pez5767 Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 While I am a long time and current WHFB player and 40k player, I've come to realize that I have no interest in playing against any of the legacy armies when I play AoS. I find the new fluff and realms to be so full of life and engaging that when I put my Stormcast down on the field of battle, the thought of lining them up against Men of the Emprire or Bretonnia, just leaves me feeling hollow. What is worse, I feel the same about any army that hasn't specifically been the focus of part of the Realmgates or a source book to this point. So, no High Elves, Dark Elves, Wood Elves (which haven't actually been in the books... it's just tree spirits), Tomb Kings, Dwarves, etc. If it has only existed as an army from WHFB, I don't want to see it in AoS. Am I wrong to feel this way? Is it really about the narrative, or am I just kidding myself and being a snob? Does anyone else share share these views and want to keep their AoS experience pure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronWilson Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 I don't think anyone can your "idea" what the game should be, so I don't think anyone can tell you it's wrong to feel that way. It's a subjective view and if you prefer only the newer AoS stuff on the table that's not wrong. Me, personally I don't mind. I run Slaves to Darkness and they slot in just about anywhere in the fantasy universe. The only thing I would see is the old warscrolls don't seem quite as balanced as the new stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamonRafael Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 I will go with a "It depends". When it came to random games, I'm totally fine to have Bretonnia against me - we're setting up a random war where free people try to stop Chaos, they call themselves Bretonnians or pinco-pallino's is totally the same If we're playing a campaign, then maybe I'll be more "strict" and only allow "legacy" armies if they have a proper fluff which really fits in the new world. By the way, is it me or there are no more horses in AoS ? (I'm not considering Slaves to darkness' as all their horses are somehow mutated) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuneBrush Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 I think the issue is more GW have only exposed the tip of the iceberg with what is out there and we can fully expect new models to compliment classic ranges - we've seen it with the Flesh Eater Courts and now with the "nature" element of wood elves. Completely see where you're coming from though. 8 minutes ago, DamonRafael said: By the way, is it me or there are no more horses in AoS ? (I'm not considering Slaves to darkness' as all their horses are somehow mutated) Reckon they're all hiding, ready to sally forth in a future tome - either that or they've been eaten by the Ogors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Druchiilord94 Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 Personally i prefers the look of my dark elves to any of the new AoS races with the exception of sylvaneth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pforson Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 I can understand your point of view, because the aesthetic and feel of the game has changed so much. However, the game still needs to be as inclusive as possible, especially considering all the time and money people have invested in their armies. How do you feel about armies that cross the divide? For example, Skaven. Pretty much all of the models are in GA:C, they are part of the fluff and one of the clansalready has a Battletome. However, most Skaven players tend to play all the Clans mixed together. Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shane Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 3 hours ago, DamonRafael said: By the way, is it me or there are no more horses in AoS ? (I'm not considering Slaves to darkness' as all their horses are somehow mutated) Don't need horses when you're being cast down as a lightning bolt/burrowing under ground/teleporting/moving dimensions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polarbear Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 Not sure how much of it is legit and how much of it is from the old assumptions I went in with, but I too find it doesn't look quite right to see Stormcast next to Brettonians. Not a big deal though, and I think new paint jobs, round bases and a mention in the fluff is all it really takes to make the old stuff make sense again. I've never been more into Pestilens as I am now, and they've been around forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucio Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 Fluff wise it's not hard to justify as some fragment of the world that was that survived to pass on those traditions and now those plucky Bretonians can continue to be a derritive work of the legends of King Arthur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warhammernerd Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 Your being a snob. Pls. 'pure' Aosexit anyone.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amysrevenge Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 It's a hard sell to me. I can dig "this is how I want to play". I have a lot of trouble with "this is how I want YOU to play". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daedalus81 Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 I don't care about old or new...I just really, really want new stuff for acanites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperHappyTime Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 Ive kept them separate. But for most post-ET I've been living in my own little world. If anything this Summer Campaign has actually made me interested in AoS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Tomlin Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 6 hours ago, Druchiilord94 said: Personally i prefers the look of my dark elves to any of the new AoS races with the exception of sylvaneth I'm so excited to see what they do with my beloved Druchii. At the moment I'm all over the place playing with all 4 Grand Alliances (all new AoS stuff) and am just waiting for these to give me something that truly holds my attention....I just don't want them coming too soon so that I can actually finish some projects beforehand!! Re the OP; that's all well and good, I get what you're saying and it's totally cool to play that way. However I'm not sure how much joy you'll have convincing all your opponents who are packing old WFB armies! