Duardin Miners

[HunterB]

Hi,

 

Am I missing something?

 

I could have sworn the miners were still around for Order armies but looking in the GA:O book I cannot see them there.

They are still in the App though.

As they have the Dispossesed and Duardin keywords can I still pick them in a GA:O army for matched play?

 

Thanks

[Dez]

They are still around, I used 2 units of them last night I don't own the GA: O book, but you can download their Warscroll from the GW site still. 

Keywords: ORDER, DUARDIN, DISPOSSESSED, MINERS

[HunterB]

thats cool, I knew they were still around as they are in the App and stuff just was not sure if they counted as a Legacy unit or not.

[Turragor]

They are compendium in the GHB afaik

[Kramer]

Yes it's been a compendium unit at least since the ghb.

[Dotification]

So do you get 10 Miners + the pony cart for the 120 points, or does it count as one of your 10 models??

[Double Misfire]

32 minutes ago, Dotification said:

So do you get 10 Miners + the pony cart for the 120 points, or does it count as one of your 10 models??

You get 10 models, one of which can be the Mining Cart. So nine dwarfs and a cart if you choose to take one.

[Dotification]

Ohh, OK, so it would scale better the larger the unit is then. 

[Turragor]

Nah 10 and then a cart ontop. Like a cherry.

Pitched battle profiles are the only ones with points and true limits. Their profile says "10 miners" min. The warscroll says 'consists of 10 or more models' and the cart is optional.

[Marc Wilson]

I've always played 10 miners plus the cart. 14 wounds for 120 points is pretty decent. Out-Stormcasting the Stormcasts. If they're guns had a 9" range they'd be awesome.

 

[Kramer]

1 hour ago, Double Misfire said:

You get 10 models, one of which can be the Mining Cart. So nine dwarfs and a cart if you choose to take one.

Nope 10 miners + 1 cart per unit if you want it. 

[BaldoBeardo]

No, the unit is miners. GHB doesn't specify 10 miners minimum. It's minimum unit size (model count) 10 for the miners unit.

The warscroll for miners says 10 or more models, not miners.

The cart is a model.

The description of the cart says it has 4 wounds instead of 1. There's no statline for a mining cart, which by implication means you 'upgrade' a miner.

This is further implied by the fact it says the cart is armed with a donkey bite, but cannot use.any other weapons. Pointless statement as they've just stated it has a donkey bite, unless they're clarifying it loses the pickaxe attack.

So 9 miners plus cart, or 10 miners.

Same logic for battle pilgrims.

 

[Dez]

Read it again. If it's an upgrade that uses a model, it says so. It says so right in the Warcroll for miners. 

Quote

mining cArt

A unit of Miners can have one Mining Cart. A Mining Cart has 4 Wounds instead of 1. It is pulled by a stubborn Mule that will Bite any foe that annoys it – it cannot attack with any other weapons. A Mining Cart is lled with all sorts of mining equipment that the miners can use in battle – whilst a unit of Miners includes
a Mining Cart they gain the Blasting Charges attack. Some Mining Carts also carry Steam Harpoons.

Quote

stAndArd beArer

Models in this unit may be Standard Bearers. Standard Bearers can carry either a Runic Icon or a Clan Banner.

A unit of Miners can have one Mining Cart.

Models in this unit may be Standard Bearers.

Even in other Warscrolls, it's specified that units 'can be'. 

So, enjoy some shooting and 4 free wounds

[Galas]

Yeah. 

If the warscrol was "A model in this unit may be replaced by a Mining cart" or something like that, then yes, it will be 9 miners and 1 cart.

[Dotification]

Yeah, not a bad deal then for 120 points then--a nice way to get a deep-strike without using J. Bugman!!  

Do you people like the 1/2-BattleShock Banner or the ignore enemy spells on a 5+ Runic Icon better??

[BaldoBeardo]

Standard bearers etc. are still the same statline and equipment. They just gain an ability.

The cart is a different statline, different equipment.

But that over-complicates things, doesn't change the core;

It's a model. It moves, it can attack, be attacked, block movement etc.

You pay for 10 models. If you want the cart, then you have 9 miners.

[Double Misfire]

Thanks @BaldoBeardo for saying everything I couldn't be bothered to type on account of being tried last night. I play Dwarfs/Dispossessed and can't think of any conceivable way to interpret the matched play rules as 120 points for 10 miners and a cart, not 10 miners or 9 miners and a cart.

5 hours ago, Dotification said:

Yeah, not a bad deal then for 120 points then--a nice way to get a deep-strike without using J. Bugman!!  

Do you people like the 1/2-BattleShock Banner or the ignore enemy spells on a 5+ Runic Icon better??

Both. If you're stuck playing with comp that forces you to choose, half battleshock by a mile, the save against spells is way too situational, and most of the time spells that cause damage are gonna be hitting your characters and warmachine crews.

[Dez]

You can't 'imply' rules. You need to read through them carefully. My comparison is how the rule for the cart reads reads vs how the rule for the standard reads. It says a unit may take a cart, not be a cart.

[BaldoBeardo]

Which is fine. Disregard implications.

The cart is a model.
The GHB charges units by number of models. No caveats, no exceptions by type.

There's nothing in the rules that supports that the cart is *not* a *model* in a miner unit and therefore exempt from being paid for.



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[Dez]

The GHB specifically charges by unit. Look up the under strength rule.

[BaldoBeardo]

You are charged by unit.
I haven't said you aren't. I'm saying the cart is not a freebie.

Miners cost X pts for a unit of Y models.
The cart is a model, so if you buy the minimum unit size of 10, it's cart plus 9 miners.

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[Dez]

I don't know of anywhere in the rules where that is specified like in days of old Warhammer. This is a concept carried over from playing Warhammer/40K, not Age of Sigmar. Read the Warscrolls independent of conceptions about how individual models are calculated, GW have taken that bit out of the game. You pay points for units, not for upgrades. If there is to be a cost for an upgrade, they make a separate Warscrolls like Gryph Hounds.

[BaldoBeardo]

I am not saying you specifically pay for upgrades.
I am saying that the cart is a model.
In a unit of miners.
Miner units cost 120pts per whole/part 10-count.
If you take 10 Miners and add the cart, that is 11 models and costs 240pts.
If you take 9 miners and add the cart, that is 10 models and costs 120.
That's no hangover thinking from anything.

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[Dez]

I'm saying your argument that the cart is a model has nothing to do with the rules

[BaldoBeardo]

It's actually page 1 of the 4 page rules...

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