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AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion


Chris Tomlin
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Quick question guys. So with the new FAQ rules that non ward saves now stack with ward saves... Does this mean that Ardboys in Big Waaagh! are now going back to getting two 6++ after saves? (One for the shield + one for the BW ability)

Edited by Jabbuk
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Hmm... time to dust off all those brute units again. Im curious whether the new book will allow for a solid foot slogging list. I'd love to field 2-3 Footbosses with 5-6  min-sized squads of brutes, just for the spectacle of it. I think there was an old battalion warscroll for something simmilar in a white dwarf a while back. Love the aesthetic of the newer Ironjawz models, and love to get more use from the footbosses. 

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47 minutes ago, Jabbuk said:

Quick question guys. So with the new FAQ rules that non ward saves now stack with ward saves... Does this mean that Ardboys in Big Waaagh! are now going back to getting two 6++ after saves? (One for the shield + one for the BW ability)

Until they FAQ the FAQ, rules as written says yes you can stack “allocate when a wound is taken” abilities. I only say faq the faq because there was a Twitter post the day it came out that sounded like they may be looking into it. Furthermore on the subject, if the updated rogue idol warscroll is any glimpse into the future they will probably be rewording all the allocate after a wound wordings to be wards. We won’t really know until we see the first battle tomes though. 

Personally, we have a few people in our meta who insist that it was intended so when I play them I guess I’ll be using it, most other people in the area see how GW has been avoiding stacking abilities throughout 3.0 and are erring on the side of it being patched/reworded. 

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5 hours ago, Scurvydog said:

Option 2 is the hackas and 3 is the gore choppa. Basically both got 1 better rend than before. Standard 2 choppas is the same. Due to the coherency rules the hackas are far superior. If Ard boys do not get rend 2 on anything, that for sure brings the Brutes forward with a clear purpose to smash heavy armor.

By that you mean makes Ardboys expensive objective holders ;) 

Really need to see what other rules are on there, seems like the dual choppa could be in line for one of the classic dual wield abilities.

EDIT:

1 hour ago, Lanoss said:

Soooooo Gordrakk has 20 wounds (18 for MBMK) and a 4+ now…?

Attacks got a bit better too

Gotta love how the megaboss STILL only has -1 rend. It's just blows my mind, here's hoping the riptooth puts him back to a 3+ save because if it's at a 4+ with no ward save then those 3 extra wounds are functionally meaningless...

Fists should be -3 rend, the glaive made -2 to match the brutes and the choppa+riptooth left at -1 but improves his save to 3+ (not +1 to save).

That way the cabbage would have realistic rend and a choice between offence and defence.

Edited by Malakree
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29 minutes ago, PlayerJ said:

Same as the brutes,  a "leaked" assembly instructions 

I just saw them, I will try to wait until seing the whole battletome before drama, but for the moment I am not liking the 4+ save.

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9 hours ago, Malakree said:

It's both the special and the 2" ranged weapon. Holy gods those 2" range brutes are unbelievably good now. 

EDIT: Also you aren't supposed to post leaks on this forum.

Ya. It turns out it is both. I posted my thought before seeing the photo and then edited in the photo.

If it is a leak I will delete the post. We have all seen it by now anyways. It is not like its a blurred photo of the Battletome that is not yet released.

Cheers mates!

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12 minutes ago, Bolty said:

Exactly a dead MawKrusha, even with extra atttacks does not perform ...

The save can be increased with all out defense, mystic shield, ironclad(if it stays), etc. To basically ignore rend. Add on top amulet to have the ward for even more survival, and just for shoots and ladders heroic action and healing beat to get back wounds. 

Oh and ghur CA to always fight at top bracket

Edited by PlayerJ
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3 hours ago, PlayerJ said:

The save can be increased with all out defense, mystic shield, ironclad(if it stays), etc. To basically ignore rend. Add on top amulet to have the ward for even more survival, and just for shoots and ladders heroic action and healing beat to get back wounds. 

Oh and ghur CA to always fight at top bracket

There is an enormous difference between a 2+ unrendable with a 6++ and a 3+ unrendable, it's not a +3 wound difference either.

