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AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion


Chris Tomlin
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5 hours ago, Warbossironteef said:

Playing with the new rules on Thursday against Tzeentch. Here's the list I'm running. I think it's a pretty good starting list. First time using bigger blocks of Brutes. 3 drop, sneak in a free All out Attack because army is so CP heavy. Enough Goregruntas to do an alpha if opponent doesn't respect it but still bringing 2 blocks of -2 Rend Brutes to clean house on a Waaagh and All out Attack turn.  

Not sure how I want to run my Mawkrusha yet but I'm trying out a tanky one (+3 and amulet) with extra mortals on Stomp. 

Biggest question for you all is what Command Ability should I take? I kind of like the once per battle Waagh one to get rerolls for all your Brutes trying to charge, but I'm unsure. This army is CP heavy so I think giving your Mawkrusha free rerolls of charges is good and can act as a pseudo, free CP.

 

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Bloodtoofs
- Grand Strategy: HOLD THE LINE (surviving battleline) 

LEADERS
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480) – BATTLE REGIMENT 
- General
- Command Trait: Battle-lust
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny
- Mount Trait: Mean 'Un

Orruk Warchanter (115) – BATTLE REGIMENT
- Warbeat: Get 'Em Beat

Orruk Warchanter (115) – BATTLE REGIMENT
- Warbeat: Killa Beat

UNITS
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300) – BATTLE REGIMENT
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150) – BATTLE REGIMENT
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150) – BATTLE REGIMENT

10 x Orruk Brutes (320) – IRONJAWS FIST
- Jagged Gore-hackas, 1x Boss Choppa

10 x Orruk Brutes (320)   – IRONJAWS FIST
- Jagged Gore-hackas, 1x Boss Choppa

TOTAL: 1950/2000 WOUNDS: 147
 

I quite like this list you’re running. Will be interesting to see how you go. 
I was thinking running double cabbage, but still need to buy the 2nd one. This would be what I would be running now if I could. 
 

let us know how you go and any your thoughts on the list post game!

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10 hours ago, Malakree said:

 2nd cabbage 😁 and armor of gork

 

yeah that make sense. I dunno man, there are so many tactics "kill X with a monster for additional victory point" in 3rd edition. I'd rather pick destroyer or...emm right we don't really have any other good artefact (maybe boss pole vs minus bravery armies, ).

Fast Un is actually so good, you can move 12' with Mighty Destroyers AND you can move 12' with a Fast un trait after that in Hero Phase, then you can move 12' in movement phase and then you can charge.

OR you can Fast Un 12' and then charge enemy unit with Mighty Destroyers and it won't be able to Redeploy or Unleash Hell (becasue it's happening in a hero phase and ther's a mawcrusha looking at you in 3') (you can do Stomp anyway at the end of the charge PHASE)

Edited by dnusha
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5 hours ago, dnusha said:

yeah that make sense. I dunno man, there are so many tactics "kill X with a monster for additional victory point" in 3rd edition. I'd rather pick destroyer or...emm right we don't really have any other good artefact (maybe boss pole vs minus bravery armies, ).

Fast Un is actually so good, you can move 12' with Mighty Destroyers AND you can move 12' with a Fast un trait after that in Hero Phase, then you can move 12' in movement phase and then you can charge.

OR you can Fast Un 12' and then charge enemy unit with Mighty Destroyers and it won't be able to Redeploy or Unleash Hell (becasue it's happening in a hero phase and ther's a mawcrusha looking at you in 3') (you can do Stomp anyway at the end of the charge PHASE)

Swapping 2" move for a 6++ and +1 to hit isn't actually that bad the moment amulet of destiny is off the table.

I agree that fast un has a bunch of really interesting option it provides and offsets the loss of that 2" by what is essentially a 10" move if I desperately need to do the turn 1 alpha.

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I believe the key question for IJ list building is how much drops you are aiming for. For me the conclusion for now is that it's time to move away from the "two artifacts meta" and take a double regiment for a two drop list instead.

