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Let's chat Stormcast Eternals


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6 minutes ago, sigmar is scottish said:

Holy ******.
So apart from the archer guys (and unless there is a point redaction for old stormcasts) the new sacrosanct stuff has just made a lot of stromcasts obsolete?

I wouldn't say obsolete, but less "optimal".  We don't know all point cost yet but this is based on what has been leaked incl the new GHB. This can still change though as we don't know the new rules for storm-hosts perhaps the old stuff gets some nice buffs. 

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46 minutes ago, Jupiter said:

Well unless Libs get a new warscroll, they can be replaced by the new sequitors. Paladins will be replaced by the Evocators. Judicators can be replaced by Balista and celestant on dragoth / stardrake can be replaced by a lord arcunum (on mount). (might spelled some of the new names wrong)

Liberators get a new warscroll, but no big change: if they are equipped with dual weapons, unmodified 6s to hit cause two woundrolls, no rerolling 1s to hit anymore

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13 hours ago, kuroyume said:

I bring you points!

Between Discord and the SCE FB group we've been piecing together stuff from blurry screenshots. Here's the new/changed stuff we've been able to put together:

Palladors - 200 
Hunters - 120
Raptors with HC - 140
Aetherwings - 50
Relictor 100
Azyros 100
Sequitors 5/120
Castigators 3/80
Heraldor 100
Concussors 260
Vexillor 120
Evocators 5/200
Drakesworn Templar 460
Ballista 100
Incantor 140
Lord Arcanum on Gryph-Charger: 240

 

Starter is ~980 points, but with three under strength units.

Drakesworn and Consussors still too expensive, Lord Arcanum might be too cheap. Hunters still too expensive(they're worse than liberators in my opinion) Palladors are solid, HC raptors are decent support now(still not great) Azyros seems like it went up due to the new Sacrosanct stuff, gonna need to go over the other sacrosanct warscrolls to know how I feel about those, although the ballista seems fair assuming you bring a couple and an ordinator. Vexillor still too expensive, my own screenshot perusal says Longstrikes stayed the same which is unfortunate considering how much worse shooting got. Relictor is fair, incantor is fair.

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51 minutes ago, Jupiter said:

Well unless Libs get a new warscroll, they can be replaced by the new sequitors. Paladins will be replaced by the Evocators. Judicators can be replaced by Balista and celestant on dragoth / stardrake can be replaced by a lord arcunum (on mount). (might spelled some of the new names wrong)

Lord Arcanum doesn't replace a Stardrake, although it will definitely be competing against the LCoD, the ballista is okay, but not necessarily a replacement to judicators(judicators are more consistent between 19-29" and are battleline). Especially considering that a ballista comes equipped with a Lord Ordinatus, pushing it to 200+pts.  Taking one, unbuffed is probably going to be worse than just taking prosecutors, but they'll go up in usefulness dramatically as you add more. A Lord Ordinatus+4 Ballista+ a Knight Azyros will be a devastating amount of firepower at 18" and decent character sniping at 36.

Sequitors do pretty much replace Liberators(and make Hunters look like a sick joke) but Paladins vs. Evocators will depend on the delivery systems available to them. Hammerstrike Paladins are still better than Footslogging Evocators, even though Footslogging Evocators are WAY better than footslogging paladins.

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43 minutes ago, Bellfree said:

Sequitors do pretty much replace Liberators

If you want an arcanum as general - which I'll admit doesn't look too bad just now. Otherwise you'll need battleline as well as sequitors.

However, with command abilities having a general's bonus version, the arcanum is the general for sacrosanct. So if you've a lot of extremis units or regular SC (and we see some tasty command abilities for generals that benefit those subdivisions of units) you might feel torn in taking a Lord Arcanum.

You might also not want the Arcanum to have Staunch Defender for example - if you're still going to take an LCoSD (which looks a strong choice still - together with the Arcanum and the coherency breaking rule).

So long as I can play more versions of SC and meet more versions of SC than what we see in matched now (which I think looks likely) I'm happy.

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As an aside, .

I don't get this 'replacement' & 'this unit is worthless' talk. I see what people mean - in a vacuum, objectively, some units with similar functions are better in a competitive environment.

So if your main concern is that competitive environment, get those units. There will always be shifts with new releases. New stuff will always be good.

You guys are playing SC - so if you want to be the best, get the best.

But I get the feeling that the majority of people complaining aren't the top players you see winning a bunch of tournaments and I say that only because those types just tend to pick up the best units and get on with their winning. In my experience, that's what the best do. They may not even build or paint the units. Or they rush it. 3 colours minimum including the base exists for a reason (and for me that's a ludicrous 'minimum standard' for an army, often a single basecoat and a shade above grey/undercoated). Some people are in it for the gaming only.

By all means if you're an average joe (like me) and want to finish bottom 30 instead of bottom 10, you can take your sequitors and optimise below the mid tables. You can do that, you can feel a competitive urge and have a competitive drive but still not have a grasp of what all armies do, what mechanics do etc. Maybe you make mistakes during the game. That's just normal unless you devote tons of time to the game.

So at that level - the level of the majority - optimisation plays a part too. Again though, just get the best if you want to do well.

I'd argue, that the flavour and fun of your army is far more important unless you're realistically challenging for top spot in a tournament. Or maybe you're into narrative and open. In which case how can a unit be better than another based on points and efficiency?

