AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion

[Kasper]

14 hours ago, jjb070707 said:

Outdropping the opponent is one of the most critical ways a melee skewed list like ironjawz, or specifically bloodtoofs performs well. Controlling initiative forces the opponent to deploy disadvantageously or lose to a full charge/pin which you can then take advantage of.  

I'd recommend you revisit that game (play it out on TTS or on your own table or in your head) going first vs second, and try things like 4 giants, or Archaon vs the bloodtoofs the same way. You'll find many matchups that you REALLY want to dictate turn order  

Yeah I already have. Playing with 10 drops is sometimes OK because you can keep throwing garbo on the table and they have zero clue if you intend to go aggressive or not. Against a lot of top armies I find it difficult though, especially shooting armies where the threat of a double is really massive. 

I just find it difficult to create a proper 1 drop list - First off you are forced to having "just" 2 Warchanters - I generally like to bring 3. Second you have a cap of 5 troop units and with ours being so cheap, the 4 reinforcement limit is actually a big burden. 

You made me think some more about this though and I have come up with this list below, which I actually kinda like. 

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Ironsunz
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)*
- General
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Command Trait: Hulking Brute
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)
- Mount Trait: Smelly 'Un
Orruk Warchanter (115)*
- Warbeat: Get 'Em Beat
Orruk Warchanter (115)*
- Warbeat: Fixin' Beat

Battleline
5 x Orruk Brutes (160)*
- Jagged Gore-hackas
10 x Orruk Brutes (320)*
- Jagged Gore-hackas
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Ardboys (170)*
- Reinforced x 1

Units
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)*
- Jagged Gore-hackas
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)*
- Jagged Gore-hackas
- Reinforced x 1

Core Battalions
*Battle Regiment

Total: 1960 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 155
Drops: 1

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by Kasper

[jjb070707]

2 hours ago, Kasper said:

Yeah I already have. Playing with 10 drops is sometimes OK because you can keep throwing garbo on the table and they have zero clue if you intend to go aggressive or not. Against a lot of top armies I find it difficult though.

But yeah it would be amazing to be able to dictate the first turn - I just find it really difficult to make a 1 drop list, and the majority of the nasty stuff out there is 1 drop so even having a 2 drop list feels a bit.. I dont know, I guess its OK.

Battle regiment allows for us to field 1 MK and up to 2 Warchanters. I would really have liked a third, so already a bit pressed here. I also find that reinforcement points is severely limiting what we can field. 

Like this list below I would be OK to run, but that's 5 reinforced units and we can only reinforce 4.. So what do you switch around? The easy solution would be to split a unit but you are limited to up to 5 troops in a battle regiment.

You could swap 10 Ardboyz for another 3 Pigs and be at 1930 I guess. Ultimately it feels like you kinda have to run a Rogue Idol to fit everything into battle regiment. 

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
Orruk Warchanter (115)
Orruk Warchanter (115)

Battleline
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Ardboys (170)
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Ardboys (170)
- Reinforced x 1

Total: 1950 / 2000

 

Hmm.. I guess I dont hate the list below? Could run it as Ironsunz. 2x6 Pigs is a pretty nasty turn 1 charge, both buffed with Warchanter. You got bodies. Almost certain of getting the wound triumph when you need to chop something. 

  Reveal hidden contents

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
Orruk Warchanter (115)
Orruk Warchanter (115)

Battleline
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Ardboys (170)
- Reinforced x 1
5 x Orruk Brutes (160)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
10 x Orruk Brutes (320)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
- Reinforced x 1

Total: 1960 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 155
Drops: 8

 

I've found the trick isn't shooting for 1 drop so much as three. Three is the "magic" number for a few reasons. Armies needing a second artifact and running warlord+1drop hit 4 drops often, Giants hit 4 drops often, and many dual behemoth style lists are wanting a warlord. So if I can justify not taking a second artifact, I'd target 3 drops. Most of the things that scare me drop in 4s, at least so far. I would only go to a one drop against high elves at the moment, as giving them 1 fewer shooting phase is really important for our warchanters, and therefore our overall power. If I knew it was an elf heavy meta, I'd almost certainly play 1 krusha to stay as a 1 drop at the expense of other matchups, but I don't believe we are crippled with 1 krusha lists.

In your list I'd comfortably drop that as a 2 (double regiment) to facilitate 2 krushas and 3 chanters if you like and split my pigs how I please or regiment + hunters of the heartlands (for 3 drops) to make two 6 man pigs ignore the monster shout, since they are ideal monster hunters with mortals on the charge and rend 2 on the big sticks. And 2 pig units can comfortably operate a "pincer" style maneuver with simultaneous charges. This is even more effective with ironjawz as the special rule to allow back to back attacks favors this multi charge style even more so than other armies. 

