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Chris Tomlin

AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion

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15 hours ago, Kasper said:

So it can no longer be spammed. Small units is being discouraged since a unit of 5 boyz can't suddenly turn into a 10 man unit. Also can't recycle infinitely since the new unit isn't added to the batallion, but to the army instead.

I think "identical" would cover adding it to the battalion, no? I know the Destruction Firestorm allegiance had something similar and the "identical" part covered any traits/artefacts it had. 
Still... This is the worst possible edit. It's not even once per unit. I would have much rather had the GSG terrain rules but requiring a cp. If only Greenskinz returned, they'd have the best fit for Orruk summoning like the original second Ardfist. I still think it's useful, but definitely less engaging both to play and list build for (beyond like 1x30, 2x5 Ardboy lists and hoping you get really lucky on the 4+ roll for the 30 man unit). 

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17 minutes ago, Floom said:

I think "identical" would cover adding it to the battalion, no? I know the Destruction Firestorm allegiance had something similar and the "identical" part covered any traits/artefacts it had. 

I'm not familiar with the Firestorm thing, but it now specifically says you add it to your army, where as it said to the batallion before. I read that as you get an extra unit added to your army that you can set up, however it isn't part of the batallion, hence you can't recycle if the new unit dies.

I read "identical" as being the same size with the same equipment (irrelevant for Ardboyz) and same leadership troops etc. 

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2 minutes ago, Kasper said:

I'm not familiar with the Firestorm thing, but it now specifically says you add it to your army, where as it said to the batallion before. I read that as you get an extra unit added to your army that you can set up, however it isn't part of the batallion, hence you can't recycle if the new unit dies.

I read "identical" as being the same size with the same equipment (irrelevant for Ardboyz) and same leadership troops etc. 

Yeah, it definitely needs an faq. Below was Firestorm's. I'm not sure how it was officially ruled as far as battalions go, but I always read it as it replicating everything about the unit's state. I just know the official ruling was the traits/artefacts were included in the "identical" part of it. 
image.png.35368d8fb22200fbd4f28ce9e97890cc.png

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13 hours ago, Lanoss said:

All this wording does is ensure that the battalion is played the way it was intended. 
Yes. It’s on a 4+
Yes. It’s once per phase. 
Just means it was intended for units of 10-15 and potentially getting them back on any board edge mid game

It’s worse than the previous interpretation but the previous interpretation was left open for abuse and not the intention of the rule writers imo

Entirely correct. I have zero sympathy for anyone who was abusing the loophole beforehand.

Anyway, I had a good result at a two day five game event recently (2nd place, 4 major wins, 1 minor loss), using 25 Brutes and 0 Ardboys. If people are interested in a bit of a report (originally suggested by @Malakree) then I can type something up. Whilst I had some luck, I was pleased with my strats and overall play.

Cheers, Chris

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13 minutes ago, Chris Tomlin said:

Entirely correct. I have zero sympathy for anyone who was abusing the loophole beforehand.

@Lanoss as I've been saying on Twitter they actually left a loophole open with how they've done it 🙄

People aren't impressed with me for it buts still hilarious 😅

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2 hours ago, Chris Tomlin said:

Entirely correct. I have zero sympathy for anyone who was abusing the loophole beforehand.

Anyway, I had a good result at a two day five game event recently (2nd place, 4 major wins, 1 minor loss), using 25 Brutes and 0 Ardboys. If people are interested in a bit of a report (originally suggested by @Malakree) then I can type something up. Whilst I had some luck, I was pleased with my strats and overall play.

Cheers, Chris

Yes please, is always nice to share tournament experiences.

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5 hours ago, Chris Tomlin said:

Entirely correct. I have zero sympathy for anyone who was abusing the loophole beforehand.

Anyway, I had a good result at a two day five game event recently (2nd place, 4 major wins, 1 minor loss), using 25 Brutes and 0 Ardboys. If people are interested in a bit of a report (originally suggested by @Malakree) then I can type something up. Whilst I had some luck, I was pleased with my strats and overall play.

Cheers, Chris

What was the list out of curiosity?

I am in a bit of a conundrum as to whether I build more Orruk Ironjawz (purchased the new book and some Gore Gruntas) or double down on my Slaves to Darkness army now it is has been resurrected. TBH I am a little over the whole Chaos thing and I have really enjoyed the Ironjawz fluff and models to boot. However, the fact the army is so limited in units is a bit of a turn-off and even more so given the Megaboss on foot feels redundant with most commentators writing off Brutes in favor of Ardboyz or more Gore Gruntas.....I have always said that Brutes to me are the best looking models in Age of Sigmar but building a unit of 15+ isn't a cheap undertaking haha.

Edited by Gibs

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14 hours ago, Chris Tomlin said:

Entirely correct. I have zero sympathy for anyone who was abusing the loophole beforehand.

Anyway, I had a good result at a two day five game event recently (2nd place, 4 major wins, 1 minor loss), using 25 Brutes and 0 Ardboys. If people are interested in a bit of a report (originally suggested by @Malakree) then I can type something up. Whilst I had some luck, I was pleased with my strats and overall play.

