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Gaz Taylor

The Shadespire News and Rumour Thread

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23 hours ago, Biboune said:

So why Garrek's reavers will still have a chances to be a valid band: they still have 3 good/average fighters, they are still prety fast and they could be quite good against the Skavens: almost as fast, probably hitting harder, doesn't care about the stipeclaw's potential cleave. It is ture that getting inspired is harder and harder for the Reavers.

I do see Your point. But even if the Clanrats have a petionioner statline with SPD 5, Skaven seem to be the winner here. I know I know, we know very little of the furrballs yet. But being faster than Reavers, having a better inspire-trigger, teleportation into enemy territory (RIP Denial and Contained bilds) and a waaaay better leader (even without knowing the inspired Spiteclaw), Skaven just seem very strong compared to Reavers. And no one knows their unique objectives, ploys and upgreades yet, so tehre might be more to come.

A little powercreep is always intentional from a designer/seller perspective, so Reavers will likely be a bit weaker UNTIL the next wave hits. Lets not forget that there is a Khorne warband yet to come and we still do not know, if they share a cardpool. Same goes for SCE btw. Fyreslayers might just be a tad better at playing a slow defensive game. But than again, this might very well change soon. Se even if Skaven turn out to be better/more vertasile than Reavers, Reavers might have an awesome comeback in the near future!

 

TL;DR: Even if Skaven turn out to be better than Reavers in most aspects, Reavers might go on par again once the other Khorne warband is released.

Edited by Hesa_First
typo

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Actually I think Reavers will have a good matchup against Skaven. They already have a good matchup against Skeletons, and I'm expecting Skaven to be very similar - Garrek will be able to farm Glory off of small Rats, Saek will be a screaming missile to take out the named dudes. If they rez in your backfield, Reavers are fast enough to go back and smash them, especially if you send back Karsus with his extra reach. I could be wrong, but I'm imagining Clanrats to just be Petitioners with higher speed, so I'm thinking Reavers will have a field day in the matchup.

We'll see though!

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I am predicting 'illusory fighter' to be a staple in most if not all decks to counter the skaven and other speedy warbands.

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Really like the Fyreslayer warband. Definitely a lot of cool poses in there.

It's one I'm going to pick up for sure when it comes out.

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Reavers will be fine. Unless Krrk is amazing, Bloodreavers are stronger fighters out of the gate than Skaven are. Catching Spiteclaw will be much easier than catching the Warden, as Skaven can't block as much space, and any combo of Garrek/Karsus/Saek (or Saek+Targor/Arnulf) can kill him. Also, it'll be very easy to trigger the Reaver's inspire condition against Skaven - while they *can* bring fighters back, they'll want to do so sparingly because it eats into their actions and they don't get the same bonus out of it that the Guard do. I can imagine a scenario where a Skaven player is pushed into reviving Clanrats to stop the Reavers from inspiring, which means that the Reaver player is entirely directing the flow of the game.

In fact, they'll probably indirectly help Bloodreavers in a tournament environment because they're another warband with access to Cleave right away (albeit on a crit.) They'll cause headaches for Stormcast and Orruks and maybe put a dent in some of the Reaver's hardest matchups.

Also: it's premature to talk about power creep because the first eight Shadespire warbands were all designed together: it's one big set of cards, as evidenced by the numbers on each. We can't really get power creep until we're onto wave 2, and I imagine that's still months away.

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2 hours ago, CJPT said:

Also: it's premature to talk about power creep because the first eight Shadespire warbands were all designed together: it's one big set of cards, as evidenced by the numbers on each. We can't really get power creep until we're onto wave 2, and I imagine that's still months away.

All that the numbers on cards tell is a certain pattern: How many cards are are coming with each expansion. They in no way give evidence, that even the cards from the Khorne Warriors/SC Hunters were final the moment the Coreset was released. As I said, much is open to speculation, we don't really know anything from the upcoming warbands. But in competative games, a little powercreep is always intentional from wave to wave. There are a lot of reasons why, regarding marketing, gameplay and metashifts. I don't see any reason, why shadespire should be an exception. Even if all the cards were ready since early 2016, wich I highly doubt, there is nothing contradicting powercreep, as the release schedule was surely planned out from the getgo.

I do see that the matchup Reavers vs. Skaven might be in the Reavers favour. And that a lot of deck archetypes Reavers were struggling against now need some adjusting with Skaven in mind.I honestly hadn't thought of shadowbuffs, thanks for clearing that out for me.

But still, from what we know till now (wich again is almost nothing at all), Skaven seem to have a lot of good mathups and as I said they are faster than Reavers, having a better inspire-trigger, can teleport into enemy territory and have a waybetter leader. To me Skaven seem to have similar traits but with some advantages, resulting in way more way better matchups for Skaven than Reavers.