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amysrevenge Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 Ultimately, it's still all pretty arbitrary what is considered "legacy" and what isn't. You can't possibly tell me there's a compelling story reason why a Dwarf Cannon is perfectly fine, but a Dwarf Bolt Thrower breaks immersion - the choice of one being included in Grand Alliance: Order and the other not was based 100% solely on the material out of which the model was crafted, not some fluff notion that in the Mortal Realms there are no such things as bolt throwers. (And the biggest pull out of immersion isn't fighting against something that doesn't feel like it fits in the Mortal Realms - it's good guys fighting against other good guys. You have to reach a LONG way to justify a Stormcast vs. Stormcast battle, probably something about training in the arenas up in Azyr, which isn't very satisfying. It's much easier to rationalize coming across pockets of Men living in the style of the World That Was.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmimzie Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 I think legacy wise, i kind of feel similar to the OP. I don't know some games jsut ruin my fluff lmao. Like if i go against nagash with a zombie horde army... and the zombies eat him up.... v.v it's just so silly to me. Though from a getting new people into the game stand point, i don't like legacy armies because new players will see them as a barrier to entry. Imagine your at the table playing your game with your BRets vs Tomb kings. Some new player comes in and love the look of the tomb kings... he'll be crestfallen to find out it's not availible to him. It can also set up a trap for this same player. Lets say he does Ebay up his army, but then maybe a few months later he wants this other model.... but no one is selling... He now has a army that's just difficult to expand with out lots of kit bash. FOr both of these reasons i think legacy is a bad idea, but i understand why GW did it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperHappyTime Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 42 minutes ago, amysrevenge said: Ultimately, it's still all pretty arbitrary what is considered "legacy" and what isn't. You can't possibly tell me there's a compelling story reason why a Dwarf Cannon is perfectly fine, but a Dwarf Bolt Thrower breaks immersion - the choice of one being included in Grand Alliance: Order and the other not was based 100% solely on the material out of which the model was crafted, not some fluff notion that in the Mortal Realms there are no such things as bolt throwers. I called "legacy" anything that was present in the old world, or Warhammer 8th Edition. Chaos was developed early in AoS as a big player, but Death and Destruction were mostly missing for a while. Elves were GONE, non-existent. The Dwarves shared a style with the pro-Slayers notion, but majority looked very different from what Fyreslayers were. So keeping them separate was pretty easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amysrevenge Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 10 minutes ago, SuperHappyTime said: I called "legacy" anything that was present in the old world, or Warhammer 8th Edition. Wowie, that is tight. So we're talking Stormcast, most of the Bloodbound (bye bye Skullcrushers), most of the Ironjawz (bye bye Ardboyz) and Fyreslayers then. Maybe the Flesheaters, but that's really just re-naming things we already had. Not much of a choice there lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrstimpson38 Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 I wish I had so many opponents that I could be picky about what armies I play against! Honestly, I'd be fine playing against a "counts as X" list made entirely out of legos. Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daedalus81 Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 I'm ok playing those types of armies, but it gets to be a little much when someone starts using out of scale toy cars to represent battle buggies in 40K and other nonsense. If you're doing counts as...at least try to avoid making it visually reprehensible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pez5767 Posted June 29, 2016 Author Share Posted June 29, 2016 Wow, a lot of great responses here, guys. Thanks for chiming in. Also, glad to know I'm not the only one. I think the conflict regarding this issue, for me, is exactly the conflict between the 2 ideas armysrevenge laid out here (which I totally agree with): 6 hours ago, amysrevenge said: It's a hard sell to me. I can dig "this is how I want to play". I have a lot of trouble with "this is how I want YOU to play". On one hand, I want to play in the Realms described in the AoS fluff (which, as a matter of opinion, probably isn't an issue)... On the other hand, my desire to only play in the new AoS Super High-Fantasy Realms limits how/who I am interested in playing with or against. I'm not sure how to effectively find a compromise between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pez5767 Posted June 29, 2016 Author Share Posted June 29, 2016 10 hours ago, pforson said: I can understand your point of view, because the aesthetic and feel of the game has changed so much. However, the game still needs to be as inclusive as possible, especially considering all the time and money people have invested in their armies. How do you feel about armies that cross the divide? For example, Skaven. Pretty much all of the models are in GA:C, they are part of the fluff and one of the clansalready has a Battletome. However, most Skaven players tend to play all the Clans mixed together. Pete I don't have an issue with armies that "cross the divide." Especially since many of those armies (notably the Lizardmen/Seraphon) have been give a place in the fluff, as have Chaos (in almost all of it's forms), Lizards, Skaven (mostly), etc.. It is the armies that are totally absent from the fluff that I have a hard time with. The Empire, Bretonians, Elves (of all variety), classic/traditional dwarves (who have been updated), Ogres, Tomb Kings... all of these seem really out of place to me. The armies who were steeped in the mythos of the Old World just don't feel right fighting super lightning Knights (Stormcasts) anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pforson Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 I think we just need to be patient. I'm pretty sure armies like Elves, Dwarfs and Ogres will be updated and made to fit into the new fluff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Alec Posted June 29, 2016 Share Posted June 29, 2016 I've fallen in love with the options that AoS gives me. I already have a solid idea for my dwarfs, now Dispossessed Duardin. Lots of OOP models, but once it's all on round bases with a thorough theme it shouldn't be an issue. LIkewise with my TK stuff. I've based them in a snowy city theme on round bases. That should be far enough from the old world that it's clearly new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pez5767 Posted June 29, 2016 Author Share Posted June 29, 2016 3 hours ago, pforson said: I think we just need to be patient. I'm pretty sure armies like Elves, Dwarfs and Ogres will be updated and made to fit into the new fluff. I totally agree. I"m sure in time this will become a non-issue, but for now I feel myself torn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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