I simply would avoid 5 , 6, or 10 drop lists as much as possible, since most of the really nasty lists I've seen or built or worked with folks on have all been building around warlord or command entourage for artifact or trait stacking.

[Kasper]

4 minutes ago, jjb070707 said:

I've found the trick isn't shooting for 1 drop so much as three. Three is the "magic" number for a few reasons. Armies needing a second artifact and running warlord+1drop hit 4 drops often, Giants hit 4 drops often, and many dual behemoth style lists are wanting a warlord. So if I can justify not taking a second artifact, I'd target 3 drops. Most of the things that scare me drop in 4s, at least so far. I would only go to a one drop against high elves at the moment, as giving them 1 fewer shooting phase is really important for our warchanters, and therefore our overall power. If I knew it was an elf heavy meta, I'd almost certainly play 1 krusha to stay as a 1 drop at the expense of other matchups, but I don't believe we are crippled with 1 krusha lists.

In your list I'd comfortably drop that as a 2 (double regiment) to facilitate 2 krushas and 3 chanters if you like and split my pigs how I please or regiment + hunters of the heartlands (for 3 drops) to make two 6 man pigs ignore the monster shout, since they are ideal monster hunters with mortals on the charge and rend 2 on the big sticks. And 2 pig units can comfortably operate a "pincer" style maneuver with simultaneous charges. This is even more effective with ironjawz as the special rule to allow back to back attacks favors this multi charge style even more so than other armies. 

I simply would avoid 5 , 6, or 10 drop lists as much as possible, since most of the really nasty lists I've seen or built or worked with folks on have all been building around warlord or command entourage for artifact or trait stacking.

I was editing my post and list as you were typing 😋 I have found Hunters to not be all that meaningful. On paper it looks great to stick Pigs in it, but honestly I have had very few situations where it mattered at all. Most of the really dominating/strong lists atm dont feature monsters, or if they do they are not combat monsters or simply dont matter - Like both Archaon or Morathi is gonna shred your Hunters unit no matter what. I think Stonehorns is about the only matchup where I really value Hunters.

Its not entirely about being afraid of the current 1 drop lists, its just as much to put pressure on your opponent. I dont think many lists can stand being doubled by Ironjawz so it will certainly change up their play. With them always giving you turn 1, they know it will never happen and can play accordingly. 

Like both Tz Archaon or DoK will sweat from the thought of you removing their screens in turn 1 then cleaning the board on the double. 

I checked my most recent tournament and actually a lot of lists were 1-2 drop. 

[jjb070707]

20 minutes ago, Kasper said:

I was editing my post and list as you were typing 😋 I have found Hunters to not be all that meaningful. On paper it looks great to stick Pigs in it, but honestly I have had very few situations where it mattered at all. Most of the really dominating/strong lists atm dont feature monsters, or if they do they are not combat monsters or simply dont matter - Like both Archaon or Morathi is gonna shred your Hunters unit no matter what. I think Stonehorns is about the only matchup where I really value Hunters.

Its not entirely about being afraid of the current 1 drop lists, its just as much to put pressure on your opponent. I dont think many lists can stand being doubled by Ironjawz so it will certainly change up their play. With them always giving you turn 1, they know it will never happen and can play accordingly. 

Like both Tz Archaon or DoK will sweat from the thought of you removing their screens in turn 1 then cleaning the board on the double. 

I checked my most recent tournament and actually a lot of lists were 1-2 drop. 

I'd theorize that since pigs got an extra rend, hunters may be more valuable as roar is more detrimental versus targets with high value attacks as compared to past results. With the ability to issue all out attack to 3 units with clever placement, 2x6 pigs hitting a monster (the two arrows formation can comfortably fit onto most monster bases) or whatever was on the sides of the main block and a krusha hitting the screen/anvil/aggressive piece in the center). 

I agree with you however, that 1 drop is really tough for ironjawz from a hero and unit perspective. I just am not sure if I would rather double regiment or regiment and hunters yet. As long as I stay under four, like I mentioned, I think that offers the best chance of success. It may be possible to fit in a 1 drop with brutes over ardboyz as well, just from a point sink perspective as well. 

3x6 pigs 

krusha - spell book

chanter 

10 brutes

5 boyz 

comes to 1900, but I don't think it is worth running unless one keeps losing to 1 drops.

endless spell of choice

or 10 brutes, 5 brutes (replacing the boyz) instead of a spell at 1975

Your 2 drop double regiment idea is probably the strongest build. This could be powerful but perhaps "boring" (boaring?)

2 krusha

3 chanter

5 boyz

1x6 pigs

2x3 pigs

for 1990

both krushas and the 6 pigs are the initial hit/pin 

5 boyz sit at home

2x3 pigs take midfield objectives

2 drops, and can therefore control initiative against the field of 2s 50% of the time. Deployment is pretty standard so shouldn't care too much about having to drop the first half before seeing their deployment, you'll stick a fast krusha in the first half and the other krusha and pigs get to respond to "something" dropping.

