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ways to deal with gunlines?


MightyOwl

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I am just wondering how people deal with armies with lots of shooting?  I was wondering about using Arkhan (his +1 to summoning spells and bonus from Khenash-an should make sure the spell goes off reliably) to summon Morghast Harbingers to hit the gunlines? has anyone tried something similar to this?

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usually I give them the first turn if I can't move fast enough. I take high consideration of the repairs ahd objectives and I kill first the supporters. And I summon to gain fast distraction and breaking in their lines.

But strategy changes based on the situation, field and opponent list

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Coven Throne with Cloak of Mist and Shadows is pretty good as it can teleport 12" forward in the hero phase and (hopefully) move and flying charge over the chaff. The lack of rend on the 25 attacks isn't usually a problem against warmachine crews or missile troops.

Hex Wraiths buffed by a Vampire Lord on Abyssal Terror can pull a similar trick.

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Think 1st turn and hope for the double turn after replenishing numbers is the most sensible option. There's a bad dice podcast that's quite informative on this exact topic.

I have tried Cloak of shadows into the middle of them and red fury the unit to dust? Can be great if you get the rolls otherwise complete kamikaze move.

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Not that vulnerable. Two cannons firing 2 shots each, hitting on 6s, re-rolling misses for engineer will still only get 1.2 hits on her; so say 1 hit with the 3+ to wound.

Accompanying volley gun and organ gun, firing three barrels each and with no jams (engineers) will get average 9 shots each. With -2 to hit from bats and twilight's allure combo that'll be 6 hits / 4 wounds.

Dark Mist gives an unmodified save against all these hits so she should take between 2 and 6 wounds from an entire battery. 

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Yes but when I read how to deal with gunelines I was thinking more about the really nasty stuff like 3 thundertusks, 40 archer kuning rukk, 12 hunters + hurricanum, 9 skyfires etc... etc.. 

So I guess the answer really depends that you are up against in your local meta (as always).

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1 hour ago, Ennio Mordini said:

With -2 to hit from bats and twilight's allure combo that'll be 6 hits / 4 wounds.

Only when within 15" of an unwounded Neferata and 12" of the Bats. The Bats are easy to take down and Neffy will have trouble imposing her debuff without being aggressive, setting her up for a counter-charge.

My point was that an opening salvo of a gun-heavy list can kill her. I've lost VLoZDs to such lists in the first turn by simply being hammered by cannon and other long-ranged units before I can get Mystic Shield up.

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1 hour ago, Ennio Mordini said:

Not that vulnerable. Two cannons firing 2 shots each, hitting on 6s, re-rolling misses for engineer will still only get 1.2 hits on her; so say 1 hit with the 3+ to wound.

Accompanying volley gun and organ gun, firing three barrels each and with no jams (engineers) will get average 9 shots each. With -2 to hit from bats and twilight's allure combo that'll be 6 hits / 4 wounds.

Dark Mist gives an unmodified save against all these hits so she should take between 2 and 6 wounds from an entire battery. 

 

Lets say Spear Chukkas then. Range 36".  Two attacks each. Stats 3/3/d3 when targeting heroes. If opponent has two or more, they can reroll failed hits.

If the opponent has four, Neferata can kiss her ass goodbye.

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2 hours ago, Sedraxis said:

I think right now there is very little we (most factions as well) can do against very dedicated ranged lists if there isn't enough terrain on the table.

And even with terrain, there's often very little we can do to mitigate heavy shooting.

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1 hour ago, Andreas said:

I reiterate my suggestion above. How about 100+ Skellies? Anyone tried it against really strong shooting?

The problem is getting there with Skellies. 40 Arrer Boyz in a Kunnin Ruck will shot down 40+ skeletons per turn even with a 5+ deathless minion buff. Two turns of shooting and it's not looking good for the fleshless ones.

Of course if you happen to snipe the savage big boss with a couple of SSC then the ruck's firepower is massively reduced.

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Maybe 100+ zombies, backed by a few necromancers (hiding at the back of course)? If you summon a zombie conga-line, then merge it, you have a shot at getting your 60-strong unit into combat on turn 1. Admittedly, most of the models won't be in striking range, but charge + pile-in is faster than regular move + run, especially since you pile-in on both turns (twice on your turn, if you get Vanhel's Danse). (And you remove casualties from the back, of course).

Inspiring presence is probably the best command trait you can get if you're anticipating those kinds of casualties, and necromancers are harder to snipe than most characters in that points bracket.

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2 hours ago, Ennio Mordini said:

The problem is getting there with Skellies. 40 Arrer Boyz in a Kunnin Ruck will shot down 40+ skeletons per turn even with a 5+ deathless minion buff. Two turns of shooting and it's not looking good for the fleshless ones.

Of course if you happen to snipe the savage big boss with a couple of SSC then the ruck's firepower is massively reduced.

Havn't faced the full rukk so I dont know the math but the skeleton also have 5+ save and throw in a wight with banner it's 5+ 5+ 6+ in the skeleton best case scenario. You would need to make them take 100+ save rolls to kill then outright without battleshock and its only 320pt for each unit of 40.

Getting there is of course a problem but you might not need to kill them to win the scenario, just need to survive with some of your 100+ skeletons to score on the objectives. And its only 40% of your army.

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1 hour ago, CoffeeGrunt said:

Hiding at the back isn't really a possibility against most ranged lists. Not unless you've got very favourable cover.

Forgive my inexperience, but why not?

I'm not suggesting it as a sure-fire way to survive, but surely it would either reduce the amount of shooting that can reach you, or force the enemy to move forward?

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