Faction Focus - Pointless Speculation

[TheWilddog]

The Ironjaws faction focus gives me hope for my FEC.  It seems like that are open to revising Command Abilities and Traits and such in the GHB2018.  With the shift to a command point system for command abilities maybe the FEC will get some actual command abilities that work.  Please, GW please.  With this and a FEC spell lore in the magic supplement I might get them back on the table.  

[Imperial]

I asked about some changes in warscrolls, but ....

We've not heard of any plans to change any Warscrolls at the moment Aleksey - after all every current Battletome will continue to be valid in the new edition. (c) GW

[Malakree]

So the persistent spells look fantastic and a points drop for ardboyz / mk's is wonderful to hear. Big G can finally go in a mega battallion!

[Imperial]

1 minute ago, Malakree said:

So the persistent spells look fantastic and a points drop for ardboyz / mk's is wonderful to hear. Big G can finally go in a mega battallion!

No changes at warscrolls.... mb some info in faq...

[Skabnoze]

Well, now we need some other type of pointless speculation.

[Ar-Pharazôn]

It looks like they went Death, Order, Chaos, Destruction. We should expect this rough template. With Fyreslayers next, the next one after would be Death, Chaos, or Destruction. 

[Malakree]

2 hours ago, Imperial said:

No changes at warscrolls.... mb some info in faq...

If they make Ardboyz 100/200/270 then we don't need a warscroll change ? point being it depends how much they reduce the points by, personally hoping for 140-160 range. 

The use of multiple command abilities in a turn is also MASSIVE for us. Imagine 6 Megabosses all doing the Waaagh! and rolling a 6, that's 12 extra attacks with EVERY WEAPON for every unit affected. 13 Brute boss Claw attacks from one Brute....

[Skabnoze]

2 minutes ago, Malakree said:

If they make Ardboyz 100/200/270 then we don't need a warscroll change ? point being it depends how much they reduce the points by, personally hoping for 140-160 range. 

The use of multiple command abilities in a turn is also MASSIVE for us. Imagine 6 Megabosses all doing the Waaagh! and rolling a 6, that's 12 extra attacks with EVERY WEAPON for every unit affected. 13 Brute boss Claw attacks from one Brute....

I would expect that the rules of 1 would stay, as it is a good set of rules, and would be expanded to apply to command abilities.  I would doubt that they would allow multiple uses of the same command ability (even if it is on different models) as that would probably require a larger rewrite of the command abilities across the game to prevent some really crazy stuff that would probably lead to large FAQs.

As for Ardboyz, I am glad to hear there is a point decrease.  I have always liked Black Orcs and I have a stupid amount of them.  I was planning to start off with Ironjawz simply by doing a horde of Ardboyz with a couple characters mixed in.  I am also glad to hear that MawCrushers are cheaper.  I had no real issue with their cost previously, since I have not actually played the faction and I do not yet own any MawCrusher models, but I really love big monsters and so being able to play with more of them is good in my book!

As a more general thing, I hope that battalions come down in points across the board in the next GHB as whenever I look at most of them they seem neat,  but the cost is so high that I generally have little desire to use them.  The Weirdfist looks fun to me as an initial starting Battalion since i have so many Ardboyz that I could field.

[broche]

100/270 would be insanely broken.

I'm expecting 160/420 (wich would make them really good)

i think you'll be able to field something like:

Maw Krusha

Weirnob

Weirnob

Warchanter

fungoid cave shaman

10 arboys

10 arboys

3 gore gruntas

3 gore gruntas

10 brutes

weirdfist

 

and maybe even more (like a megaboss to buff brutes!) So if you can in adition use command of Fungoid at some point in the game this would become a pretty good list.

1 shaman to cast enhenced bolt / foot of gork  and the other casting the maw spell, fungoid for arcaneshield. A nice mortal wound output.

 

 

[Ollie Grimwood]

A points drop means more Jawz which will cure many issues. I homed In on the rule tweaks to be more fun. I’m going to assume this is from the perspective of an Ironjaw so stuff will get make stompy or at least they’ll do something with the rediculous paragraph that is Goregrunta Charge.   

[Skreech Verminking]

1 minute ago, Ollie Grimwood said:

A points drop means more Jawz which will cure many issues. I homed In on the rule tweaks to be more fun. I’m going to assume this is from the perspective of an Ironjaw so stuff will get make stompy or at least they’ll do something with the rediculous paragraph that is Goregrunta Charge.   

