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Ben

Legion Of Azgorh Mega-Thread

460 posts in this topic

15 hours ago, spenson said:

So I just played my first game with the chaos dwarfs at my local GW yesterday evening. I didn't take any picture but I'll try to make a quick summary. I also didn't take notes so I don't remember everything perfectly.

I used : 

Allegiance: Chaos
Daemonsmith (100)
- General
- Darkforged Weapon
- Trait: Lord of War
- Artefact: Chaos Talisman
30 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (240)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
3 x Bull Centaur Renders (180)
- Scalding Hand Weapon & Spiteshield (because I played WYSIWYG)
Iron Daemon War Engine (180)

Total: 1000

I played against some Ironjaws. I don't remember his items, but the list was a megaboss, a warchanter, 2x10 ardboyz and 2x5 brutes. He went a bit easy on me with the list since it was my first game with the dwarfs and he used an old list without the bataillon.

We rolled a lot of terrain but it didn't matter that much because I didn't have a lot of range and he had nothing that could shoot.

I deployed my ironsworn at the center (2 lines of 13 + the others behind), with the fireglaives and the demonsmith behind them. I put the centaurs on the right and the iron daemon on my left flank.

He deployed his army only 6" from the edge of the table to make sure that I wouldn't be able to shoot him very effectively during the first 2 turns. 

We stopped at the end of the 4th turn because it was time to close. The only units left were his wounded megaboss, a warchanter, 5 brutes (one with 1 hp left) and 2 ardboys, while I had 25 fireglaives, my demonsmith with 1 hp and 8 ironsworn.

We decided that the initiative roll would basically decide the winner. If he got the turn his boss would finish my ironsworn while his brutes killed my demonsmith and at least 10 fireglaives. One the other hand if I got the turn I had 25 shots with my fireglaives, 2 bombs left + the Blood of Hashut to  kill what was left of his army.

 

I learned some valuable lessons during this battle.

- I love this army a lot. It's really sturdy but also effective during the shooting and combat phase. Though I have to admit that I got lucky I played against a close combat army and not a shooty one because of the short range and slow movement of my list.

- A pack of 30 ironsworn with mystic shield and inspiring presence does a lot of work. I spread them a lot so my oppenent had a hard time getting around them.

- I got greedy with the iron daemon and underestimated the brutes. I moved it forward during the second turn to shoot the ardboyz, but the brutes behind them charged me the turn after. They managed to deal 10 wounds in a single combat phase and I almost lost 180 points just to kill 2 ardboyz...

- I forgot my battle trait during the first 3 turns. I played against the only employee at my local shop so we had to pause the game everytime there was a customer and we both forgot a few abilities.

- The centaurs are ok, but I'm not sure I used them that well. My ironsworn were fighting agains the ardboyz and the brutes from the left side, which left some untouched ardboyz and brutes in front of my centaurs on the right side. I charged the ardboyz from the flank so some of them couldn't hit me. I got some good results but the brutes killed all the centaurs during the following turn

- I underestimated how short the range of the fireglaives is. They were behind the ironsworn so I had to move in  range of enemy charge to let them shoot.

Try this, haha:

Allegiance: Chaos
Infernal Guard Castellan (120)
- General
- Darkforged Great Weapon
- Trait: Cunning Deceiver
Infernal Guard Battle Standard Bearer (100)
- Artefact: Crown of Conquest
30 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (240)
30 x Infernal Guard Ironsworn (240)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)
10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)

Total: 1000/2000

It actually does fairly well, since the enemy can't take you out on the first turn.  I sometimes give the Castellan a Chaos Talisman for extra tankiness.  100 wounds all at 4+ save and all those Fireglaive shots with the +1 to wound and rerolls is nasty.

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FERRUMITE    24

Guys, I had an idea, and dang if it doesn't get my desire to kitbash raging like crazy. Obviously I'd greenstuff coiled beards and file down swirly runes and stuff. Do you think it's possible?

plastic chorf.jpg

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On 30.9.2017 at 2:23 AM, FERRUMITE said:

Guys, I had an idea, and dang if it doesn't get my desire to kitbash raging like crazy. Obviously I'd greenstuff coiled beards and file down swirly runes and stuff. Do you think it's possible?

plastic chorf.jpg

That could TOTALLY work. My friend did something similar with the Irondrakes. 

