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Horrors Removed at Once


hobgoblinclub

Question

In matched play, when pink horrors are killed and there's blue horrors nearby, which have already taken casualties, you can add models to the unit to replace the dead blues without spending reinforcement points.

My question is, can you do this when the unit of pink horrors is removed 'at once' by a 'rule'? The wording seems to be different when the unit is destroyed in this way. I'm wondering if the second paragraph is supposed to clarify what happens if the last model in the pink horror unit is killed, but just goes a long winded way about it. Surely, whether or not pink horrors lose 1 or 10 models, the resulting blues would still seek out a nearby friendly unit. 

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You have to pay the points. In matched play, any ability that allows you to bring in a new model or unit must come from reinforcement points. Restoration of existing units like some chaos/undead units can do, doesn't require this, and can only restore up the max starting levels paid for. In the case you are adding a new unit that you didn't pay for, it should be clear.

There are two things happening with this ability. One is an ability that replenishes or creates a new unit. If the Pink suffers wounds, you can either add Blues to replentish a unit that has suffered losses, up to its max, or (if you have reinforcement pts) add a new unit of blues. Its an either or situation.  If the entire remaining models in a Pink unit is destroyed, you can set up new blues again only with reinforcement pts. 

Even if say a 10 strong unit of pinks was previously reduced to 1 and in a successive round it died, you COULD set up a new unit (with reserve pts) of two Blues. If you are saying if a 10 strong unit is killed do you get the choice of replentishing a unit of Blue or creating a new one (with pts from reserve) AND get a new unit from the last paragraph, I'd say no. It still defaults to the either/or, you shouldn't get both (in my humble opinion) 

 

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It's been pointed out elsewhere that I've been reading this wrong. 

The answer to my question 'Can I add them to another unit if they're all killed in one go?' is, yes. 

The reason being that the second paragraph isn't about normal means of death at all.

Look at the first paragraph. It attempts to make it clear that pink horrors killed in the hero, shooting or combat phase always result in blue horrors being to be set up as a new unit OR added to another unit, which has taken casualties. 

The words 'If a rule' in the second paragraph imply any sort of special rule that removes a unit rather than normal damage. 

Thus, even if a unit of pink horrors loses all of its remaining models 'at once' to wounds/mortal wounds in the hero, shooting or combat phases, you retain the option to add the resulting blue horrors to nearby units. 

Does that make sense? When that was pointed out to me, it made the existence and purpose of the confusing second paragraph much clearer. 

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On a related now, how exactly are the new horrors paid for? If 4 Pinks die and I create a unit of 8 Blues, do I pay 40 pts as per the "under-strength" rule? If so, what happens if I need to add 4 more in the next phase? Another 40 points?

How have others been playing this?

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Yeah. You'd pay for a full unit each time. I dismissed this option out of hand, as I thought it'd be foolish to pay for minis that you didn't get. However, Mark Wildman used blue horrors from his reinforcement pool when he came third at Sheffield Slaughter. He reckoned the advantage of putting a handful down nearby when pinks died, outweighed not getting a full ten models. He was using them to tie up enemy units in combat. I'm definitely going to be trying it. 

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Yes - I think this sub-Rule covers things like the unit getting lost in warp as part of a Battleplan or the like.

Two hard questions discussed in the main Let's Chat DoT thread are: is Split mandatory if you have the points (literally yes, but purposively no); and whether having created a new unit of (say) 4 Blues for 50 points, you can then top that unit up to a strength of 10 models (as that's what you paid for) but no higher.

We eventually came out concluding that you could top up to 10 (or if 6 died you could pay 100, get 12 and then try to top up to 20). The main reasons were the rule against absurdity; and purposively you should get what you pay for (but not more). I'd also add that keeping track of the exact created size of multiple units of Blues would be a serious chore.

 

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