batallion, but the Fellwater Troggoths are certainly hard hitting and bring plenty of rend:

Maniak Weirdnob - General - Squirmy Warpaint
- Mystic Waaagh! Paint - Squiggly Curse
Wardokk - Hand of Gork or Mork
Wardokk - Brutal Beast Spirits
Wardokk - Big Wurrgog Mask - Bone Krusha
2 x 10 Savage Boarboy Maniaks
30 Savage Orruk Morboys
4 Savage Big Stabbas
2 Savage Big Stabbas
2 x 3 Fellwater Troggoths
Teef Rukk
Total: 2000 - Command Points: 1

[svnvaldez]

 

4 minutes ago, PlasticCraic said:

This is @Kanamorf's Masters list



This is just a casual game vs gloomspite but you can  get a feel for how Ian deploys and positions with his list.

 

[bonzai]

23 hours ago, Requizen said:

Hey all, I was looking at Bonesplitterz as a possible new army but I'm not really sure how the army functions now that Kunnin Rukk is nerfed. Should it be hordes of boys pushed across the table? Should it be cheeky MSU units trying to get good value each? It doesn't seem like they're super good at weight of dice type combat in the way Skeletons are, or super durable blobs like Nurgle. How are you building them lately? 

Bonesplitterz still have a few strengths working for them. 

1. Great points to wound efficiency! You can flood the board in cheap wounds. Add in that you always get a save, and every model is multi wound, and you have an army that can be really hard for some armies to chew through. Especially in bricks of 30.

2. Best casting in the destruction faction! We have 3 different caster options, a really great spell lore, and several means of boosting casting and unbinding.  Maybe the gobbo's will give us a run for our money, but we can contend with all but the very best of casting factions (Tzeentch, legion of sacroment, etc. .). This is important as aside from big stabbas we lack rend and high damage attacks.

3. Great battalion options! We are one of the easiest armies to make one drop, so try and take advantage of it. Some of them are down right powerful.

4. Great Allies. We have a huge and diverse range of options that add versatility.

That said, we have glaring weaknesses as well. Big stabbas are our only real source of rend and high damage. After the arrow boy nerf, we don't have any real point efficient damage dealers. Our cheap wounds tend to have half the models, and therefore less attacks than other armies.So while we tend to be more durable, we have less offensive volume per point. The book has synergies and options to help boost their output (usually with extra actions), but they don't come cheap. Lastly, there are certain armies like daughters of khaine that can simply chew through as many wounds as we care to feed to them. We have very little defensive options other than throwing  more boys at the problem.

This is the list I use, though I haven't gamed all that much this edition due to work constraints.

Heroes

Wurrgog w/ squirmy warpaint, gryph feather charm, brutal beast spirits 
Wardokk w/ hand of gork, big wurrgog mask 
Wardokk w/squiggly curse 
Wardokk w/ bonekrusha 
Wardokk w/ gorkamorka warcry, mystic waaagh paint 

Battleline 
30 moreboys 
30 moreboys 
5 boarboys 

Allies
Rogue Idol 

Battalions
Kopp Rukk 
Drakkfoot 

Total: 1980

2 drops, 3 artifacts, 3 starting command points. 5 casters all with some sort of mortal wound output. I can get +3 to cast from the Kopp Ruk and idol, plus any additional bonuses from the weird dance results. I can split off 2 wardokks per moreboys blob to give them both the full kopp ruk bonuses. The idol gives a lot of boosts, takes the place of big stabbas in this list, and worst case will boost the moreboys if he dies. With the wurrgog and Drakkfoot bonus spell I get up to 2 extra pile ins a turn. The wurrgog is very durable as with the gryph feather, look out sir, and his mask he is pretty much always a -2 to hit. The boar boys are mainly for fast objective gathering and harrassment of artillery and such. 

This list tries to take advantage of the armies strengths that I outlined. It has it's issues though. It has a lot of points tied up in battalions so it doesn't have as many bodies as it would like. Armies like daughters of khaine can cut through 120 6+ save wounds in no time flat, so its an uphill battle. Similarly Disciples of Tzeentch are one of the few armies that can out gun this list casting wise, which shuts down all its ranged and most of its mortal wound output. 

Hope this helps!

Edited January 18, 2019 by bonzai

[Mogwai Man]

I just started my first army and it's bonesplitterz. I have a few questions.

Is there a preference between Morboys & Orruks? Boarboys & Maniaks? 

Are Big Stabbas worth putting together? Wish GW would package the big stabbas separately.

Edited January 18, 2019 by Mogwai Man