AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion

[r0olz]

1 hour ago, Malakree said:

@Gothmaug @Jabbuk@Smash @Lanoss

To quote the Rulebook

It literally says no.

So by that logic, the Marshcrawler Sloggoth Troggoth can't be in a Kruelboyz army, only Big Waaagh because it doesn't have the Kruelboyz Keyword!

[ShaneHobbes]

Sorry if this was already talked about but..

If I'm reading the Megaboss warscroll right if you have two megabosses, one with Megabossy CT, you can have up to six units receive mighty destroyers in one hero phase for 2 CP?

[PlayerJ]

1 minute ago, ShaneHobbes said:

Sorry if this was already talked about but..

If I'm reading the Megaboss warscroll right if you have two megabosses, one with Megabossy CT, you can have up to six units receive mighty destroyers in one hero phase for 2 CP?

Yup

[PlayerJ]

1 minute ago, r0olz said:

So by that logic, the Marshcrawler Sloggoth Troggoth can't be in a Kruelboyz army, only Big Waaagh because it doesn't have the Kruelboyz Keyword!

RAW, yes

[r0olz]

3 minutes ago, PlayerJ said:

RAW, yes

I thought the +1 to hit "friendly" aura on it was a mistake, but thinking about the key words now it seems intentional I think? If it can only be in Big Waaagh, they wrote it's warscroll to reflect that and not get locked into a faction. 

I hope this is the case, that would be really cool. You might lose some allegiance abilities for taking Big Waaghh but the unit combos provide incentives. 

[Gothmaug]

Ahh good, I'm glad there's some clarification out there on faction building inside orruk warclans. The books haven't landed here in the USA yet, so I appreciate the info from those who have already seen them. 

Looks like my Ironjawz army is about to become a Big Waaagh. Sad though, I really wanted some additional Ironjawz units to play with, and hoped we'd get them with this release. Someday perhaps my Megaboss on Grunta will appear. 

Either that, or hopefully soon we'll get an article in White Dwarf that allows us to build custom orruk warclans heroes. Doesnt help the tournament scene much, but it would go over well in our local scene. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Malakree]

26 minutes ago, r0olz said:

So by that logic, the Marshcrawler Sloggoth Troggoth can't be in a Kruelboyz army, only Big Waaagh because it doesn't have the Kruelboyz Keyword!

Just checked, actually correct. I suspect it'll be errata'd real quick but atm you can't run it in a Kruleboyz army.

[r0olz]

9 minutes ago, Malakree said:

Just checked, actually correct. I suspect it'll be errata'd real quick but atm you can't run it in a Kruleboyz army.

I am not entirely sure it will. It doesn't have any Orruks on it, only Grots and a Troggoth. The Hobgrot Slittaz have the Hobgrot keyword but not the Grot key word, cause they aren't Grots and in the lore fight with the kruelboyz. I am starting to think this Sloggoth is specifically there as is, like the last of the Gitmob Grots, literally, riding around on a Troggoth, which is why they can only be in Big Waagh. Lore wise it makes sense. They have no leader or allegiance, and since there isn't an Orruk riding the thing bossing them around, they only join the Big Waaghs when the energy is pumping, hence "friendly" and boy do I hope this stays. It makes sense thematically. 

[Vastianos]

19 minutes ago, r0olz said:

I am not entirely sure it will. It doesn't have any Orruks on it, only Grots and a Troggoth. The Hobgrot Slittaz have the Hobgrot keyword but not the Grot key word, cause they aren't Grots and in the lore fight with the kruelboyz. I am starting to think this Sloggoth is specifically there as is, like the last of the Gitmob Grots, literally, riding around on a Troggoth, which is why they can only be in Big Waagh. Lore wise it makes sense. They have no leader or allegiance, and since there isn't an Orruk riding the thing bossing them around, they only join the Big Waaghs when the energy is pumping, hence "friendly" and boy do I hope this stays. It makes sense thematically. 

I think this is supported by the fact in the new AoS app, when you attempt to make a kruelboyz list you can't take the marshcrawler, but in big waagh list you can.

[Maogrim]

2 hours ago, Vastianos said:

I think this is supported by the fact in the new AoS app, when you attempt to make a kruelboyz list you can't take the marshcrawler, but in big waagh list you can.

That's probably because the app uses keywords as reference points for availability in list building. Henceforth if the keywords are screwed, list building is screwed.

