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Crispen

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Hi Guys,

So I'm working on getting something finished for a tournament next month. I was originally going to take spiderfang grots, but with work and uni I'm not able to find the time to paint them to the standard I want. So I've decided to finish a serphon army I started at the end of 8th edition. 

In 8th edition I used to like playing with Gor-Rok and sticking him in a unit of Saurus to soak up some of the dmg from enemy heroes. I wanted to continue doing something similar in AOS, so decided to go with the sunclaw starhost. The battallion seems pretty good value for what it offers. You're getting rend -1 on your celestite weapons and an additional attack with your jaws/shields. You also gain dmg 2 when attacking chaos daemons with the celestite weapons. So its a considerable buff to the average saurus warrior.  Not to mention you're getting an additional artefact due to taking a battalion and fulfilling the battleline requirement for 2k points.

 

With my core chosen I decided to try and work in some buff elements for the saurus. I decided to take a slann for his ability to cast 3 spells a turn, skink starpriest for the +1 to hit buff and an old blood on foot for the re-rolls of a 1 to wound for nearby saurus. 

I then decided to add a bastilidon with solar engine for some range support and an engine of the gods. I still had 300pts left over and was thinking of taking a carnosaur or something similar, but I've got my carnosaur kitted out as an oldblood so will go with a normal steg instead. The list currently looks like this:

Slann Starmaster - 260pts
Old blood on foot - great weapon - 100pts
Skink starpriest - 100pts

Sunclaw starhost - 80pts
Sunblood - 120pts - General
30 Saurus - 300pts
10 Saurus - 100pts
10 Saurus - 100pts

Bastilidon - Solar Engine - 300pts
Engine of the gods - 240pts
Stegadon - sunfire thrower - 260pts

The idea is you throw all the buffs on the 30 man saurus unit and send them in to try and wreck something. They potentially have 4 attacks ech. 2 hitting on 2s, re-rolling and wounding on 4s re-rolling 1s and another 2 hitting on 3s re-rolling and wounding on 4s re-rolling 1s. Even if for some reason the saurus fail you still have some decent monsters in the list to help carry you to a minor victory.

I predict the list will lose to a dedicated shooting or combat list as its more of a take all comers list. In those cases I'd be hoping to win on scenario or fighting for a minor victory/loss.

Let me know what you guys think, I've only ever played one game with seraphon and in that I lasered off my opponents whole army by buffing the bastilidon. So it wasn't really a good gauge on how the army actually performs.

I'll post some painting progress stuff shortly.

Thanks!

Crispen

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Crispen, i like your list the base is very solid. i think you have a good selection of characters, i think the battalion is a good one but i think a few other choices could be better. this is also dependent on what you have. but personally i like the other version of the Bastilidon better because it does guaranteed mortal wounds. yes at short range but it is also every combat. the shooting version in my experience does do much, unless you can buff it with rerolls to hit/would, then its awesome. but i cant deny the long range threat no matter what.... I would consider dropping both the Bastilidon and the Engine for some Chameleon Skinks, I think they are one of the best units in the game, for character assassination or objective grabbing. also a skink priest or 2 with priestly trapping. this means on a 4+ every units within 8" rerolls failed save rolls. and i think at that point you could fit in a Scar Vet on Carnosaur, I dont think anyone would fault you for using an old model as something else, its a dude riding a carnosaur its good enough for most people... those are just some thoughts, take them or leave them i wont be offended. But like i said i liked your list, and i think it is pretty strong.

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I might take a Starseer as well for the rerolls.

One problem for Seraphon is the lack of -2 rend in general and especially at range.

I remain unconvinced by the Bastiladon's damage output for the cost, especially as the range isn't great either unless you summon it in.

I'm struggling to find any bargains in the list (other than possibly Skinks and regular Saurus).