Edited November 9, 2021 by jjb070707

[Planar]

Hello people,

So how your boyz fare against the big angry snake lady? Generally we are in a  great position nowadays but I feel this particular matchup is a bit tricky.

A good friend of mine is trying different Morathi + bowsnakes lists while preparing for a tournament. I had given him headaches with my IDK list but when I switched to Ironjawz every game is an uphill battle for me. I have managed to win only once in 4 games and even then the feeling was that it was due to grave mistakes and (very) bad rolls from his side rather than proactive decision making and good army operation from my side. (he also did not play Hag Nar that time intentionally handicapping himself). 

Main problem seems to be that I cannon reliably chip the 3 wounds per round from Morathi without exchanging too many points in return. One cabbage for 3 wounds is not an acceptable tit for tat and this is usually what happens. Ignoring her also does not work (she can easily go after the cabbages with her flying 14" movement and our huge bases do not help)

My friend can caste really well building around the two morathi's as twin towers using some cheap screens and deploying 15 bowsnakes at 6in from the screen + 10 spear snakes for counter charges. It works wonders.

I play 2 cabbages + 3 warchanters + teleport weirdnob and a mix of gruntas and brutes (ironsunz). Last game I tossed the brutes for extra gruntas and bloodtoofs which worked much better. 

Interested to read your thoughts and the solutions you have come up against this matchup

Ta

 

[Gitzdee]

Does anybody know how many swords are included in the gore gruntas kit? I dont really like the axes or spears i always see on them. the GW store sprue only shows 1. Thanks!

Edited November 10, 2021 by Iksdee

[Kasper]

1 hour ago, Iksdee said:

Does anybody know how many swords are included in the gore gruntas kit? I dont really like the axes or spears i always see on them. the GW store sprue only shows 1. Thanks!

If you have any Brutes those arms slot right into the Pigs.

[broche]

On 11/9/2021 at 5:39 AM, Kasper said:

I just find it difficult to create a proper 1 drop list - First off you are forced to having "just" 2 Warchanters - I generally like to bring 3. Second you have a cap of 5 troop units and with ours being so cheap, the 4 reinforcement limit is actually a big burden. 

An option is to bring a monster. Rogue Idol, mangler squig or aleguzzler giant can take optionnal monster spot (rogue Idol is the most expensive but arguably the best choice)

[NauticalSoup]

On 10/26/2021 at 2:31 PM, Malakree said:

Personally I'd look at something more like this.

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Ironsunz
- Grand Strategy:
- Triumphs:

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)
- General
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
- Command Trait: Skilled Leader
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)
- Mount Trait: Smelly 'Un
Orruk Warchanter (115)
Orruk Warchanter (115)
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Lore of the Weird: Da Great Big Green Hand of Gork
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (95)
- Allies

Battleline
10 x Orruk Brutes (320)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Brutes (320)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Ardboys (170)
- Reinforced x 1
5 x Orruk Ardboys (85)

Units
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Hunters of the Heartlands
***Hunters of the Heartlands

Total: 2000 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Allies: 95 / 400
Wounds: 154
Drops: 9
 

Dropping the 2nd MK allows you to put in other big threats. The unit of 6 ggs gives you devastating alpha potential and ironically not being battleline denies the broken ranks battle tactic.

You then get 2 big units of brutes, both a 5 and 10 ardboy unit which allows for a defensive and offensive objective unit.

Someone may have pointed it out already but don't think you can take Hunters twice. The GHB battalions state right at the you can only include them once each.

[Kasper]

17 hours ago, broche said:

An option is to bring a monster. Rogue Idol, mangler squig or aleguzzler giant can take optionnal monster spot (rogue Idol is the most expensive but arguably the best choice)

I like the idea but both the Mangler and the Gargant is kinda ****** honestly. Rogue Idol is an interesting choice and one I have thought a lot about. Rogue Idol "almost" has the same survivability of a MK due to his 5+ ward and damage last time I checked. The only letdown is lack of flying and lack of hero actions/tripple commands, but it is a way to convert a 2 MK list into a 1 drop list. 

I got a game in with my 1 drop Ironsunz list with 1 MK, 2x WC, 5 Brutes, 10 Brutes, 10 Ardboyz and 2x6 Pigs. It was against a SBGL player with loads of bodies like 2x20 zombies, 30 skellies and 2x20 graveguard. Not sure if the list was optimized tbh but I won pretty big considering I also played like ******, like I failed 2 battle tactics but was up 10 VPs by the end of turn 4 in Savage Gains. Was too busy messing around/bants. 10 Brutes really put a dent in things and it was probably a perfect matchup to deny him objectives. He got the spell from the coven throne off against my MK twice which meant he was barely fighting in that game.  

Giving him turn 1 and constantly being in the driver seat was super refreshing and it felt good to be "in control" of the priority. Gonna give the list some more play for sure. 