Unfortunately he moved away so I can't provide pictures. 
I wonder which kit would be best to bash them together. Maybe rather Chaos Warriors?

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Kaleb Daark    389
On 30/09/2017 at 1:23 AM, FERRUMITE said:

Guys, I had an idea, and dang if it doesn't get my desire to kitbash raging like crazy. Obviously I'd greenstuff coiled beards and file down swirly runes and stuff. Do you think it's possible?

plastic chorf.jpg

I had a friend who moved to Baltimore from the uk and he's adopted the 'dang' thang!

id go with reavers as you have the more dynamic arms.  But judging from your test model, all you really need is the heads from the army of choice, which on that case I'd go with perhaps warrior or knight heads maybe?

great idea though and yes, it totally works. :)

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Killax    991

I think you might get the best results from kitbashing the Ironbreakers with Marauders and Marauder Horseman. The Chaos Shields for the Marauders are nice and round and your provided with enough helmets to make it work if you use some greenstuff here and there. Have seen this in the past aswell and quite liked it actually!

Edit: 

Some inspiration:
600px-Warrior-rank-front.jpg
Aubin_chaos-dwarf_warriors1.jpg
Xander-bfsp3.jpg
 

Edited by Killax
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General question:

Why would anybody take Ironsworn ever? The Fireglaive shooters do basically the same and get a mid range attack with it. 

Or am I seriously overlooking something?

 

EDIT: YES, I did overlook something. :-)

 

I am very interested in this army and am trying to build some lists. I find the dychotomy of Centaurs and Infantry interesting, but don't seem to get something decent in. 

Edited by Frankenfreund

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FERRUMITE    24

My bad phone camera aside, I tried to turn down contrast and warmness so it was more visible, but the test model for my Fireglaives is complete, now I have to do the rest based off this!

photo_2017-10-01_14-09-41.jpg

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fued    20
On 29/09/2017 at 10:47 AM, fued said:

 

ill post up a bat rep

Standard bearer 

Daemon smith

30 iron sworn

10 fireglaives

10 fireglaives

4 iron daemons

4 magma cannons

1 khorgorath

 

 

 game 1 :major loss to beastclaw in gift from the heavens,  his list was a stonehorn, some mournfang, a thundertusk and a huge amount of frost wolves, he was good player who just stick to objectives to the detriment of everything else. i forgot inspiring presence and it cost me 10 dwarves and probably the game on the first turn, as the mournfangs managed to kill 11 and battleshock rolled a 6 killing another 8, leaving the mournfangs out of combat and able to go grab the objective for a single turn. Turns out that if you can grab the objective for a single turn in gift from the heavens, you win if you can just hold your own by letting  wolves block the way the rest of the game lol. one magma cannon didn't do much because i deployed in the wrong part (really need at least 1 fast unit... a bad meteor spot can mess up this army because its slow)

 

game 2 :major win vs sylvaneth gnalroot. Started well with shooting off his venator before it did too much and jumping everything in my army onto the objectives, but then drycha came up and damn near 1 shot my army with the amount of 6s she was rolling. Took her off straight away, and tried to pick off hunters, but they just kept regrowing. My shooting was absolutely terrible, and i never ended up killing 2 units of hunters, i didnt do enough wounds. At one point his treelord ancient teleported up the back, and thanks to fireglaives/ironsworns mortal wound leader ability i was able to nuke him pretty hard. Overall, he just didnt have the damage with 6 hunters to push me off objectives and claim the win (thanks 3+ iron daemon!).