It is called Marshcrawla, which ties it to Kruleboyz' habitat and the aesthetic of all the weapons, chains and little details on the model also clearly(!) matches the Kruleboyz'.

I'm very certain that this must be an oversight and will be corrected soon.

[Malakree]

4 hours ago, r0olz said:

I am not entirely sure it will. It doesn't have any Orruks on it, only Grots and a Troggoth. The Hobgrot Slittaz have the Hobgrot keyword but not the Grot key word, cause they aren't Grots and in the lore fight with the kruelboyz. I am starting to think this Sloggoth is specifically there as is, like the last of the Gitmob Grots, literally, riding around on a Troggoth, which is why they can only be in Big Waagh. Lore wise it makes sense. They have no leader or allegiance, and since there isn't an Orruk riding the thing bossing them around, they only join the Big Waaghs when the energy is pumping, hence "friendly" and boy do I hope this stays. It makes sense thematically. 

It doesn't need the orruk keyword, just the Kruleboyz keyword. Same way hobgrots aren't orruks but have the Kruleboyz keyword. It just means they won't benifit from the venom weapons.

[AaronWilson]

16 hours ago, Gothmaug said:

So you don't need to list Kruelboys, Ironjawz or Bonesplitters as allies because they are part of the same Faction. So you can include them in any of your armies, in any combination.  

Let me caveat all this by saying that I'm waiting for my actual book to arrive to see how the armies and units are broken out, So I have no idea if any of this is actually true, but...

Isn't everything in the battletome part of one big army Faction ? What's stopping me from taking an ironjawz heavy list and including orruks from other subfactions? They're all Orruk Warclans units, aren't they? And I can build an army using any units from battletome, can't I?  

The core rulebook just says that all the units in my army must be from the same Faction (page 338 matched play rules). Everything in the Orruk Warclans battletome is from the Warclans faction, correct? And they are all included on the same orruk warclans faction points cost table, correct? So there's no reason you cant use anythign in the Battletome in you're army, regardless of your allegiance. 

I could see that by picking ironjawz, than my allegiance abilities and such would only affect Ironjawz units in my force, and not the kruelboys or bonesplitters units, who would get nothing. But I dont see any restriction in taking them along. 

As opposed to picking Big Waagh, which explicitly states that different branches of the Orruk tree retain some of their allegiance abilities. So the advantage here, is that as a Big Waagh, you get to mix amd match allegiance abilities from all three allegiances. 

Anyhow, once I see a battletome where I can read the rules, look at the unit keywords on warscrolls, and see how the battletome treats the definitions of  sub factions and allegiances, I wont know for sure. But I will say it seems silly that an orruk force made primarily of ironjawz loses its status and abilities (and now has to use the Big Waagh ones) just  because they picked up a single bonesplitterz unit that happened to be wandering by. 

 

Looking at Keywords from some of the online reviews, most warscrolls have something similar to (DESTRUCTION, ORRUK WARCLANS, ORRUK, KRUELBOYZ), where there is a subfaction specific keyword. 

But then there are others, Like the Sloggoth, that have no subfaction Keyword (DESTRUCTION, ORRUK WARCLANS, GROT, TROGGOTH, MARSHCRAWLER SLOGGOTH)

Does that mean I can take it in ANY Orruk subfaction? Does it work in my Ironjawz Army? I'd say yes you can include it, BUT since it lacks the IRONJAWZ keyword, it would not benefit from your Ironjawz specific allegiance abilities. 

So, in conclusion, You can build a Kruelboys or Ironjawz or bonesplitters specific force, AND you can include ANY "ORRUK WARCLANS" units in your army, because they all have the ORRUK WARCLANS faction keyword. BUT you will only apply your specific subfaction rules to units with the correct subfaction keyword. So for instance. no smashing and bashing, unless you have the Ironjawz Keyword.

 

Anyhow thats my two cents

 

Yeah this isn't true, you're either playing Ironjawz, Bonesplittaz, Kruleboyz, or The Big Waagh. All of those armies can ally Gloomspite Gitz. 

You can't include a model with the Kruleboyz Keyword if you're playing Ironjawz allegiance. 

[Malakithe]

15 hours ago, Gothmaug said:

The books haven't landed here in the USA yet, so I appreciate the info from those who have already seen them. 