[whispersofblood]

On 11/10/2021 at 3:30 AM, Planar said:

Hello people,

So how your boyz fare against the big angry snake lady? Generally we are in a  great position nowadays but I feel this particular matchup is a bit tricky.

A good friend of mine is trying different Morathi + bowsnakes lists while preparing for a tournament. I had given him headaches with my IDK list but when I switched to Ironjawz every game is an uphill battle for me. I have managed to win only once in 4 games and even then the feeling was that it was due to grave mistakes and (very) bad rolls from his side rather than proactive decision making and good army operation from my side. (he also did not play Hag Nar that time intentionally handicapping himself). 

Main problem seems to be that I cannon reliably chip the 3 wounds per round from Morathi without exchanging too many points in return. One cabbage for 3 wounds is not an acceptable tit for tat and this is usually what happens. Ignoring her also does not work (she can easily go after the cabbages with her flying 14" movement and our huge bases do not help)

My friend can caste really well building around the two morathi's as twin towers using some cheap screens and deploying 15 bowsnakes at 6in from the screen + 10 spear snakes for counter charges. It works wonders.

I play 2 cabbages + 3 warchanters + teleport weirdnob and a mix of gruntas and brutes (ironsunz). Last game I tossed the brutes for extra gruntas and bloodtoofs which worked much better. 

Interested to read your thoughts and the solutions you have come up against this matchup

Ta

 

My friends and I were discussing this very thing last night. We came to the conclusion that unless the battleplan requires it, it might be best to just not try and kill her at all.

Reasons being she hardly degrades, her chart is very kind. It's not necessarily easy to even do the 3 dmg in your own turn key alone in the opponent's turn. So if you opponent is paying attention you probably won't kill her until ture 4/5 anyway.

Given the difficulty the cost might be higher than the gains. Next match try just delaying her or ignore her where possible and see how that goes. 

[Heaven_lord]

Hi,

I would like to start Ironjaws with New AoS. Do you think I can build a competitive list with those models ?

- 1 Megaboss on Maw-Krusha

- 1 Megaboss

- 2 Warchanter

- 1 Weirdnob Shaman

- 1 Wurrgog Prophet

- 20 Orruk Ardboys

- 15 Orruk Brutes

- 6 Orruk Gore-Gruntas

Thanks a lot !

 

 

 

 

 

[NauticalSoup]

You can do almost any ironjawz list with those models. Probably go brute/ardboy heavy with da choppas or take the gore gruntas and maw krusha and do ironsunz. The wurrgog is unfortunately only usable if you do big waagh, but he's a staple there.

[Heaven_lord]

2 hours ago, NauticalSoup said:

You can do almost any ironjawz list with those models. Probably go brute/ardboy heavy with da choppas or take the gore gruntas and maw krusha and do ironsunz. The wurrgog is unfortunately only usable if you do big waagh, but he's a staple there.

Thank you ! Does this liste works also for 2000 points ?

[Planar]

5 hours ago, NauticalSoup said:

You can do almost any ironjawz list with those models. Probably go brute/ardboy heavy with da choppas or take the gore gruntas and maw krusha and do ironsunz. The wurrgog is unfortunately only usable if you do big waagh, but he's a staple there.

Wurrgog is perfectly usuable. He might not be the most efficient choice point-wise because he cannot choose spells from the Bonesplitters' lore when in an ironjawz army but for anything other than competitive tournament games he is perfectly fine. His warscroll spell is very good and he can always cast mystic shield and arcane bolt.

This is a fun list you got there. Go for it, see, what you like and work from there

Edited November 15, 2021 by Planar

[Kasper]

45 minutes ago, Planar said:

Wurrgog is perfectly usuable. He might not be the most efficient choice point-wise because he cannot choose spells from the Bonesplitters' lore when in an ironjawz army but for anything other than competitive tournament games he is perfectly fine. His warscroll spell is very good and he can always cast mystic shield and arcane bolt.

This is a fun list you got there. Go for it, see, what you like and work from there

You can not field Bonesplitterz/Kruleboyz units in an Ironjawz army. The only ally is Gitz.

[Planar]

4 hours ago, Kasper said:

You can not field Bonesplitterz/Kruleboyz units in an Ironjawz army. The only ally is Gitz.

WTF, you are right. It was so obvious (in my head) that you can field them as allies (bloody warscrolls are in the same book...), that never bothered to check this. Thanks for it pointing out  

[Boggler]

Guess what?

There are a whole bunch of lists that can go 4-1 or 5-0. Ironjawz are in a real good place.

Most of my battle reports tried to focus on Battle Tactics. These are what will get you those max points needed to win your games. While there are a few different scoring systems out there, the 35pt on used at Da Boyz is one to look at.

Do you have a plan to score a Battle Tactic on every turn? Prevent your opponent from doing the same?