Yeah that’s great, but from the way Gw said it, probably all units and army’s are going to get some kind of a point drop?.

you know what that means 

“more meatshields!!!”

??

[Ollie Grimwood]

4 minutes ago, Skreech Verminking said:

Yeah that’s great, but from the way Gw said it, probably all units and army’s are going to get some kind of a point drop?.

you know what that means 

“more meatshields!!!”

??

And “stuff that smashing and bashing works on” ?

[svnvaldez]

2 hours ago, Skabnoze said:

I would expect that the rules of 1 would stay, as it is a good set of rules, and would be expanded to apply to command abilities.  I would doubt that they would allow multiple uses of the same command ability (even if it is on different models) as that would probably require a larger rewrite of the command abilities across the game to prevent some really crazy stuff that would probably lead to large FAQs.

I'm expecting a rule of 1 for command ablities

2 hours ago, broche said:

100/270 would be insanely broken.

I'm expecting 160/420 (wich would make them really good)

I'm expecting 140 for 10

2 hours ago, Skabnoze said:

 I am also glad to hear that MawCrushers are cheaper. 

I'm hoping for 400 so I can use him as an ally

2 hours ago, Skabnoze said:

As a more general thing, I hope that battalions come down in points across the board in the next GHB

Yes please

[broche]

1 hour ago, svnvaldez said:

I'm expecting 140 for 10

****** you're expection is high!

if they let that thru i think it's a mistake, at 140 for 20 life at 4+ is way to low. they're playable at 180 (but suffer a bit that gruntas are at 140), at 160 they would be average-good, at 140 would be way undercosted. I would never take Brutes over Ardboys at 140 I think,

we'll see soon enough i guess!

[Oreaper84]

So question, even if they do the rule of 1.....Mighty Waaaagh! (MC) and Waaaagh!(MB) have different names so i speculate that they WIIL be able to be used in tandem with each other. 2-4 extra attacks!!!! I think that's gunna be our thing, mass smashing all day erra day.

[broche]

combine with Orruk war boss for +3 to +5 attacks?

 

[Malakree]

41 minutes ago, Oreaper84 said:

So question, even if they do the rule of 1.....Mighty Waaaagh! (MC) and Waaaagh!(MB) have different names so i speculate that they WIIL be able to be used in tandem with each other. 2-4 extra attacks!!!! I think that's gunna be our thing, mass smashing all day erra day.

Orruk Warboss on Wyvern, Gordrakk, Mighty Waaagh! and Waaagh! for potentially 7 extra attacks  

[Skabnoze]

I expect that they will probably address this in some way.  If they don't, then you will probably have access to some fun shenanigans for a short period of time and then an errata will consolidate those.

Honestly, I would not be surprised to see those abilities all just consolidated into the same ability.  The only difference between them is the range and it seems to just be some sort of fluffy way to show that a boss on top of a big monster can be seen by your troops from further away.   That distinction does not seem important enough to retain if it creates game balance problems.

I am sure that if they are making a system to allow multiple command abilities that they are also specifically looking at the various command abilities in the game for precisely interactions such as this.  Having said that, GW has done some pretty face-palm worthy things in the past in regards to rules so I guess we should not rule it out.

[Iradekhorne]

6 hours ago, Malakree said:

If they make Ardboyz 100/200/270 then we don't need a warscroll change ? point being it depends how much they reduce the points by, personally hoping for 140-160 range. 

The use of multiple command abilities in a turn is also MASSIVE for us. Imagine 6 Megabosses all doing the Waaagh! and rolling a 6, that's 12 extra attacks with EVERY WEAPON for every unit affected. 13 Brute boss Claw attacks from one Brute....

In the everchosen post, they say one thing.

the comman hability of archaon remain unchanged, and still are one of the most powerful of the game.

Thats confusing.... and i think.... maybe you can use a second command hability, but with the new stratsgem using the new command points no?.

Thats my opinion

[svnvaldez]

19 minutes ago, Iradekhorne said:

Thats confusing.... and i think.... maybe you can use a second command hability, but with the new stratsgem using the new command points no?.

I think you'll have to use command points to use non general command abilities.... I have no idea how they will be generated thou. In 40k its based on detachments. I doubt they will be linked to battalions. Maybe you get x per hero or something.

[PlasticCraic]

21 minutes ago, Iradekhorne said:

In the everchosen post, they say one thing.

the comman hability of archaon remain unchanged, and still are one of the most powerful of the game.