One massive problem is that I feel summoning is needed in the list, but in the current meta having only one Slaan to cast spells seems reckless - this leaves the options of having 2 (not ideal as the Slaan's own Spell is only valuable vs Daemons) or taking Kroak (who is marginally tougher on the assumption that they take turn one and shoot him). This pushes you to take an Eternity Warden as well.

I would have thought that slamming down a Wall of Temple Guard with the regular Slaan's command ability would be a good way to go against the pew pew hordes.

Annoying that Kroxigor don't have a rend -2 weapon, Seraphon don't have much need of crowd clearance.

Edited by Nico
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17 hours ago, Funnybunny said:

Crispen, i like your list the base is very solid. i think you have a good selection of characters, i think the battalion is a good one but i think a few other choices could be better. this is also dependent on what you have. but personally i like the other version of the Bastilidon better because it does guaranteed mortal wounds. yes at short range but it is also every combat. the shooting version in my experience does do much, unless you can buff it with rerolls to hit/would, then its awesome. but i cant deny the long range threat no matter what.... I would consider dropping both the Bastilidon and the Engine for some Chameleon Skinks, I think they are one of the best units in the game, for character assassination or objective grabbing. also a skink priest or 2 with priestly trapping. this means on a 4+ every units within 8" rerolls failed save rolls. and i think at that point you could fit in a Scar Vet on Carnosaur, I dont think anyone would fault you for using an old model as something else, its a dude riding a carnosaur its good enough for most people... those are just some thoughts, take them or leave them i wont be offended. But like i said i liked your list, and i think it is pretty strong.

Thanks for the feedback Funnybunny, I decided today to go with the skar vet on carno and just let my opponents know its one armed with the spear and they'll have to imagine he has a shield haha. I'd take chameleon skinks, but alas I don't have the models. I'll invest in some if I enjoy the way the army plays at the tournament. Looking forward to giving this sunblood a whirl, dude seems pretty beastly for 120pts.

I'd take the snake bastilidon loadout, but I think if I did I might get mortal wounded to death too easily by thundertusks and not have any way to knock a couple wounds off them at range so they have to roll D6. Last tournament I saw 3 players running 2, so that's why the solar bastilidon is in the list.

 

17 hours ago, Nico said:

I might take a Starseer as well for the rerolls.

One problem for Seraphon is the lack of -2 rend in general and especially at range.

I remain unconvinced by the Bastiladon's damage output for the cost, especially as the range isn't great either unless you summon it in.

I'm struggling to find any bargains in the list (other than possibly Skinks and regular Saurus).

One massive problem is that I feel summoning is needed in the list, but in the current meta having only one Slaan to cast spells seems reckless - this leaves the options of having 2 (not ideal as the Slaan's own Spell is only valuable vs Daemons) or taking Kroak (who is marginally tougher on the assumption that they take turn one and shoot him). This pushes you to take an Eternity Warden as well.

I would have thought that slamming down a Wall of Temple Guard with the regular Slaan's command ability would be a good way to go against the pew pew hordes.

Annoying that Kroxigor don't have a rend -2 weapon, Seraphon don't have much need of crowd clearance.

I agree with you on the lack of rend -2 and I think krox should definitely have -2. I own 3 and found them a little underwhelming when I used them.

I hadn't looked at the starseer, thats an interesting mechanic with the re-rolls. 160pts for him though does seem pricey. Have you had a chance to use him Nico? Is he worth it?

I agree that the templeguard option with the slann command ability is a good idea. I unfortunately don't own any temple guard. I also want to try the sunblood command trait which is re-rolls to hit on a marked unit within 15inches for saurus in combat. that seems pretty good for most saurus units in general with their mostly 4s to hit across the board.

I had thought about summoning as well, but like you thought that it might be risky with only a single slann and a lot of people running a decent amount of long range shooting.

 

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IMO the solar engine Bastiladon is much better than the Ark of Sotek one in most cases.

As for Krox: I like how they look but they haven't been very good in any match I played them. Might be coincidence though.