In aos2 Ironfist was such an auto include, that we get used to having two artifacts. When the amulet of destiny arrived in aos3, it was also an easy decision (for a two cabbage build) to have one tanky and one killy version with metalrippa. Since the rippa is gone however, I don't see an artifact (besides of the amulet) which would be an auto take. 

The armor is a solid choice, but it slows you done. The destroyer can only be put on the boss's 7 attack, rend 1 weapon, so I don't rate it very high. If I can kill stg with rend 1, I can kill that with piggies. 

If I were to take a second artifact, I'd probably take the arcane tome instead. The none general cabbage would get the amulet, and the general the tome with the +1 to wound spell and master of magic command trait for the reroll. 

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44 minutes ago, Orkmann said:

If I were to take a second artifact, I'd probably take the arcane tome instead. The none general cabbage would get the amulet, and the general the tome with the +1 to wound spell and master of magic command trait for the reroll. 

Well Flaming Weapon is good too. It gives you the chance to go 5 damage on fists, as long you have violent fury on. 

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1 hour ago, Holy_Diver said:

Well Flaming Weapon is good too. It gives you the chance to go 5 damage on fists, as long you have violent fury on. 

Touch by the waaagh ! trait is really good, you can dish out D3 bm to increase your own cast. 

It combo well with fast'un also

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3 hours ago, Orkmann said:

I believe the key question for IJ list building is how much drops you are aiming for. For me the conclusion for now is that it's time to move away from the "two artifacts meta" and take a double regiment for a two drop list instead.

My current idea for a list is a 2-drop Alpha list looking something like this...

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Bloodtoofs
- Grand Strategy: HOLD THE LINE

LEADERS
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)*
- General
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Command Trait: Mega Bossy
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny

Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (480)**
- Gore-hacka and Boss Choppa
- Mount Trait: Fast 'un

Orruk Warchanter (115)*
- Warbeat: Fixin' Beat

Weirdnob Shaman (90)**
- Lore of the Weird: Foot of Gork

UNITS
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (300)**
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)*
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (150)*
3x Orruk Gore-grunts (150)**
5x Ardboys (85)**

Core Battalions:
* Battle Regiment; ** Battle Regiment

TOTAL: 2000/2000 WOUNDS: 133

 

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3 minutes ago, 5kaven5lave said:

I’m so hyped for list building in the new book, loads to think about. 

I'm really hyped too. I don't know why but I really want to see lists with like, ardboys groups of 15 getting refilled on a 4+. That seems extremely durable and crazy.

Edited by Jabbuk
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5 hours ago, Orkmann said:

I believe the key question for IJ list building is how much drops you are aiming for. For me the conclusion for now is that it's time to move away from the "two artifacts meta" and take a double regiment for a two drop list instead.

I personally think I'll always be aiming for 1 or 4/5 with the question being whether to take the extra drop for the warlord cp.

5 hours ago, Orkmann said:

to have one tanky and one killy version with metalrippa. Since the rippa is gone however, I don't see an artifact (besides of the amulet) which would be an auto take. 

I actually found that a cabbage without the damage build was just not enough of a threat to justify it's points. I ran big Waaagh! because it provided the 6++ which let me go damage with everything else. Since the damage has been rolled into it's base stats I now think the defensive artefacts are worth it.

4 hours ago, Holy_Diver said:

Well Flaming Weapon is good too. It gives you the chance to go 5 damage on fists, as long you have violent fury on. 

Can flaming weapon go on mount attacks? 

5 hours ago, Orkmann said:

If I were to take a second artifact, I'd probably take the arcane tome instead. The none general cabbage would get the amulet, and the general the tome with the +1 to wound spell and master of magic command trait for the reroll. 

I'd grab the arcane tome. Mortal wound cast command trait and foot of gork. I'd be really tempted by that in big Waaagh with big G so I can be more blazee with my general.