game 3: major victory. good fyreslayers player, it was epic match up on a volcano fire board. i managed to kill everything but 1 unit(even tho i forgot the magma cannons get 2 dice on 10+ models!), i was able to snipe out heroes, which really hurts fyreslayers, he nearly won but got a bit greedy for the easy turn 4 win with keeping a unit on an objective but right near me to get a longer pilein on his big squad of 30, which backfired when my magma cannons managed to shoot them off and let me win by a single point. (need to remember magma cannons ability, and always check up on rules of units, shooting out heroes can be amazing)

game 4: vs nighthaunt. turn 1 he charges me with 9 spirit hosts with damned and morghasts (ouch) managing to do 2-3 wounds on every single iron daemon and magma cannon. in return i got a double turn and my magmas did over 20 wounds alone... so good when they roll well. called it at turn 3 because all that was left was 2 heroes. was painful to see what good rolling can make this army do...


game 5 vs flesh eaters, huge amounts of the big flying horror things. we camped off a f ew turns before he engaged, he killed around 22 of the ironsworn in a row, and managed to heavily wound an iron daemon. I proceeded to shoot the big unit not on the objective because im silly. his terrorgeist then managed to kill an iron daemon and 2 magmas in a single turn(feeding frenzy AND the 6 for wounding 6 auto mortal wounds), then he won priority and did it again ouch. not my game but by the end of it managed to catch back up on kill points but way too far behind on objectives. (for this one, i really needed to push up to him, and not let him engage me on the meteor. I was scared of the big bats, but once they got in combat they werent all that scary. the terrorgeist on the other hand was brutal)

At this point i have just realised i never once used cunning deciever or the "roll 6 and get +1 to hit in combat" which both would of helped quite a bit, ill need to remember that next time. The khorgarath was nice, but i really needed something fast in my list. The daemonsmith wasnt all that useful, mystic shield was the most useful thing about it typically. tempted to drop him, the khogorath and a magma cannon so that i can fit drazhorath in, giving me a bit more speed/power in the list. overall very happy with iron daemons, they were consistantly better than magma cannons except for rare targets with 2+ rerollables

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Hey all just got my hands on a classic CD collection and was wondering about the battalions.

 do people think the battalions arent worth that much for LoA?

I notice no one seems to be running the blackshard warhost at all?

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fued    20

battalions used to be awesome, they are too expensive now... i cant justify taking one anymore

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Big congrats to @Ben for snagging 7th place at Warhammer World GT!!!!! Awesome work man. How in Hashut's name did you pull that off?

Edited by Baron_Bathory
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Andreas    259
19 minutes ago, Entombet said:

Could anyone post his army list?.

Draz

Tauruk

Standard Bearer

6 Renders

3x10 Fireglaives

2 Magma Cannons

Iron Daemon

Skullcracker

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spenson    3

I really didn't expect such a list . Papa Drazoath himself but no fireborn to summon and not that many bodies. I guess he took those 30 fireglaives to fill the battlelines. 

 

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5 hours ago, spenson said:

I really didn't expect such a list . Papa Drazoath himself but no fireborn to summon and not that many bodies. I guess he took those 30 fireglaives to fill the battlelines. 

 

My sentiments exactly. The list is low on war machines too. I'd love to know how he played this. I think board control is the new most important thing in GH2017. An Ironjawz player with an entire army of Gore-Gruntas got 2nd place. Up until now Brutes  were considered pretty much THE unit to take in that army.

I'm really happy this army still has a place on the top tables. Well done!

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Auticus    1,097

I'm still looking for some proper tactics reports.  For the life of me I cannot get chaos dwarves to work.  

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Andreas    259
50 minutes ago, Auticus said:

I'm still looking for some proper tactics reports.  For the life of me I cannot get chaos dwarves to work.  

They showed one GT game with Ben on twitch so you can get a subscription to see him play. In short from my limited observations he uses Draz as a throw away piece to set up a counter charge. And he plays very agressive with his warmachines/artillery, he moves them up the board.

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Ben    1,414

Hi guys,

I did indeed finish 7th at the GT Final over the weekend.  

This was my list:

Drazhoath The Ashen (320)

Bull Centaur Taur'ruk (160)
- General
- Trait: Cunning Deceiver
-Artefact: Chaos Talisman

Daemonsmith (100)
Pyre Rune Staff

Infernal Guard Battle Standard Bearer (100)

6 x Bull Centaur Renders (360)
Scalding Hand Weapon & Spiteshield

10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)

10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)

10 x Infernal Guard Fireglaives (100)

Iron Daemon War Engine (180)

Magma Cannon (140)

Skullcracker War Engine (200)

Magma Cannon (140)

Total: 2000 / 2000

 

I've been working on this sort of list for a while.  even before the warscroll updates I had settled into the pattern of Draz, 6 Bulls, 2 Magmas as being in every list.  This gives a good mix of combat, shooting and speed. 