The Starseer... I don't know. From reading its warscroll I don't like it much at that cost, but I see it on a lot of lists by other people. Might get one and try it myself.

Engine of the Gods sucks because of the summoning nerf. Not worth it IMO, but a Slann makes it decent at least.

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I think the Starseer can be worth it - but it's a much more marginal choice if it cannot reroll initiative rolls as is the case in the current SCGT pack.

Now that Kairos has lost his ability to alter the initiative roll, I see no reason for stopping the other (less powerful - rerolls or adjustments, not straight to a 6) methods for altering the initiative. People may say that this is overpowered, but the units in question are grotesquely overcosted without that ability (160! for the Lords of the Lodge; have you ever seen a Coven Throne at a tournament? I used one at Firestorm Fours in one game).

As I found out at Heat One, my opponent could reroll them almost as often as I could when i used the Starseer due to the guess the number under the fez mini-game.

Furthermore, taking a single drop battalion to get a 50% chance of a double turn could be seen as overpowered by some armies (many of which cannot even possibly take a single drop army, like Ironjawz or Grots or most Mixed Chaos or Mixed Order lists - using one of these reroll mechanics as a soft counter to the double turn risk arguably improves balance (assuming that the points costs aren't too cheap).

Edited by Nico
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The main reason why I'd like to take the Starseer is the Heavenswatch Starhost.

I kinda like how it is a mix between the Shadowstrike Starhost and the Thunderquake Starhost. No clue whether it is worth it though.

Edited by Aginor
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8 hours ago, Aginor said:

IMO the solar engine Bastiladon is much better than the Ark of Sotek one in most cases.

As for Krox: I like how they look but they haven't been very good in any match I played them. Might be coincidence though.

The Starseer... I don't know. From reading its warscroll I don't like it much at that cost, but I see it on a lot of lists by other people. Might get one and try it myself.

Engine of the Gods sucks because of the summoning nerf. Not worth it IMO, but a Slann makes it decent at least.

I agree the summoning nerf is a little rough on the engine, but its 20pts cheaper then a regular steg and on average when unwounded has the potential to deal D6 mortal wounds with a 25inch rnge, of course its all theory what I'm saying as I've not put it to the test yet haha. The steg itself is about the same strength wise to the refular steg in CC as well. Also an additional turn on that lucky 18 could be a game changer in some match ups.

 

7 hours ago, Nico said:

I think the Starseer can be worth it - but it's a much more marginal choice if it cannot reroll initiative rolls as is the case in the current SCGT pack.

Now that Kairos has lost his ability to alter the initiative roll, I see no reason for stopping the other (less powerful - rerolls or adjustments, not straight to a 6) methods for altering the initiative. People may say that this is overpowered, but the units in question are grotesquely overcosted without that ability (160! for the Lords of the Lodge; have you ever seen a Coven Throne at a tournament? I used one at Firestorm Fours in one game).

As I found out at Heat One, my opponent could reroll them almost as often as I could when i used the Starseer due to the guess the number under the fez mini-game.

Furthermore, taking a single drop battalion to get a 50% chance of a double turn could be seen as overpowered by some armies (many of which cannot even possibly take a single drop army, like Ironjawz or Grots or most Mixed Chaos or Mixed Order lists - using one of these reroll mechanics as a soft counter to the double turn risk arguably improves balance (assuming that the points costs aren't too cheap).

I do like the idea of using the curse of fates to dictate the turn. Could be pretty fun. I'd be dropping the normal steg or skar vet on carno and replacing it with the starseer and a unit of 5 saurus cav. Not sure if that would be a good move or not as that would make the list a little pillow like. I could drop the starpriest instead, but then I'd be losing the +1 to hit buff... Might not be needed with the sunblood command ability. I'll think on it some more haha.

Thanks guys for all the suggestions and input! Keeping me pumped while I destroy the basing I did for the squares (a sad moment cause I did water effects and all on them haha).

 

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