So the way I see it is you've two options (and I'd love to read a third or fourth or fifth from anyone who feels I'm glossing stuff over):

1. Be competitive - find out the best, get the best, try to win.

2. Be about variety and fun - play with what you like.

 

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11 minutes ago, Turragor said:

As an aside, .

I don't get this 'replacement' & 'this unit is worthless' talk. I see what people mean - in a vacuum, objectively, some units with similar functions are better in a competitive environment.

So if your main concern is that competitive environment, get those units. There will always be shifts with new releases. New stuff will always be good.

You guys are playing SC - so if you want to be the best, get the best.

But I get the feeling that the majority of people complaining aren't the top players you see winning a bunch of tournaments and I say that only because those types just tend to pick up the best units and get on with their winning. In my experience, that's what the best do. They may not even build or paint the units. Or they rush it. 3 colours minimum including the base exists for a reason (and for me that's a ludicrous 'minimum standard' for an army, often a single basecoat and a shade above grey/undercoated). Some people are in it for the gaming only.

By all means if you're an average joe (like me) and want to finish bottom 30 instead of bottom 10, you can take your sequitors and optimise below the mid tables. You can do that, you can feel a competitive urge and have a competitive drive but still not have a grasp of what all armies do, what mechanics do etc. Maybe you make mistakes during the game. That's just normal unless you devote tons of time to the game.

So at that level - the level of the majority - optimisation plays a part too. Again though, just get the best if you want to do well.

I'd argue, that the flavour and fun of your army is far more important unless you're realistically challenging for top spot in a tournament. Or maybe you're into narrative and open. In which case how can a unit be better than another based on points and efficiency?

So the way I see it is you've two options (and I'd love to read a third or fourth or fifth from anyone who feels I'm glossing stuff over):

1. Be competitive - find out the best, get the best, try to win.

2. Be about variety and fun - play with what you like.

 

Oh I'm not aiming for competitiveness.
I'm a very relaxed player. In fact you couldn't really count me as a player, this will be my first foray into AoS but I don't really care about winning just so long as I don't get troused every single time lol.
I was only really asking as my force will probably only consist of what I get from the box and what I can trade the nighthaunt half for lol

And boom the Tauralon is the big flying space goat thing you can see in the animated video.

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1 hour ago, Bellfree said:

Lord Arcanum doesn't replace a Stardrake, although it will definitely be competing against the LCoD.

Your right. It's a feeling that the new taurilon (winged buffelo?) would possible be much better then the Stardrake, but it's unknown at this point :).

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23 minutes ago, Turragor said:

As an aside, .

I don't get this 'replacement' & 'this unit is worthless' talk. I see what people mean - in a vacuum, objectively, some units with similar functions are better in a competitive environment.

 

Nobody said worthless :).  It's not about competitive environment, the average player just want a nice cool army. If units which are very similar in role or function and both are too the liking regarding looks and background why not choose the better one. For example I have 20 nicely painted liberators which i will not replace anytime soon. I will probably get a unit of 10 sanctuators and after some games decide if I like them enough to invest more into them. However if I had to choose now I rather go with full santuators, the models look great if not even better then the libs so why not. This isn't like getting the most competitive stuff its about long term investment in the game and informed decision making.

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41 minutes ago, Lardidar said:

That may as well have been, sell me a SCE army in 7 words!

HAHA!

33 minutes ago, christophe said:

I am the only one not liking the heads of the new SC wizards ?  Not bold nor simple as their older SC cousins... Pity because all the big fancy models are wizards... I will have to swap some heads...

No i'm not a big fan of the over ostentatious heads. I feel it ruins the silhouette  of the model (as pretentious as that sounds)  
The stormcasts have all these nice flat round surfaces that get broken up by over the top stupid helms.
I love the death masks. Standard liberator helms are probably one of my favourite bits in the game.

I'm planning on trimming a lot of them down and adding hoods and cowls.

 

44 minutes ago, Jupiter said:

Your right. It's a feeling that the new taurilon (winged buffelo?) would possible be much better then the Stardrake, but it's unknown at this point :).

 I really don't like the stardrake model. Its to square. I like the heads but that's about it.
Hope this gives us a nice alternative.

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48 minutes ago, christophe said:

I am the only one not liking the heads of the new SC wizards ?  Not bold nor simple as their older SC cousins... Pity because all the big fancy models are wizards... I will have to swap some heads...

And then there is me...

I'm tring to give an elmet to every stormcast that doesn't have one, and that's a hard job.

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I prefer my stormcast with helmets so I'll be cutting a lot of heads off (maybe this is how khorne wins!)

I already have 3K+ of stormcast so I'll be looking at what fits best with what I have, so calling stuff worthless is probably all just dependent on one's viewpoint.  I would understand why GW would make these new stormcast better via points, so people like me who already have a bunch of stormcast are tempted to start over.  But I won't fall for that trick :)

 

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1 hour ago, boombyeyeah said:

ah i see, Lord Arcanum can ride it and he cost 100p more then

Ohhhh, now that is some interesting news... So, to confirm the Taularon costs 340pts?

If so, then my hopes of it being a circa 12 wounds hero might come true...

 

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12 minutes ago, Jupiter said:

confirmed! 

 

image.png.bc49a963beac7028f7d5c72c9e5fd057.png

Dracoline, especially as a French, sounds so sweet and cute to my hears. My next baby girl have now to be call Dracoline (my wife would be happy, it's probably better as a first name than Gryph-Charger... ?)

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