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9 hours ago, PlayerJ said:

The save can be increased with all out defense, mystic shield, ironclad(if it stays), etc. To basically ignore rend. Add on top amulet to have the ward for even more survival, and just for shoots and ladders heroic action and healing beat to get back wounds. 

Oh and ghur CA to always fight at top bracket

The whole point is that a 3+ can be increased to a 2+ a 4+ can only become a 3+, the difference here is before you would then only suffer dmg on 1/6 attacks, but with a 3+ cap that is 1/3, which is a massive difference in staying power and makes him go down much much easer to low rend units.

I think we might be looking at a meta that is either mortal wounds or massed attack spam, as it is easy to negate 1-2 rend anyway.

Also why, just why is Gordrakk so bad still, he sure needs some good special rules because a -1 to save will not get him chosen more often, but I guess it can not be less than the 0 times he is used already. And why does he only have 8 bravery, the dude basically sieged Excelsis alone, if anything he should be completely immune to any bravery related shenanigans.

Edited by Scurvydog
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Cant say i am thrilled with the 4+ MBoMK but this is still early days in 3.0 and might be the general trend for a lot of the factions as they get updated. Command traits or artefacts might be the answer i.e. ironclad changes save to 3+ rather than giving +1 to roll it currently does so mitigates 2 MBoMK running around being tanks (much like they reduced fist damage to 2 but let 1 have mean un' mount trait).

 The -2 rend on the regular brute 2" weapons feels obscene and either a misprint or due for a week 1 nerf. Which makes me sad because either they will go back in the box or I will have to find all the old sprues to rip off the dual wield weapons...

Gordrakk is probably still going to be bad because the design for him has always been universally poor. Artefacts/command traits will almost always let the regular boss out preform/survive him while being cheaper and his command traits have never been super amazing for the tier of model he is. Smasha and Kunnin need a significant rework imo and they need to find a place for him narratively and gaming wise. 

But like is said, early edition changes will hurt but as long a the other battle tomes arrive without the significant delays and follow the same design choices they will be fine in the long run. 

 

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37 minutes ago, Malakree said:

Annihilators

True enough - but i am suggesting a possible general trend for 3.0 which seems a little early to call given we dont even have the  the first 2 books.

Stormcast may well be the tough armour save book with a 3+ general and 2+ annihilators , but if other books with 3+ save monsters go to 4+ then it would still be a general swing. Of course there is always the big risk of an early design philosophy being hard pivoted in 6 months and we are stuck at the bottom of the pile as a new trend kicks in and everyone else keeps 3+ monsters and such. 

I am personally just trying to avoid feeling like we have gotten the shaft before the new edition is in full swing.

Just a pity that GW dont do better edition transitions in most cases, a new set of grand alliance books that updates everything for 3rd would have been preferable for me. 

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1 hour ago, Underworld40k said:

I am personally just trying to avoid feeling like we have gotten the shaft before the new edition is in full swing.

Welcome to the destruction forum. Where desperate optimism is the only reason anyone still plays the grand alliance.

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3 hours ago, Underworld40k said:

True enough - but i am suggesting a possible general trend for 3.0 which seems a little early to call given we dont even have the  the first 2 books.

Stormcast may well be the tough armour save book with a 3+ general and 2+ annihilators , but if other books with 3+ save monsters go to 4+ then it would still be a general swing. Of course there is always the big risk of an early design philosophy being hard pivoted in 6 months and we are stuck at the bottom of the pile as a new trend kicks in and everyone else keeps 3+ monsters and such. 

I am personally just trying to avoid feeling like we have gotten the shaft before the new edition is in full swing.

Just a pity that GW dont do better edition transitions in most cases, a new set of grand alliance books that updates everything for 3rd would have been preferable for me. 

A weak battletome at the beginning of an edition is a nightmare in GW games as the power creep is guaranteed and you won't be touched for another 3 years.

It's going to be drough if we are adjusted to be the new edition, potentially making us weaker than the existing 2.0 battletomes (from the look of it) and then simultaneously lose out to power creep in the following months. Just have to wait and see...

Edited by C0deb1ue
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