Thats confusing.... and i think.... maybe you can use a second command hability, but with the new stratsgem using the new command points no?.

Thats my opinion

Yeah that's how I think it will work too.  You'll get command points as a currency to spend on command abilities, and Archaon will just bypass that and activate them for free.

[PlasticCraic]

My own personal take on this (I'll start with the bad to end on a positive note):

The bad

- No wave 2 release  or modernised Battletome

- No indication they will fix our bad rules (Warchanter buff duration, Waaagh! duration, the hot mess that is the Weirdnob Shaman)

- No new tools to work with to compete with modern Battletome armies (no deep striking, Allegiance abilities etc remain the same)

- Shaving 20 points off Ardboyz isn't going to stop them flapping away ineffectually at a Stardrake, or being turned into a green paste by Witch Elves

The good

- Potential to fit Gordrakk in a big batallion now?  Maximum Krumpin'!

- Potential to stack extra attacks from the various types of Waaaagh! depending on how exactly Command Abilities work

- Potential to use the Fungoid for hyper mobility on your Krusha(s), which also adds more mortal wounds (if Allies can use Command Abilities)

- Two or even Three Maw Krusha armies could become more viable, which again would add more mortal wounds in

 

So overall it is clearly a good thing, whether it is good enough to have us mixing it with the big boys (and girls) remains to be seen. 

But I think the potential is there for some happy little Megabosses.

For me the big question is how liberal they are with the Command Abilities.  The potential is there for some devastating Waaagh! combos and I know from experience that the retreat / run + charge from the wee man is incredibly powerful on the Maw Krusha.  We could end up with a hard hitting, hyper mobile army, slamming into people left and right and causing mortal wounds every time.  Time will tell!

Let's end on a bit more speculation...

The wishlist

- FAQs to tidy up our annoying rules

- Points drop for the Shaman (for the love of Gork...)

- Allies can use Command Abilities if you have sufficient Command Points (or however it works)

- Destruction spell lore to include a spell to increase rend, making us the hard hitting army we are supposed to be

- And a little further down the track...how about that Wave 2 please? ?

[PlasticCraic]

The stacking Command Abilities is an interesting one.  The Greenskinz Warboss and Wyvern have exactly the same name and wording, so if you can't stack the same ability then they won't stack.

They also have the same name as the Megaboss (on foot), but completely different wording and conditions.  Grey area?

The Megaboss on Maw Krusha and Gordrakk are both completely different, so they would be fine under this scenario.  I would speculate that you could use both of them, and one of the ones named Waaagh!, but whether you could use the Ironjawz one and one of the Greenskinz one (same name for different abilities) would be a matter of some contention.

And sorry to disagree with you @Skabnoze but I don't think that they should prevent us using them.  Stacking the same one, no, but using the different Waaagh!-type abilities we have is legit imo. 

The fact that GW have failed to support Destruction as a GA and given us very few Command Abilities that all do similar things should not preclude us from using what we do have.  It's completely unreasonable to give the other GAs such a huge range of scope of CAs and limit Destruction to basically +1 attack for Orruks and Beastclaw Raiders reroll charges.

If they don't want us to use the tools we have, then they need to give us a broader range of tools to work with.

[Artobans Ghost]

23 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

@Skabnoze, I think it would be great to see some Spiderfang love!

I'd love to see them get some focus.  Whether it'll happen tomorrow - I'm less convinced unfortunately.

They could easily release the Scuttlings from ST as a kit and give the catapult its own base and warscroll (a la Avatar of Khaine) for example.  I'm on record about how I'd love to see them all given the Bonesplitterz keyword too and get some synergies going (they don't have bones so it's legit thematically).  I think there's loads you could do with them and I'd love to see it.

 

This?

I also emailed GW asking that they let scuttlers be in the spiderfangs as they are part arachnid. A warscroll and keyword plus a slot  on Azyr would make my day as 40 of them are converging on my home from around the globe to join my fledgling spider riders and bosses. 

This is just an aside but I really want arachnarock’s and the spiderfangs venom call for 3. eBay search and all that but the deal as far as I can see is the arachnaroch and 10 spiders for $80 when just the arachnaroch is $70 (?!)  Excellent deal as spiders are about $40 for 10. 

[Superninja]

GW needs to give Destruction a ton more options.  Stormcast pretty much have more options than an entire grand alliance. sad.