Here is a 5-0 list from Da Boys - Sorry for the formatting, the new app should be banned. MBMK, 3 Chanters, 21 GG's

Spoiler

Army Name: Unnamed Army 1
Army Faction: Orruk Warclans
Army Type: Ironjawz
Subfaction: Bloodtoofs
Battlepack: Pitched Battles
Points Limit: 2000 pts
Grand Strategies: Hold the Line
Triumphs: Inspired

Core Battalions
Battle Regiment
Orruk Warchanter
Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
Battlefield Role: Leader
Points Cost: 115 pts
Orruk Gore-gruntas
Battalion Slot Filled: Troops
Battlefield Role: Battleline
Reinforced: Once
Points Cost: 300 pts
Orruk Gore-gruntas
Battalion Slot Filled: Troops
Battlefield Role: Battleline
Reinforced: Once
Points Cost: 300 pts
Orruk Warchanter
Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
Battlefield Role: Leader
Points Cost: 115 pts
Megaboss on Maw-krusha (General)
Battalion Slot Filled: Commander
Battlefield Role: Behemoth, Leader
Enhancements
Command Traits: Hulking Brute
Artefacts of Power: Amulet of Destiny
Mount Traits: Mean ’Un
Points Cost: 480 pts
Battle Regiment
Orruk Warchanter
Battalion Slot Filled: Commander
Battlefield Role: Leader
Points Cost: 115 pts
Orruk Gore-gruntas
Battalion Slot Filled: Troops
Battlefield Role: Battleline
Reinforced: Once
Points Cost: 300 pts
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (Ally)
Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
Battlefield Role: Leader
Points Cost: 95 pts
Orruk Gore-gruntas
Battalion Slot Filled: Troops
Battlefield Role: Battleline
Points Cost: 150 pts

Total Points: 1970 pts

and here are a few 4-1 lists:

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Bloodtoofs
- Mortal Realm: Ghur
- Grand Strategy: Waaagh!
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (90)*
- General
- Command Trait: Master of Magic
- Lore of the Weird: Da Great Big Green Hand of Gork
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)*
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)
- Mount Trait: Smelly 'Un
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)**
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Artefact: Destroyer
- Mount Trait: Fast 'Un
Orruk Warchanter (115)*
- Warbeat: Get 'Em Beat
Orruk Warchanter (115)**
- Warbeat: Fixin' Beat
Madcap Shaman (80)**
- Allies

Battleline
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)***
- Jagged Gore-hackas
- Reinforced x 1
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)***
- Pig-iron Choppas
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)*
- Pig-iron Choppas

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Command Entourage - Magnificent
***Hunters of the Heartlands

Additional Enhancements
Artefact
Mount Trait

Total: 1960 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 80 / 400
Wounds: 118
Drops: 9

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Bloodtoofs
- Grand Strategy: Beast Master
- Triumphs: Inspired

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)*
- General
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Command Trait: Mega Bossy
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
- Lore of the Weird: Bash 'Em Ladz
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)*
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)
- Mount Trait: Fast 'Un
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (90)*
- Lore of the Weird: Da Great Big Green Hand of Gork
Orruk Warchanter (115)*
- Warbeat: Fixin' Beat
Orruk Warchanter (115)*
- Warbeat: Get 'Em Beat

Battleline
10 x Orruk Brutes (320)**
- Jagged Gore-hackas
- 2x Gore Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)**
- Jagged Gore-hackas
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)**
- Jagged Gore-hackas

Units
4 x Ironskull's Boyz (80)*

Core Battalions
*Warlord
**Hunters of the Heartlands

Additional Enhancements
Artefact

Total: 1980 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 1 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 122
Drops: 9

Spoiler

Player Name: Ross Hisert
List Name: Adaladz and Isaladz iron fists
Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Bloodtoofs
- Mortal Realm: Ghur
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs: Inspired
LEADERS
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)*
- General
- Command Trait: Mega Bossy
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny
Orruk Warchanter (115)*
- Warbeat: Fixin' Beat
Orruk Warchanter (115)**
- Warbeat: Killa Beat
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)**
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
- Artefact: Arcane Tome
- Mount Trait: Mean 'Un
- Universal Spell Lore: Flaming Weapon
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (90)**
- Lore of the Weird: Da Great Big Green Hand of Gork
UNITS
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)*
- Jagged Gore-hackas
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)*
- Jagged Gore-hackas
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)*
- Jagged Gore-hackas
5 x Orruk Ardboys (85)*
- 1 x Gorkamorka Banner Bearers
- 1 x Gorkamorka Glyph Bearers
5 x Orruk Brutes (160)*
- Jagged Gore-hackas
- 1 x Gore Choppas
CORE BATTALIONS
*Battle Regiment
**Command Entourage - Magnificent
ADDITIONAL ENHANCEMENTS
Artefact
TOTAL: 1975/2000 WOUNDS: 124
LEADERS: 5/6 BATTLELINES: 5 (3+) BEHEMOTHS: 2/4 ARTILLERY: 0/4
ARTEFACTS: 2/1 ENDLESS SPELLS & INVOCATIONS: 0/3 ALLIES: 0/400
REINFORCED UNITS: 0/4 DROPS: 4

MBMK with Amulet of Destiny anyone? We might as well be writing 1520 pt lists...

