Thostos Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 4 minutes ago, Sception said: Re: summonable. The more I think about it, the more worried I am. Banners are free, but heroes are expensive. Filling out your hero slots to make use of this ability will literally cost you entire units up front. Banners can't be sniped out of our units, but 5 wound heroes can be removed with contemptuous ease in this game, likely targeted for removal before your now less numerous than before units have even begun to take damage that they could even try to regenerate. I hope I'm wrong, but this has the potential to turn out to be a *hard* nerf. Yeah,its very harsh. Really hope to see a new summoning mechanic in the battletome along the lines of what Nurgle got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Spoilers... Ouch on the ethereal nerf as well, as it now ignores all save modifiers, not just rend, which mostly amounts to no mystic shield on ghosty stuff. Black knights may be at least partially fixed, but wight kings look mostly unchanged apart from the summony thing and losing the banner. And the knight of shrouds strikes me as utterly forgettable, just another 5 wound melee hero with no weird spwcial rules, little removed from a wight king or cairne wraith. Blood knights aren't summonable, so i'm not sure how much the whole summon thing will actually be able to do for dedicated soulblight armies. And regular vamp lords no longer seem to have a signature spell. Arkhan can reroll the summoning d3s, nagash also can reroll the d3s, and can pick five units. Not much else seems different about them stat or ability wise. Obviously not everything has leaked, and I haven't seen everything that has, but so far what I have seen is feeling like a nerf rather than a buff for death overall. A LOT is going to hinge on allegiance traits, formations, and spell lores. Far more so than I'm comfortable with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5kaven5lave Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 If this is due for the 10th night we be getting a week-until-preorder type heads-up about it this weekend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angrycontra Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 I wouldn't call anything for nerfs just yet. We have no points, no allegiance abilities (as far as I understand, resurrecting guys is built-in heroes, not ability for allegiance and even if this is not the case, there's more abilities for sure), nurgle already has shown how powerful artifacts can be, spell lores will also help and finally stat changes can be huge thing aswell. Also ethereal change isn't completely nerf, nurgle has tons of non-rend ways to ****** up save rolls so that is buff against them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Extra spells and allegiance abilities wont help heroes if we cant keep them on the table. Like i said, theres still muxh not yet seen, and it could yet go either way, but the initial leaks arent getting off on the best foot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracothjay Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 I'm no going to run away with this and cry. I still have high hopes and sitting patiently. but, knight of shrouds.......the creators said he's tasty in the design video? PLEASE GIVE US A DEADLY HERO GW, PLEASE! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Maybe the heralds have extra rules in malign portents, but his scroll is just s generic 5 wound melee hero. Ethereal, a few attacks with a decent weapon, the new wound healing deal, an alright but iirc not mind blowing command ability affecting nighthaunt stuff. Very much a nighthaunt version on a wight king, nothing more elaborate than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smavo Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 The lack of other key scrolls is concerning. No FeC scrolls yet and the ones we have like the necromancer will no longer be able to use vanheels on flayers or ghouls or horrors. Which will hit them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Havent seen the necro yet. Vanhels no longer hits mordants? If so that's cruel and uncalled for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smavo Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Yea. Vanheels now effects summonable keyword. So arkhan also lost the ability to have it cast on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Bluh. And the hits keep coming. Seems I was right about thus book being written at the same time as GH, by an author who had similar thought about death needing multiple nerfs. I'm surprised curse of years made it through unchanged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmir Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 On 13-1-2018 at 9:11 AM, Elmir said: I don't mind banners still resurrecting the basic models. Rather than the rather boring 6+ save mechanic, a system where heroes within 6" of a unit can duplicate the effect of the banner (putting his own magical/necromantic weight behind it if you will) would be a lot more interesting from a game-play point of view. Several heroes putting effort in to resurrect a particularly devastated block of skellies sounds a lot more fun than trying to roll 6+ results... Quoting myself here... Not entirely as I predicted (since banners are gone), but ressurecting done by heroes so you put more focus on particular units is exactly what I hoped for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 And if AoS gets a 40k style hero shielding rule, the new summoning system might even become workable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmir Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 I think people are underestimating how good that nighthaunt hero