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16 minutes ago, Malakree said:

I personally think I'll always be aiming for 1 or 4/5 with the question being whether to take the extra drop for the warlord cp.

The discussion was mainly about double cabbage lists so thats min 2 drops. I personally still prefer one cabbabe as that suits my playstyle better, but even with that one drop lists feel too limited on the number of units.

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I think double cabbage will be good. My biggest question with every IJ list is how am I going to use my CP and what ways can I make combos.

I honestly feel like it's the most important thing to think about. If we had 5 CPS a turn our army would be amazing, but that's not reality. 

That's why I think things like: the below are so important. You need to find small efficiencies that dont require CPs. 

  • Rerolling charge for Mawkrusha from Generic Command trait
  • Ironjawz fist 
  • Fast'Un 

 

Edited by Warbossironteef
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42 minutes ago, Orkmann said:

The discussion was mainly about double cabbage lists so thats min 2 drops. I personally still prefer one cabbabe as that suits my playstyle better, but even with that one drop lists feel too limited on the number of units.

That's what I meant. If I can't get 1 drop then I'm aiming for 4/5. I refuse to run an IJ list without 2 WC so I'll have enough heroes to get the extra artefact if I can't 1 drop.

I'll probably stick to double MK lists till I finish my next 10/15 Brutes. After that it's probably one of these.

Allegiance: Da Choppas
Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (495)
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
Orruk Warchanter (120)
Orruk Warchanter (120)

Battleline
10 x Orruk Brutes (300)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Brutes (300)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Brutes (300)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Ardboys (190)
- Reinforced x 1
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (170)
- Pig-iron Choppas

Total: 1995 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 152
Drops: 1
 

Allegiance: Da Choppas
Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (495)
- Boss Gore-hacka and Choppa
Orruk Warchanter (120)
Orruk Warchanter (120)
Orruk Weirdboss (160)
- arcane tome 


Battleline
10 x Orruk Brutes (300)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
10 x Orruk Brutes (300)
- Pair of Brute Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
15 x Orruk Ardboys (285)
- Reinforced x 2
5 x Orruk Ardboys (95)
5 x Orruk Ardboys (95)

Endless Spells & Invocations
Emerald Lifeswarm (60)

Total: 2030 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Wounds: 144
Drops: 4
 

First is obviously a 1 drop while the 2nd is 4 to get the arcane tome so the footboss becomes a weirdboss.

I think every list I write now will be 1 drop, 4 drop or not have a battle regiment. IMO if you are going for a 2 drop you should just man up and go for the 1 drop or just take the enhancement powerspike. Otherwise you're doing both while getting the benefits of neither.

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With the app release I noticed that MBoMK also has the triple up on command abilities. Honestly I think 2 megabosses, with one having mega bossy as the command trait is gonna be the way to go. Whether its two cabbages or a cabbage and a footboss being able to spread mighty destroyers to the whole army is going to be super powerful, because of that I think we're actually going to want to bring warlord/command entourage for the command points, so we can be sure to have the CP to get stuck in early.

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Would love input on this list that I built trying to maximize CP to take the most advantage of our amazing multi-targeting.

With this list you have two warlords to decide to generate a free CP and the fongoids give you a 4+ chance to generate 1 CP each on your hero phase. 