If you want to win an event. Go 5-0 or 4-1? Do you want max scores every turn? Do you have a plan to deal with:

30 Sentinels

50 Pink Horrors

Lumineth/Goading/3 Windspirits blocking your MD

Seraphon/Thunder Lizards

Archaon 

Nagash with 40 Mortek or 20 Blood Knights

[Tezia99]

This weekend I went to a 2 day tournament and wanted to share my games with you guys! I had originally wanted to bring a double cabbage list but I haven't practiced enough with it so opted for something I was a little more comfortable with. Also, I really wanted to play with my brutes. Quick synopsis and I'll go into the weeds. Day 1 I played BoC, Slaanesh, and Lumineth. I ended the first day 3-0 and in 2nd. Day 2 I played SoB and FeC and ended the tournament in 8th as I'll explain in the breakdowns. I had a ton of fun playing the list. 

MK General: Amulet, Hulking brute, and Mean un. (warlord)

Megaboss on Foot: Arcane tome: Bash 'em Ladz (Warlord)

2 Warchanters: Get 'em/Fix 'em (Warlord)

10 Ardboyz (warlord)

2x10 Brute: Hackas (Hunters)

2x5 Brute: Choppas (Ironjawz Fist)

Spoiler

Game 1 vs BoC: Misson: The Vice

TO selected The Vice because for that first round match ups are pretty random. The Vice rewards the players who are thinking ahead to turn 4/5 and helps to seperate out the pack a little. The BoC list was pretty meme level and my opponent was a super awesome guy. Belekor, bray shaman, some ungors, Cygor, and 11 cockatrice. His spacing was pretty good with cockatrice but by turn 3 I had gotten myself into a position where on 4 I'd have control of the center and then be able to push  into all of them. The 2 5 man units held the center, ardboys held a flank to keep things from summoning in on me, both 10 man units, the Krusha, and the footboss charged into 11 cockatrice and the bray shaman general. Waaaagh was called and not much remained. I had the pile ins orientated so that 3 brutes were each on a cockatrice and swept them away. The MK killed his bray shaman and another cockatrice, leaving the cygor and belekor to kind of wait for the inevitable. Final score was 27-22 as we both still managed to get secondaries out.

Game 2 vs Slaanesh: Tectonic Interference

I've never played Slaanesh but am semi aware of what they are capable of. It was a sort of alpha strike list with Sigvald, 20 marauders, 2 chaos chariots, Glutos, Synessa, infernal enrapturess, 3x5 hellstriders. Round 1 he took first turn and put sigvald, and 2 marauders on my flank with a teleport ability. Chariots moved up and hellstriders took the center and my left objective. Sigvald, marauders, and 1 chariot made their charge. Sigvald went right into my footboss due to not fully bubble wrapping, Marauders went into both the 5 man and 10 man unit of brutes. I tend to use the brutes as a block of 15 with the 5 mans being the "screen" to protect the hackas. After his turn Sigvald stood alone and a chariot was pretty wounded by the 10 ardboyz. On my turn i finished Siggy off, kept the chariot locked with the ardboyz. Plowed the MK, and 10 brutes into Glutos and the other chariot, slowly marching up the board. After that I won the double turn, finished Glutos off with a stomp and then got to move D6 and stomp again also killing his Enrapturess. Unfortunately I was now entangled with a unit of hellstriders so could not again. By round 3 I was in control of the board and he was able to summon in a keeper that unfortunately did not spend a lot of time on the board but did manage to finish off a unit of brutes. Final score 36-15.