is for smaller games though... +1 to hit on units doing mortals on 6+ is pretty damn powerfull. But yeah, character protection rules are needed... My vampire lord is nicknamed "lord pincoushion" at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimnaud Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Okay, so the leaks so far are not great. But lets take a breath before collectively rushing to Hot Topic. GW proved with Maggotkin that they can write battletomes with lots of character, different ways to play, and lots of options. So unless we're going to assume that GW just wants to ****** on Death for some reason, it's a pretty safe bet that these nerfs and changes will be at least balanced out with something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smavo Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 It is just a lil frustrating that we have seen nothing yet officially. And before giving us something like a preview of our battle tomb they go and announce a new order faction tomb. While the stuff we are seeing is just "leaks" that very very few people can get via the app. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmir Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Was there a range leaked for resurrecting those models through heroes? If not, this doesn't sound like too harsh a nerf to me. In our games, banners end up doing very little because the units either: *Haven't taken casualties *Are so heavily decimated that 1D6 (hugely swingy) will make little difference. Being able to pump all your hero abilties into a single unit to give it up to 5D3 resurrections (not to mention the absolute shennanigans this can cause in terms of creeping up a battlefield in a conga line) can be a ton better if you ask me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smucreo Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Thank god I still have lots of Death stuff intact. Hoping for some light here, but it's getting tiring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimnaud Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 6 minutes ago, Smavo said: It is just a lil frustrating that we have seen nothing yet officially. And before giving us something like a preview of our battle tomb they go and announce a new order faction tomb. While the stuff we are seeing is just "leaks" that very very few people can get via the app. Ohh, I agree completely. I've gone beyond impatience and frustration to a quiet place in my mind. I'm bringing a Death army to a tournament in three weeks, so I'm absolutely at the edge of my seat. But lets not forget that there is also a big FAQ coming in the next week, so nerfs might be game wide as well rather than just targeting Death. 2 minutes ago, Elmir said: Being able to pump all your hero abilties into a single unit to give it up to 5D3 resurrections (not to mention the absolute shennanigans this can cause in terms of creeping up a battlefield in a conga line) can be a ton better if you ask me. It works wonders in FEC. Just remains to be seen which units gets the keyword "SUMMONABLE". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamopower Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Thematically Undead have always been about powerful heroes, so I like these updates and I do belive they'll have some sort of protection judgig by how well desigbed the books have been lately. Bit sad about no new models, my Soulblight army doesn't still become a reality (not interested in the current models at all). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotrek Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 4 minutes ago, Elmir said: Was there a range leaked for resurrecting those models through heroes? If not, this doesn't sound like too harsh a nerf to me. In our games, banners end up doing very little because the units either: *Haven't taken casualties *Are so heavily decimated that 1D6 (hugely swingy) will make little difference. Being able to pump all your hero abilties into a single unit to give it up to 5D3 resurrections (not to mention the absolute shennanigans this can cause in terms of creeping up a battlefield in a conga line) can be a ton better if you ask me. Range varies depending on the hero. Wight kings affect 2 units in 6" (if memory serves), vampires do 3 units within 12", mortarchs do 4 within 18" amd nagash does 5 anywhere he damn well pleases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmir Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 It was leaked... All units that have a ressurection banner/could be summoned with a few notable exceptions: Morghasts Blood knights The zombie dragon/terrorgheist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smucreo Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 When are we supposed to get more info? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neinball Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 I've not seen the warscroll for any 'Summonable' units yet, do they still have spell to summon them as part of their warscroll? I wonder how much summoning has changed as Arkhan no longer has his +1 to summoning and Nagash no longer doubles the number of models he sets up when he successfully casts a summoning spell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuneBrush Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Don't forget we don't yet know what allegiance abilities will do - wouldn't surprise me if Legion of Sacrement didn't buff Deathly Invocation in some way. As I've just put in a blog post (where I've collected the leaked warscrolls so far), I'm still excited but a bit worried about Death armies now being dependant upon easily sniped characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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