Allegiance: Da choppaz

Army Name: Unlimited Power
Army Faction: Orruk Warclans
Army Type: Ironjaws
Battlepack: Pitched Battles
Points Limit: 2000 pts
General: Megaboss on Maw-krusha
Units
    Fungoid Cave-Shaman (Ally)
        Battlefield Role: Leader
        Points Cost: 95 pts
    Orruk Ardboys
        Battlefield Role: Battleline
        Points Cost: 85 pts
    Ironskull’s Boyz
        Battlefield Role: Other
        Points Cost: 80 pts
Core Battalions
    Warlord
        Megaboss on Maw-krusha (General)
            Battalion Slot Filled: Commander
            Battlefield Role: Behemoth, Leader
            Command Traits: Mega Bossy
            Artefacts of Power: Amulet of Destiny
            Mount Traits: Mean ’Un
            Points Cost: 480 pts
        Orruk Warchanter
            Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
            Battlefield Role: Leader
            Artefacts of Power: Arcane Tome
            Points Cost: 115 pts
        Orruk Brutes
            Battalion Slot Filled: Troops
            Battlefield Role: Battleline
            Reinforced: Once
            Points Cost: 320 pts
        Fungoid Cave-Shaman (Ally)
            Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
            Battlefield Role: Leader
            Points Cost: 95 pts
    Warlord
    Magnificent Bonus: Artefacts of Power
        Orruk Megaboss
            Battalion Slot Filled: Commander
            Battlefield Role: Leader
            Artefacts of Power: Destroyer
            Points Cost: 140 pts
        Orruk Warchanter
            Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
            Battlefield Role: Leader
            Points Cost: 115 pts
        Fungoid Cave-Shaman (Ally)
            Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
            Battlefield Role: Leader
            Points Cost: 95 pts
        Orruk Brutes
            Battalion Slot Filled: Troops
            Battlefield Role: Battleline
            Reinforced: Once
            Points Cost: 320 pts
Endless Spells/Invocations
    Emerald Lifeswarm
        Points Cost: 60 pts
Total Points: 2000 pts

 

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5 minutes ago, Vastianos said:

Would love input on this list that I built trying to maximize CP to take the most advantage of our amazing multi-targeting.

With this list you have two warlords to decide to generate a free CP and the fongoids give you a 4+ chance to generate 1 CP each on your hero phase. 

Allegiance: Da choppaz

Army Name: Unlimited Power
Army Faction: Orruk Warclans
Army Type: Ironjaws
Battlepack: Pitched Battles
Points Limit: 2000 pts
General: Megaboss on Maw-krusha
Units
    Fungoid Cave-Shaman (Ally)
        Battlefield Role: Leader
        Points Cost: 95 pts
    Orruk Ardboys
        Battlefield Role: Battleline
        Points Cost: 85 pts
    Ironskull’s Boyz
        Battlefield Role: Other
        Points Cost: 80 pts
Core Battalions
    Warlord
        Megaboss on Maw-krusha (General)
            Battalion Slot Filled: Commander
            Battlefield Role: Behemoth, Leader
            Command Traits: Mega Bossy
            Artefacts of Power: Amulet of Destiny
            Mount Traits: Mean ’Un
            Points Cost: 480 pts
        Orruk Warchanter
            Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
            Battlefield Role: Leader
            Artefacts of Power: Arcane Tome
            Points Cost: 115 pts
        Orruk Brutes
            Battalion Slot Filled: Troops
            Battlefield Role: Battleline
            Reinforced: Once
            Points Cost: 320 pts
        Fungoid Cave-Shaman (Ally)
            Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
            Battlefield Role: Leader
            Points Cost: 95 pts
    Warlord
    Magnificent Bonus: Artefacts of Power
        Orruk Megaboss
            Battalion Slot Filled: Commander
            Battlefield Role: Leader
            Artefacts of Power: Destroyer
            Points Cost: 140 pts
        Orruk Warchanter
            Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
            Battlefield Role: Leader
            Points Cost: 115 pts
        Fungoid Cave-Shaman (Ally)
            Battalion Slot Filled: Sub-commander
            Battlefield Role: Leader
            Points Cost: 95 pts
        Orruk Brutes
            Battalion Slot Filled: Troops
            Battlefield Role: Battleline
            Reinforced: Once
            Points Cost: 320 pts
Endless Spells/Invocations
    Emerald Lifeswarm
        Points Cost: 60 pts
Total Points: 2000 pts

 

I cant really read the list in that format.... Yikes :)

But I do think farming CP could be a strategy outside of the lowdrop armies. Because you can affect 3 unitrs it's so powerful if you can pull off 2-4 command abilities a turn. 

