Dotification

Rather than keeping a strict allegiance in order to unlock additional BattleLine units, it would be nice if GW leaned more towards specific Generals doing as such (e.g. Grot Boss on Gigantic Spider allowing Spider Riders as BattleLine, Orruk Megaboss for 'Ardboyz, etc. etc.) I also agree with pretty much everything "someone2040" posted further up-thread, particularly them re-balancing the basic allegiances, traits, & artefacts. Oh, & more granularity in adding on models past the unit minimum (at least let me take grots in units of 10, greatswords in groups of 5, & so on.)

Some good potential mods here, care to expand on: -1. is the hiring of Heroes only for a single battle? Why don't they (primarily in a narrative sense) stick around afterwards?? Why not forgo them entirely?? -2. So reducing them to 0 Wounds means they're just kinda hobbled, or stunned until they get back up? Why not incapacitated/potentially bleeding out for the rest of the battle unless otherwise healed?? -3. Someone could cheat this a bit by taking a Kurnoth Hunter w/ greatbow & a cheap trio of Eternal Guard--hence I think it's smart to limit by both model count & gold cost/"budget." I'm also a big fan of bottle's provisional suggestion that each starting Wound beyond the 1st is 10 xp they've already gained, so you can't power-level "filth" like Kurnoths & Khorgoraths.

Do the Britbong T.O.'s have players also bring a few terrain pieces to help fill out the tables?? Isn't that a thing somewhere??? As far as Citadel Woods/forests blocking LoS . . . I could go either way, given that Sylvaneth players have 3 different ways of summoning them. My buddy and I also drop what we call "scatter terrain" as in random taller bushes to give Heroes/lone units like Gorgers some cover here and there.

How about codifying/recommending a minimum amount of 10 terrain pieces for the table for Matched Play, like they're doing @ the SCGT? 6 pieces need to be large/medium size (GW woods/Skull Keep/ Obsidian Archway etc or an equivalent scratch built/alternative terrain piece)  One of the large pieces needs to be a structure of some sort  4 pieces need to be smaller (these could be a pair of Realm gates, walls and fences or a small shack or a garden of Morr statue on dias for example)  We recommend that everyone brings a set of realmgates/proxies for them. http://heelanhammer.com/SCGT/ I for one think this would help with the spamming of 30" greatbows & the like; Kurnoth Hunters for Order, and Tzaangor Enlightened(?) for Chaos. Getting double-turned by a shooting & spell-heavy army when you have no cover to break LoS isn't very fun . . .

Yeah, that's pretty close to what I was thinking (also hiring unit members in multiples of 3 so you get squad upgrade) -Grimwrath Berserker -3 HG Berserkers w/ Flamestrike Poleaxes (better to get 2 to Wound rolls rather than overkill individual models w/ broadaxes, & 16 gold apiece isn't bad compared to Phoenix Guard, etc. etc.) -then fill out your list w/ Vulkite Berzerkers for cheap bodies. Proceed to run at people, using as much scatter cover as you can. Everyone gets a short-medium range attack, & a 2nd Save vs. ALL Wounds (handy once people see how bent Mortal Wounds scale down to this level!) Auric Hearthguarders aren't bad for their points, but their won't be any MONSTERS to shoot other than maybe a Khorgorath??

I would also hesitate in nerfing melee heroes, as 1 or 2 arcane bolts will chase off/down even MegaBosses... I would also say someone playing with Fyreslayers' beta points/gold costs could really swing a, sigh, "Hinterlands meta" as their ability to shrug off mortal wounds around their Heroes would discourage people spamming cheap Wizards. As for my own warband, I figured a Witch Hunter + Warrior Priest + Handgunners & Dwarf Miners would be rather fluffy yet effective, as lore focuses on the struggle vs. Tzeentch cults in City of Secrets. Also, the idea of additional Wounds past the 1st placing your elites & Heroes further up the XP table seems real solid to my buddy & me.

As for Stormvermin ganging up on someone, I could see being within 2", as I recall that's the range of their halberds.