Round 3 vs Lumineth: Feral Foray

Once again, another army I've never faced. Teclis, Cathaller, 20 sentinals, 20/10 wardens, 3 dawnstrider. This was such an intense game. A friend had given me the advice that if I saw the opportunity to end the Cathaller and destroy the terrain to do so.  Luck be it that my opponent used the terrain as a flank protection with the Cathaller garrisoned inside. 20 wardens screened the sentinels, striders screened the sentinels, others screened Teclis on the right flank. This was the most annoying army to play against. Round 1: He went first, shooting 8 wounds off of the Krusha, and hunkering down on objectives in his castle. The MK had the can't do anything spell on him, double CP usage, and negative bravery. I MD'd with 2 of my CPs and moved a 10 and 5 man brute squad up the board, MK was not allowed to move. Movement phase, MK was able to move but not within charge. The 10 man took a 3D6 charge into the wall. Unleash hell on the Brutes was not terrible losing 3 to 9 mortals. The 5 man unit made a box car charge to get in as well. The  5 Brutes cleared the horsies, and the 10 man unit was then able to pile in to the wardens and most importantly get the sentinels within 3". 11 dead wardens later and the Cathaller goes to make me -11 bravery but FAILS! Round 2: I win the double!! MK is all healed up, still under the stupid can't move spell though. I figure I've gotta do something big here and need a bravery roll fail on this move thing. Spend both CPs to MD and get to move! Movement don't get to move, but that's okay I'm in charge range. Just need his stop me from charging roll to fail and it does! MK is in business. I crash into the Cathaller, Terrain, and sentinels. Kill the Cathaller, terrain, and all but 5 sentinels due to dice being dice. The brutes couldn't get into the rest of the sentinels since they were all tied up with the remaining 9 wardens he autopassed before. His turn they teleported away and there was much crying. Teclis double moved to the other side of the board. In the following rounds it was a bunch of movement games, I had his 2 objectives and he had 2 of mine, while i still controlled one. By round 5 it came down to me burning his final objective and 1 brute plus the MK beating his 3 dawnstriders on my back objective and denying him the burn that would have tied us. Score: 24-23.

DAY 2:

I went into Day 2 as "the list to beat" I've always performed poorly on day 2 and was paired up against SoB Breaker tribe.

Round 4 vs Sons: Savage Gains 

To say that the objectives really mattered in this game would be hilarious. It's Destruction vs. Destruction. We didn't see it lasting longer than 3 rounds. His breaker tribe, was 3 Gatebreakers and 2 mini guys. He had the +1 hit vs 1-4 save non hero/monster ability. I knew I was going to be alpha'd very well. I bubble wrapped up as much I could and deployed back except to toe in for points round 1. I was elected to go first, 5 man unit of brutes and the ardboyz toed in. Turn complete. His turn saw all three giants in my face. Redeploy brought the units back into the bubble which honestly was a mistake. They would have been better speed bumps. His first swing decimated a 10 man unit and the other 5 man unit protecting the flank. But he was deep in. The MK and brutes did some work on my combat. One gargant took 24 wounds(with a 6+ward) the warlord took 4. I needed the priority and he rolled a 6! I was devastated until I rolled a 6 as well! Took my turn. With those brute units now gone there was space to work with.  One mega on my left flank, one directly in front of me and a mini giant stuffed in there somewhere. Warlord had 11 wounds taken, Best day ever, and amulet. This was it, the Waaaagh was called I needed to kill 2 Megas and a mini giant to win this. He still had a full health mega held back and a wounded mini giant tied up with ardboyz. MK roars the wounded giant. I needed it dead to start the bashing. Fists into it, weapons into mini guy. Both topple over and die, killing 2 brutes each. Brutes up next  8 fully buffed brutes, 2/2/-3/2 dmg on 6, 1 choppa, 1 boss. After saves and amulet I did........30 wounds leaving his warlord with 1 wound. I have never seen so many 5s and 6s rolled in my life. I cried, he turned around, popped Feral roar and smeared the remaining 8 brutes and 5 man unit on him. His turn, fresh mega gargant smacks MK and dies. Footboss kills Warlord and i'm left with Footboss + 2 ardboyz, 2 warchanters to try and finish off a Mega. It does not happen in turn 3 I am dead. This game came down to killing the warlord. I needed the 1 damage I would have gotten from the 2 Giants I killed landing on Brutes and killing 2 of them.

 

Round 5 vs. FeC: Power in Numbers.

2 Terrorgheists lots of ghouls, buffs, alpha strike. Got alpha'd took it like a champ, even stopped a broken ranks from happening by redeploying ardboyz in front of the unit he wanted to kill. Piled stuff in but MK couldn't find space. Wounded both gheists, my turn, got some space, Charged the MK, had a "wobbly model" spot.  Looked like this Arboys left flank, foot next to them Terrorgheist into footboss, RUINS, MK wobbly on ruins, Terrorgheist, Brutes to the right of gheist. I had placed the model towards the back of the table but where i placed it was still touching the gheist. I was trying to determine my Battle Tactic, since i won the double and now had the MK in . But i didn't realize because i had the model moved that my MK was actually in combat with both gheists. So slay the warlord, started with Krusha for the kill and boy did i kill it. Then moved to footboss because i was like yea, now brutes are free for next turn and gheist is tied up. Opponent said gheist into your MK and i'm like huh? he's over here. and that was when he pointed out that no he's here, remember wobbly model....so yea I should have killed first gheist with brutes, then 2nd with krusha but I made a key mistake and I just conceded after that. The board was gonna be flooded with ghouls and me with no real threats anymore. Killing my MK in my turn was just such a bad mistake on my behalf and definitely something I learned from.