Yeah US shipping is way behind. 15-20 day wait for my pre-order

[Bobberto]

So I was putting together a list and came across an interesting question: When a Megaboss targets multiple units with a Command, what's the order of operations? Are all the targets selected first, or do they resolve one at a time?

So say a footboss is just out of range of a friendly IJ unit and decides to Mighty Destroyers. Can he target himself, move 4, and then hit the other unit that is now wholly in range? Or does he have to choose each target before either moves?

My gut says that you have to declare them all first, but if you don't that opens some very interesting plays (particularly around Hand and Mawkrushas)

Edited September 17, 2021 by Bobberto

[Tezia99]

10 minutes ago, Bobberto said:

So I was putting together a list and came across an interesting question: When a Megaboss targets multiple units with a Command, what's the order of operations? Are all the targets selected first, or do they resolve one at a time?

So say a footboss is just out of range of a friendly IJ unit and decides to Mighty Destroyers. Can he target himself, move 4, and then hit the other unit that is now wholly in range? Or does he have to choose each target before either moves?

My gut says that you have to declare them all first, but if you don't that opens some very interesting plays (particularly around Hand and Mawkrushas)

I feel like the check is when you activate the command ability. It’s worded to be 3 instead of 1 of the same ability not 3 separate activations. I would always play this as up to 3 that are in range for sure. 
 

editing on this. The one place I could see it working is with mega bossy. You could by all means mighty destroyers one maw krusha, move him up to be in range of other units and then activate his mega bossy MD

Edited September 17, 2021 by Tezia99
Scenario

[Vastianos]

Are 10 'Ardboyz still better then 5 brutes points wise? Throwing both profiles into age of sigmulator and averaging 4 wounds for both units against a unit that has a 4+ armor save, except you get more wounds with a unit of Ardboyz.

Edited September 17, 2021 by Vastianos

[Malakree]

44 minutes ago, Vastianos said:

Are 10 'Ardboyz still better then 5 brutes points wise? Throwing both profiles into age of sigmulator and averaging 4 wounds for both units against a unit that has a 4+ armor save, except you get more wounds with a unit of Ardboyz.

Brutes are superior offensively with both great damage and a bonkers ability. Ardboys are better defensively because of greater wounds, model count and the ward save.

Personally I wouldn't rate units of 5 Brutes but units of 10 are awesome. Units of 10 ardboys on the other hand are a tanky pain in the ****** and the rally bonus is nuts. 

IMO 10ardboys > 5 Brutes. 10 Brutes > 15 ardboys.

[Malakithe]

Better or not I absolutely hate Ardboys. Long live Brutes!

[Icetea]

With Mawcrusher being such a power house, would running double cabbage be competitive? 

I keep hearing people say double cabbage isn’t their play style, however  is anyone out there having success with the double MBoMK?

[Bruteforce]

31 minutes ago, Icetea said:

With Mawcrusher being such a power house, would running double cabbage be competitive? 

I keep hearing people say double cabbage isn’t their play style, however  is anyone out there having success with the double MBoMK?

I think a double cabbage gore grunta blood toofs build would be pretty fun to play, just charge across the battlefield and take out as much as you can turn 1

[Skreech Verminking]

14 minutes ago, Bruteforce said:

I think a double cabbage gore grunta blood toofs build would be pretty fun to play, just charge across the battlefield and take out as much as you can turn 1

One screen of clanrats later……

[TALegion]

10 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

One screen of clanrats later……

Ideally, that's where the new Bloodtoofs ability comes in. If you clear the screen (shouldn't be too hard with a mawkrusha + 6 gruntas), you'll be able to recharge at the end of combat.

[Skreech Verminking]

30 minutes ago, TALegion said:

Ideally, that's where the new Bloodtoofs ability comes in. If you clear the screen (shouldn't be too hard with a mawkrusha + 6 gruntas), you'll be able to recharge at the end of combat.

Recharge add the end of the movement phase.

Wow that is amazing!

So I’ll be able to use unleash hell a second time in that turn😂.

 

Edited September 18, 2021 by Skreech Verminking

[Malakree]

3 hours ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Recharge add the end of the movement phase.

Wow that is amazing!

So I’ll be able to use unleash hell a second time in that turn😂.

 

Combat phase.

You can't unleash hell outside of the charge phase.

 

[Brodylan]

Or movement phase if they were charged then by mighty destroyers.