I thought I would finally post some feedback from last week's trial game with my fellow powergamer. MoonClan Grot Warboss - 40 MoonClan Grot Shaman (MVP) - 30 x5 MoonClan Squig Hoppers - 80 vs. Nomad Prince - 40 Wayfinder - 50 x7 Eternal Guards - 56 BattlePlan: The Ritual--no bonus to your roll for having a Wizard or Priest within 3" of it, or anyone at all?? 20 is a high target # to hit then. Anyways . . . I let him go first, & he proceeded to biff his Hail of Doom Arrow & only do 1 un-saved wound on my General, the Warboss w/ squig, leaving him on a single Wound. The game really swung when I soon managed to get a double turn, and wiped out both of his 3W Heroes with Arcane Bolts + a lil shooting from the Boss's prodder. My next turn I started deleting his grouped up Eternal Guard with Curse of Da Band Wound, after my Shammy got over a bad 'shroom, while the Squig Hoppers hit a flank to stop the Ritual. Sometime during the battle an Eternal Guard charged my Boss & punched thru 1 last Wound to avenge his superiors. On turn #6(?)I wiped him out, but let him have 1 last d6 roll to see if he could hit 20, needing a 5 or 6, which he did. I said that seemed like (Pyrrhic) Minor Victory to me & we shook hands. Our thought was me getting a double turn of spellcasting & shooting really wiped him out, as most Heroes are not Wizards and cannot unbind. When you downscale their Wounds like that, then Arcane Bolt really messes them up/wipes them out. I did it with a 30 gold Shaman that could wipe heroes and any mooks standing near him, while our Tzeentch guy could do it for 14 gold! We then brainstormed how to balance out spells vs Heroes. 1st thought; give Heroes back their full Wounds. Heroes only having 2-4 Wounds while starting @ Level 5, thus leveling so much slower than their minions, means they could be surpassed by their mooks with good luck. But if they still only cost half their gold then they would prolly be too good. 2nd thought; Heroes get some kind of unbind roll for spells targetting them, prolly at a small penalty so they don't outshine actual Wizards, flavored however (dodge, ward save, etc. etc.) As the rules currently stand, we thought a Witch Hunter + 2 Kurnoth Hunters would just ruin whatever they came up against. As the point/gold costs and leveling curves favor high Wound Level 1 models like the Hunters, Stormfiends, Orruk Brutes, Khorgoraths, & so on. 1-2 of them + a cheap Hero & maybe a couple cheap mooks for objectives/chaff seem the way to go.

I assume the Destruction Command Trait: Rampaging Destroyers triggers in the Hero Phase? "No more than half your Warband may be Heroes" rule is by model-count, or points, or . . . both?? Love the rules pack, prolly gonna try it out tomorrow! Thx for your hard work!

Hey Chris thanks for the heads-up--I've been balls-deep in Total War: Warhammer lately, so I haven't been by here in a bit! I really like the drummer, it looks like he's punching a stinkin' grot "off-camera!" I'll be sure to post my BB/'AB conversions once I start Ironjawzing for an upcoming escalation league. Also, sorry the BOBB/'Ardnob Brute-ish list didn't work out for you better! BTW do you have a thread like this for your Stormcast, or pix posted anywhere?? (FYI I'm not on Twitter, yet...) Also, have you seen Arbaal's work? http://www.tga.community/forums/topic/3088-the-arbaals-iron-waaaaagh/

*I still run the old legacy/compendium IronJawz BigMob from time to time--Black Orcs hitting on 3's (around the BOBB) & wounding on 2's while moving an inch faster than the 'Ardboyz iteration is good times, though I wish they were BattleLine by default!

With a lack of fall-winter-spring releases, it looks like the AoS community is hibernating a lil bit. Most of us 'Ardnobs are waiting to see if the Gargant gets an IRONJAWZ keyword as he'll be in 2* of our warscroll battalions by then. Hopefully!--I would love to see how the different hobbyists 'arden him up! As far as sourcing shields for the 'Ardboyz, would Ogor gutplates taken as battle-trophies work? It's too bad the BloodBowl team doesn't have any extra shields on their sprues. Maybe some Ogryn shields from 40k, if they're not too big?? As an American (Minneapolis, MN), I'm a bit jealous of all the AoS tournaments you Brits put on for each other over there! You can really tell you guys are GW's home market! My club is a road trip's distance within Waupaca, but the rest of my mates have the Infinity bug this winter, plus there wasn't space for us in the AoS narrative event last time I checked, & who knows if there would be enough drop-outs for all 5-6 of us to fit in... Has everyone given feedback for The General's HB 2.0 yet? I've been lobbying for cheaper Ruglud's Armoured Boyz to join our little faction FWIW, amongst rebalanced WeirdNobs, Maw-Krushas, & Gore-gruntas. It feels like there's so much focus on the Megaboss & his Brutes, 'A-Boyz & Warchanters within the competitive community, as the smaller half of our faction underwhelms for their point costs. Which is a pity as they are way too sharp to not see the table more than they do currently! Well, enough of my blabbering, point is; there are plenty of vicarious lurkers like me following this thread, & the tales of your battles are appreciated! Your army is well converted & painted, & you sound like a bro to play, & quite the ale-guzzler too, so you make a good representative of our community. That being said, don't feel compelled to post here, just know that it's appreciated either way.