Cheers, Chris

@Chris Tomlin definetly intersted for a report as I really dont like ardboz models (only own 20) and love brute but so far struggled to include them in my games effectively (they usually dont do much)

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22 hours ago, Malakree said:

The first CP is free remember because it comes with the Ardfist, so running it with blocks of 10 is more like

Mmmm to be honest I dont agree. The CP is free in absolute terms since you already pay it with the battalion cost but it still bears a cost of opportiunity. In other words by using in to bring back boyz you loose the opportiunity to use it for another action and you have to spend another). Thus this cost still burdens you.

Edited by Planar

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15 hours ago, Gibs said:

What was the list out of curiosity?

I am in a bit of a conundrum as to whether I build more Orruk Ironjawz (purchased the new book and some Gore Gruntas) or double down on my Slaves to Darkness army now it is has been resurrected. TBH I am a little over the whole Chaos thing and I have really enjoyed the Ironjawz fluff and models to boot. However, the fact the army is so limited in units is a bit of a turn-off and even more so given the Megaboss on foot feels redundant with most commentators writing off Brutes in favor of Ardboyz or more Gore Gruntas.....I have always said that Brutes to me are the best looking models in Age of Sigmar but building a unit of 15+ isn't a cheap undertaking haha.

Are you planning on participating in tournaments? If not, you shouldn't worry imo. The difference between Brutes and Ardboyz isn't THAT major that Brutes are flat out unplayable. Some tournament lists field a couple.

There have been multiple top 3s in bigger tournaments where the Maw Krusha wasn't picked in favor of the Megaboss on foot. 

I agree that the model range for Ironjawz is rather limited compared to Skaven having something like 20-30 warscrolls, but how often are you seeing all those warscrolls? If you look at competitive lists they don't field THAT many different units tbh, but obviously you do have the illusion of choice in those armies, where as you dont in Ironjawz. All of our warscrolls are good and worth their weight. Big Waagh seems to me to be the way forward, which opens up the Bonesplitterz collection too. I'll be honest and say that if you plan to be hardcore competitive, it likely wont change much for you - It'll largely just unlock their Wardokk, Wurrgog Prophet and MAYBE Arrowboyz.

 

But hey, I understand your struggle - I've been eyeballing an Archaon + Varanguard list for a while. :P Likely not competitive, but could be fun to whip him out for some beerhammer.

 

Edit: As a matter of fact, they will actually showcase Big Waagh vs Slaves to Darkness tonight on twitch.tv - Then you have a chance of seeing the two in action. From experience the match might be slightly biased towards to new army.

image.png.151f92bf67471e81b72b1222d4dea48b.png

Edited by Kasper
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On 12/18/2019 at 3:32 PM, Kasper said:

showcase Big Waagh vs Slaves to Darkness tonight on twitch

Anyone watch? Wasn't able to catch it, and interested in what happened. 

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3 minutes ago, Chase said:

Anyone watch? Wasn't able to catch it, and interested in what happened. 

It was, as predicted, pretty bad for BW and one sided. It felt like the dudes were just having fun showcasing STD and the BW player wasn't that serious about the game. :) 

From what I remember:

  • STD had Archaon, 3x3 Varanguard and a Gaunt Summoner on Disc.
  • BW had a Maw Krusha, Weirdnob Shaman, 2 Warchanters, 1 Wurrgog Prophet, 3 Gore Gruntas, 5 Brutes, 10 Ardboyz, Ironskull Boyz and big unit of Savage dudes. Might have missed something.

BW had first turn in battle round 1 and was quite offensive in the movement phase instead of turtling a bit to generate Waagh points. Meant he got charged by Varanguard. Archaon had used his CA to roll a dice and knew who goes first in turn 2 - He won that roll and STD got a double turn. More Varanguard charges and Archaon came into play. The Varanguard has a once per battle ability where they can pile in and attack again. This meant any unit they charged was dead in the same phase. At this point pretty much everything in BW was dead.

The Maw Krusha charged and almost killed Archaon alone (had like 4 wounds left) but the Slayer of Kings managed to score 2 sixes on the wound roll, resulting in an Ethereal Amulet Maw Krusha with full health instantly dying on the spot.

 

Tbh if he hadn't been so offensive and waited for his turn 2, plus Archaon didn't score 2 sixes on the wound roll, this would have been a completely different game. He also got pretty much tabled while sitting on 3 CPs instead of giving his units save/reroll 1s to hit in the fights without +1/+1.

But it was fun to watch nontheless - I was really surprised how much damage the Maw Krusha put into Archaon who is a 800 pts model. 3 Brutes with +1/+1 in round 2 with a WC buff really put some work into the Varanguard too. 

 

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Hello guys, I'm hesitating between 5 Brutes or 1 Fungoid + Arachnocauldron my for  last 140. I want to play this list for a tourney, what are your suggestions ?

And I cant decide between Aetherquartz Brooch or Great Green vision...