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Just now, Warbossironteef said:

I cant really read the list in that format.... Yikes :)

But I do think farming CP could be a strategy outside of the lowdrop armies. Because you can affect 3 unitrs it's so powerful if you can pull off 2-4 command abilities a turn. 

Ya, looked a bit daunting. That is the copy from the new AoS app.

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Here's a couple of my competitive lists (using warscroll builder so there will be some gaps). They're all bloodtoofs -- I'll experiment with the other clans, particularly Ironsunz, later. I've played 4 games of 3.0 so far against some tough lists and won all of them. I definitely think we have some gas.  Opponents included: Lumineth - Sentinels + Teclis build , SoB -Typical 4 toddler list, Soulblight Gravelord - Dragon General  w/ -1 wound artifact, Gatebreaker , Dok - Morathi & the Snakebows

One Drop Version: I don't prefer this one, but I'm in a heavy one-drop alpha strike meta and the idea of me going first puts the fear of gork into them.  Only played this once. 

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Warclan: Bloodtoofs
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs:
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (495)
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)
- Mount Trait: Fast 'Un
Orruk Warchanter (120)
Orruk Warchanter (120)
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (340)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (340)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (340)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (340)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
5 x Orruk Ardboys (95)

Total: 2190 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 4 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 157
Drops: 8
 

The one I played more, and messed around with how the units were reinforced between games. Settled on splitting one of the GG units. Units of 3 have such a different and needed role in the army compared to units of 6, and it really helped clear chaff lines T1 without offering up so many points. That, while also being survivable enough your opponent can't clear the Goregruntas tying them down before their movement phase. I also like having the GGs in Hunters, rather than feeding them into the one-drop. The bloodtoofs ability was absolutely stellar in each of my games. Highlight being tying  up the gatebreaker and zombie dragon with a damaged GG unit after clearing his chaff walls.
 

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
- Grand Strategy: Hold the Line
- Triumphs:
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (495)
- Boss Choppa and Rip-tooth fist
- Artefact: Amulet of Destiny (Universal Artefact)
- Mount Trait: Fast 'Un
Orruk Warchanter (120)
Orruk Warchanter (120)
Orruk Warchanter (120)
- Artefact: Arcane Tome (Universal Artefact)
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (95)
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (340)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
6 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (340)
- Pig-iron Choppas
- Reinforced x 1
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (170)
- Pig-iron Choppas
3 x Orruk Gore-gruntas (170)
- Pig-iron Choppas
5 x Orruk Ardboys (95)
5 x Orruk Ardboys (95)

Total: 2160 / 2000
Reinforced Units: 2 / 4
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 147
Drops: 11
 




 

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18 hours ago, dnusha said:

Fast Un is actually so good, you can move 12' with Mighty Destroyers AND you can move 12' with a Fast un trait after that in Hero Phase, then you can move 12' in movement phase and then you can charge.

OR you can Fast Un 12' and then charge enemy unit with Mighty Destroyers and it won't be able to Redeploy or Unleash Hell (becasue it's happening in a hero phase and ther's a mawcrusha looking at you in 3') 

I think this is the combo that needs to be talked about the most.

If you are taking an MBMK as your General (which you are). He is getting the Amulet of Destiny. No question.

You can switch his Command Trait if you want but rerolling charges on the Waaagh turn is pretty powerful and saves those CP's for other stuff. I'll only be running one MBMK so his setup is pretty standard. (style pts for the OP MBMK Touched Wizard, more pts for Prized Sorcery)

Fast Un might get a FAQ but its pretty straightforward.

Move -> Mighty Destroyers Charge -> Retreat -> Pile In

Move -> MD Move -> Move ->Charge - Uhhh, what? 36" Move? Take that Aetheric Navigator! 18" move still good!

In 3.0 you need to get where you need to go to for those extra VP's

Hand of Gork value has plummeted. Losing all the charge bonus's really hurts the 9" setup. Ardboys used to be the go to unit for this reason and now its not even likely that you will cast the spell let alone make the charge after.

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