If I had to change things up I'd want to try Loud 'un mount trait, I wasn't seeing a ton of heartlands in my meta, being able to stop everything around the MK from using CAs would be great! esp. since he was constantly tied up with multiple units.

 

Edited November 16, 2021 by Tezia99
Can't figure out spoiler command, le sigh

[Icetea]

On 11/10/2021 at 7:30 PM, Planar said:

Hello people,

So how your boyz fare against the big angry snake lady? Generally we are in a  great position nowadays but I feel this particular matchup is a bit tricky.

A good friend of mine is trying different Morathi + bowsnakes lists while preparing for a tournament. I had given him headaches with my IDK list but when I switched to Ironjawz every game is an uphill battle for me. I have managed to win only once in 4 games and even then the feeling was that it was due to grave mistakes and (very) bad rolls from his side rather than proactive decision making and good army operation from my side. (he also did not play Hag Nar that time intentionally handicapping himself). 

Main problem seems to be that I cannon reliably chip the 3 wounds per round from Morathi without exchanging too many points in return. One cabbage for 3 wounds is not an acceptable tit for tat and this is usually what happens. Ignoring her also does not work (she can easily go after the cabbages with her flying 14" movement and our huge bases do not help)

My friend can caste really well building around the two morathi's as twin towers using some cheap screens and deploying 15 bowsnakes at 6in from the screen + 10 spear snakes for counter charges. It works wonders.

I play 2 cabbages + 3 warchanters + teleport weirdnob and a mix of gruntas and brutes (ironsunz). Last game I tossed the brutes for extra gruntas and bloodtoofs which worked much better. 

Interested to read your thoughts and the solutions you have come up against this matchup

Ta

 

I’m also stuck in this. Anyone have any advice? Tried ignoring. Does. Not. Work. 

[Heaven_lord]

Hi !

Thanks for your help regarding my list !

I have two quick questions :

- Are the brutes good even with choppas ?

- Are 3 warchanters too much ?

 

Thank you !

[whispersofblood]

20 hours ago, Icetea said:

I’m also stuck in this. Anyone have any advice? Tried ignoring. Does. Not. Work. 

The best advice is to play like you are still playing IDK. Something about playing Orruks makes people play like they are described in the fluff lol.

You need to build in tools to take advantage of in game. So things like geminids, as IJ are the only faction with a hero phase move that can get you the range to turn 1 prevent CMD abilities being issues or recived.

The combo is: Touched by the Waagh=> Mighty Destroyers=> Geminids of Ul-Gysh

If you are high drop you should be able to deploy the things you don't want shot turn 1 within 24".

The last thing is to give your opponent multiple options. Take up multiple positions and give yourself options to change your target. Don't move to create for sure charges (getting as close as possible to one target), try and give yourself some flexibility. So that if they destroy a unit you had intended to charge with a different unit or a combination of units can charge together and achieve the same goal. 

[Kasper]

On 11/21/2021 at 8:10 PM, whispersofblood said:

The best advice is to play like you are still playing IDK. Something about playing Orruks makes people play like they are described in the fluff lol.

You need to build in tools to take advantage of in game. So things like geminids, as IJ are the only faction with a hero phase move that can get you the range to turn 1 prevent CMD abilities being issues or recived.

The combo is: Touched by the Waagh=> Mighty Destroyers=> Geminids of Ul-Gysh

If you are high drop you should be able to deploy the things you don't want shot turn 1 within 24".

The last thing is to give your opponent multiple options. Take up multiple positions and give yourself options to change your target. Don't move to create for sure charges (getting as close as possible to one target), try and give yourself some flexibility. So that if they destroy a unit you had intended to charge with a different unit or a combination of units can charge together and achieve the same goal. 

This sounds like a great idea if you are tailoring your list towards a specific matchup, but for an all-comers list there is no way I would pick Touched by the Waagh on my MK. You need that Amulet in basically every other matchup and even against Bowsnakes having no ward save is rough. 

 

[whispersofblood]

Meh, I've been using similar models in a quarter back role for the whole edition with artefacts to improve that role generally. I'm sure most people would be more comfortable with the ward, but I prefer strength of role than just improving survivability. And, since it appears that ward+charge has been failing a rethink may be on the cards.

Especially in a 2 cabbage build, but I think support Mawcrusher and gruntas/brutes is probably better than distraction Mawcrusher overall.

[Malakree]

So after several more games I've come to the following conclusions.

 

Ardboys

They work really well in 5s (duh) and the 15s are solid but require way to much babysitting from your warchanter. Its so easy to end up outside of the bubble and/or get tied down. While significantly better than in 10s the new bravery stat, and fact it has to come from the boss, makes them incredibly command point intensive in an army which always needs more as it is.

Warchanters

2 just isn't enough, you always need more of the buffs and if even one dies your damage tanks. Brutes/ggs are so much worse without the buffs.