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Ironsunz

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (460)
- General
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
- Trait: Right Fist of Dakkbad
- Artefact: Sunzblessed Armour
- Mount Trait: Weird 'Un
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Get 'Em Beat
Orruk Warchanter (110)
- Warbeat: Fixin' Beat
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (110)
- Artefact: Great Green Visions
- Lore of the Weird: Da Great Big Green Hand of Gork

Battleline
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (320)
- Jagged Gore-hackas
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
5 x Orruk Brutes (140)
- Pair of Brute Choppas

Battalions
Ironfist (160)

Endless Spells / Terrain / CPs
Extra Command Point (50)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 138
 

Edited by Arkahn

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3 hours ago, Arkahn said:

Hello guys, I'm hesitating between 5 Brutes or 1 Fungoid + Arachnocauldron my for  last 140. I want to play this list for a tourney, what are your suggestions ?

And I cant decide between Aetherquartz Brooch or Great Green vision...

 

Personally I would go with Aetherquarz, Fungoid and Scuttletide.

You have a very hard hitting army with crazy movement and good board control.

You get one more spell/dispel, a great area denial tool and a CP engine with the Shaman+Spell combo for a very reasonable price. This adds so much as it feeds the engine of your army (CPs are never enough) and covers some of your weaknesses.

5 Brutes would just mean getting a little more of something you already have access to, but this time without optimal points/gain ratio.

 

I think this can be the strongest and most versatile Ironjawz List with a Maw Krusha. 

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@Malakree Have you been practicing your double Shaman list? I'm really curious on your thoughts on it and its performance. I like the sound of a more magic heavy list rather than go all out on the combat phase. I don't have an extra Shaman or the Balewind, so can't really test it myself. :)

With armies like ORB or even Fyreslayers, I really think banking on maximum combat is gonna result in failure. We need a way to snipe support heroes from a distance.

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13 hours ago, Kasper said:

@Malakree Have you been practicing your double Shaman list? I'm really curious on your thoughts on it and its performance. I like the sound of a more magic heavy list rather than go all out on the combat phase. I don't have an extra Shaman or the Balewind, so can't really test it myself. :)

With armies like ORB or even Fyreslayers, I really think banking on maximum combat is gonna result in failure. We need a way to snipe support heroes from a distance.

I think Big Waaagh is another answer. We have the option to add 30 arrowboys, which is pretty damn potent at sniping targets, even moreso monsters. I'm looking more and more into going into Big Waaagh actually.

Edited by Jabbuk

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25 minutes ago, Jabbuk said:

I think Big Waaagh is another answer. We have the option to add 30 arrowboys, which is pretty damn potent at sniping targets, even moreso monsters. I'm looking more and more into going into Big Waaagh actually.

Their attack profile just seems really weak. I havent tried them.

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34 minutes ago, Kasper said:

Their attack profile just seems really weak. I havent tried them.

Their attack profile seems basic on paper but in a Big Waaagh list you will have BS casters like the Wurghog and Wardokk, etc. And they can make these guys truly powerful.

Would like to take this opportunity to plug @PlasticCraic blog which covers BW extensively. I really loved some of his list ideas, one of them includes arrowboys.

Here's the link: https://plasticcraic.blog/2019/11/11/battletome-orruk-warclans-big-waaagh-review/

Edited by Jabbuk
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5 hours ago, Jabbuk said:

Their attack profile seems basic on paper but in a Big Waaagh list you will have BS casters like the Wurghog and Wardokk, etc. And they can make these guys truly powerful.

Also worth noting how strong the +2 to cast can be really strong on weirdnob shamans. There's a massive difference between CV8 and CV6.

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On 12/21/2019 at 4:28 PM, Kasper said:

Their attack profile just seems really weak. I havent tried them.

Their profile is fairly weak on an individual shot basis. Its more about the volume of ranged attacks they can put out combined with something like the Maniak Weirdnob giving them exploding sixes with his warscroll spell.

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7 hours ago, Tizianolol said:

Guys is there a competitive list that play both gotrak and maw crusha?:) 

Define competitive...

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1 hour ago, Tizianolol said:

I mean tournament lists! :)

Well I mean I took this list to Bloodshed in the Shires and went 3-2 with it.

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Ironsunz

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (460)
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
Gordrakk the Fist of Gork (540)
Orruk Warchanter (110)

Battleline
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (160)
- Pig-iron Choppas
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (160)
- Pig-iron Choppas
10 x Orruk Ardboys (180)
5 x Orruk Brutes (140)
- Pair of Brute Choppas

Units
5 x Orruk Ardboys (90)

Battalions
Ironfist (160)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 112

Though I'd probably swap to something like this if I were to do it again.

Quote

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Ironsunz

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (460)
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
Gordrakk the Fist of Gork (540)
Orruk Warchanter (110)
Orruk Warchanter (110)

Battleline
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (320)
- Pig-iron Choppas
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (160)
- Pig-iron Choppas
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (160)
- Pig-iron Choppas

Battalions
Gorefist (130)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 103

Lean on the alphastrike and immense first turn mobility combined with the Ironsunz -1 to hit in the first round.

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I like the second one more too, 2nd warchanter seems very important for IJ. Have you tryed to put into a foot megaboss? It seems very good on paper and you got one artifact more for the battalion :)

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