If people want to do unusual alliances of need/common foe then multiplayer games are great for that, & can be fluffy too with a bit of brainstorming. Allowing people to cherry-pick from more than 1 grand alliance in matched play would be more trouble than it's worth. Use Open Play rules with your club-mates if you're that keen on your Chaos Lord bribing FyreSlayer mercs with Ur-Gold. I hope GW puts out additions/addendums to factions still lacking Allegiance rules &/or Path of Glory tables (most existing warband tables could use another balance pass, & most basic troops need higher unit size caps to be on a more even footing, for example.) More specific to the G.A.'s I play: Greenskins & their Boar Boyz seem to need another Wound/something else to be on par with the rest of their allied factions. Orruk Warboss & Orruk Shaman are over-costed @ 140 each. Orruk Boar Chariot is a tad pricey. Idol of Mork/Gork as well. Non-BattleLine* Ruglud's Armoured Orcs are waaay overcosted for shooting only 12"! Orruk WeirdNob is also over-priced giving his proclivity for hurting his mates & failing his spells. Aleguzzler Gargants need a path to getting the IronJawz keyword, & if it's only that Battleforce/whatever's battalion that grants it, well they should point those for Matched Play too. Ruglud's mob getting the IronJaws keyword too would give the faction a touch of shooting finally, more so with a cost-reduction. Given the rarity of the pewter models, I would be keen to see players converting them out of 'Ardboyz, & maybe other GW Orks. Speaking of 'Ardboyz, clarification on how to use shields like theirs & the Tzaangors' would be handy. Whatever the "Burn/tear it down Command/General trait is handy against Sylvaneth, but otherwise everyone seems to take Ravager for the +2" to Hero Phase movement, as the random range for Bellowing Tyrant is too risky/restrictive IMHO. Kunnin Rukk could use a points increase so it's not such an auto-include for anyone dabbling around within Destruction. Your opponent rolling bucket-fulls of dice in multiple shooting phases should have more of an opportunity cost, compared to say... Brettonia's Peasant Bowmen doing it only once per game. I haven't been super impressed with Order's Command/General Traits & Artefacts, but I feel their expansive array of unit & Hero choices mostly balances that out, as it may for Chaos as well seemingly. Most commonly it made sense to either pick Reckless to increase reliability of runs & charges, & spread around +1 Damage artefacts, with maybe a Quicksilver one if the frontline Hero/Leader is mounted on a Monster/Behemoth, though +1 Attack has its moments & proponents too. I hear that Judicators could stand to be 10-20 points pricier, if so then the Crossbow variant should be a comparatively cheaper separate war-scroll, as they Wound worse, don't Rend, & you have to keep them much closer but also still to get any damage out of them. The special mortal wounding crossbow is underwhelming compared to its bow counterpart. I would not see the harm in letting people buy individual models above & beyond the minimum size for the unit. It's nice to buy 13 or 14 Dryads, or 32-33 Grots of whatever mob, so if a random one dies, then it's not such a jarring decrease in combat effectiveness. It's one of the few things I miss about 8th Ed., now that we can customize our Heroes/Leaders, & are starting to get more spell lores. I also agree that the Rule of 1 should apply to successful casting of spells, but also to prayers & their like. Not everyone has the restraint to not stack RunePriest's +Rend prayers, &/or Stormcast Lord Castellants' versions of Mystic Shields. If it waddles & quacks like a spell, then effectively it's a spell!--even if the Priest(?) can't unbind for whatever reason (sorry Lord Relictors, at least you're cheap for a Stormcast, & it left an open niche for another semi-new model to sell!) I'm on the fence for Duardin Thunderers & Quarrelers gaining open Battle-line status, more so with the restriction of having to take the Warden King as your General, then... yeah! FyreSlayers in general could use some point reductions, especially whomever "gives" the opposing player his choice of units to receive the Ur-Gold buff/debuff. Why not pick a backline War Machine/Artillery piece for yourself??? Add/switch whatever keyword allegiance to make the Start Collecting NightHaunts box work as an army nucleus. Do we have any way of knowing this thread of feedback is reaching the right people @ GW?? *I agree we all could use more BattleLine, considering some factions like Skryre get StormFiends as B.-L.