Again, I do understand that Skaven might cause a metashift in the Reavers favour. But if a warband is strong enough to cause a massive metashift/rendering some state of the art deck archetypes useless, that kind of underlines my statement.

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15 minutes ago, Hesa_First said:

But in competative games, a little powercreep is always intentional from wave to wave

If this opinion were ever proven true of Shadespire, I'd quit on the spot.

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18 hours ago, Hesa_First said:

But still, from what we know till now (wich again is almost nothing at all), Skaven seem to have a lot of good mathups and as I said they are faster than Reavers, having a better inspire-trigger, can teleport into enemy territory and have a waybetter leader. To me Skaven seem to have similar traits but with some advantages, resulting in way more way better matchups for Skaven than Reavers.

I can definitely see where you're coming from. I'm reserving judgement until we've seen the Skaven's objective cards - that's a huge difference-maker, here. The Reavers have very high scoring potential, even in bad matchups, and this more or less makes up for all of their other weaknesses. They're the least popular warband and yet end up doing pretty well in most tournaments on this basis. Movement, damage, inspire conditions etc are important, but for me point scoring potential is the thing that really makes a warband work.

Not sure I agree that the Skaven inspire trigger is better than the Reaver one, incidentally. It's very chancy. You'll probably get one or two inspires relatively easy, but inspiring all 5 rats is going to take some work. You can also be completely screwed by a bad first hand/mulligan, and it limits your deck building options. 

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9 hours ago, CJPT said:

Not sure I agree that the Skaven inspire trigger is better than the Reaver one, incidentally. It's very chancy. You'll probably get one or two inspires relatively easy, but inspiring all 5 rats is going to take some work. You can also be completely screwed by a bad first hand/mulligan, and it limits your deck building options. 

Keep in mind it works when any ploy is played on them, even by the opponent.  This means your opponent may be hesitant to do things to you as a Skaven player that he normally does to others. 

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I think it's a shame that next two warbands after Fyrelslayers and Skaven are again Khorne and SCE. With so many factions that need some love (Daughters of Khaine, Wanderers,Nurgle,Free People, Vampires) we are getting another round of Khorne vs SCE

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More death and destruction are definitely needed- flesheater courts could work well and provide good courtier models; an ogor warband would be a tricky one to balance though- maybe a maneater and three gnoblars? However, i played marienburg in mordheim for so long that i would love a free peoples warband - just a bunch of nornal dudes thinking 'what the **** am i doing here!'

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Khorne and SCE might just be more represented in Shadespire, while the next location might have another force that has more presence. 

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I guess the interesting thing will be at least Stormcast are kinda 'done' with their battleline troops from Age of Sigmar. They don't really have anywhere else to draw from in the current range, as a Judicator warband is unlikely to make sense.

Chaos on the other hand I fully expect after Bloodbound are done to cycle into another chaos god, most likely Nurgle or Tzeentch. I actually think a Slaanesh Seekers warbands would be the most interesting to go into, as the backstory obviously is they're hunting for Slaanesh.

 

That being said, we don't really know what Games Workshops plans are for Shadespire post Blood Warriors and Vanguard Stormcast. Given we get 60 cards each expansion, do we know whether or not those 2 warbands will finish off the full 400~ cards (or however many there were) for Shadespire?

Or can we expect something else to happen after those two are released? Such as card only purchase, or perhaps some other unknown warbands to round out the Shadespire set.

Overall, I guess we've probably still got a little while to wait. The Chosen Axes and Skaven came out a bit slower than I expected, and I wonder if we're going to have to wait another 3 months for the Blood Warriors and Vanguard Stormcast to arrive.

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I really hope they do keep Warhammer Underworlds going, as its pretty popular and rated the best ruleset they have ever done. A new city setting, new boards, and another bunch of warbands with a bit more diversity would be ace

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On 3.2.2018 at 11:19 PM, tchu said:

Khorne and SCE might just be more represented in Shadespire, while the next location might have another force that has more presence. 

I'd like that, but I think it's a vain hope. SCE and Chaos are just the favourite childs of GW (not least because they always sell well) and you'll be sure there'll be plenty of both in every wave.

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10 hours ago, tom_gore said:

I'd like that, but I think it's a vain hope. SCE and Chaos are just the favourite childs of GW (not least because they always sell well) and you'll be sure there'll be plenty of both in every wave.

Though it's hard to tell if SCE sell well because they are popular or because they are included in pretty much every boxed set.

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13 minutes ago, Envyus said:

Though it's hard to tell if SCE sell well because they are popular or because they are included in pretty much every boxed set.

If you present enough cool deals and strong units/battalions its bound to sell well ;)

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