I played this list with a 3rd Magma and no Tauruk but the extra mortal wounds is far surpassed by run and charge command ability.  

The Skullcracker I thought on paper looked good, and had the potential to do some real work.  In my head the dice say 14ish attacks, 7 hits, 4/5 wounds, maybe 2/3 D3 damage after saves.  No-one with any tactical ability will get their fragile characters charged by a huge base, and that sort of damage is not going to make a dent into big units, or will be over kill to smash small chaff.  I didn't see place for it but wanted to play it.  I also thought it would run out of steam quickly and once its taken enough wounds to get only 2d6 attacks it is essentially out of the game.  I was totally wrong on this.  Like, Astronomically wrong.  

anyway, i'll have a rundown of the units and why I chose them, how they fit together and later I can talk about how the games went.  

Disclaimer - If you want to play Allies or Mixed chaos there is often a 'better' or 'more efficient' unit to take.  I only play Legion.  

Draz.  Big daddy D.  Supreme Prophet of Hashut.  Lord of the Black Fortress. .  The Bullfather.  

The guy is the best thing in the army hands down.  He is probably over costed, under performing and too much of a target but without him we are footslogging and slow.  Drazhoath can move 30" when you win the double turn.  He can tank vs mortal wounds.  he can flee 7+d6" even with 1 wound left.  he casts spells, shoots, fights. Most importantly he is flexible and hard to predict where he will be each turn.

Dirty Uncle Taur'uk.  

This has always been my favourite character and now he has a list around him where he is far down on the target priority list he excels.  Run and Charge command ability on all teh bulls is excellent, so is +1 to charge.  The latter ability is a gem as it removed the possibility of failing a change when rolling double 1's. 

Daemonsmith

standard.  +6" and one use mortals.  Staff over Axe just for the potential 3 damage. 

Infernal Battle Standard.

I was most disappointed with this chap.  I think I might have been too cautious with him so i won't change the list just yet but it seems that he only is really useful if you play super defensive, but most games that's not the case.  the objectives are always over the table.  I think if i thrown him forwards early I might get more gains, but he is very slow and it feels like the points are better spent on other things.  

3x 10 Fireglaives

Pretty standard battleline. Shooting off a few extra wounds here and there, they are a constant bother to people and the champions bomb ability is excellent.  2x 10 and 1x Ironsworn horde seems a great battleline option but i struggle to fit it in a list.  I had the chance a few times to shoot all 3 units and lob a couple of bombs at one target.  Near the BSB. With Magma support.  Thats game over man.  

6 Bull Centaurs w/Spiteshields

This unit really is something else.  360 points for 6 large bases, 30 wounds, good armour save and consistency damage output.  They are not spectacularly smashy like 30 Bloodletters (that are 90 points cheaper) or other really super hard hitting combat units, but they are a massive hike over what we previously had and are very grindy and strong.  Downside is the ability to bring it all to bear. I might try 2 units of 3.  It will double the chances of making a charge when running side by side (2 run rolls, 2 charge attempts) and will be easier to fit them in range of the Taur'uks abilities, It will also mean I can got in 2 directions rather than over committing 6 bulls to get a job done.  My gut says 1 unit of 6 is best though.  

The Great Weapon option is an essential upgrade here.  I don't have the models but will be converting them.  In 6 games I bounced a handful of wounds, none of them being an important extra wounds caused, on the other hand, I did a massive amount of damage and that would have been hiked by a GW.  My only concern is that there are no models for the great weapons and what will that mean to the rules in the future??  

2x Magma Cannons

Standard.  Impacted my opponents play and game plan far more than the damage they inflicted.  Worth it every time to do a few wounds a turn all game.  This is the main advantage of scary combat units pushed in people face.  The cannons crop down in teh target list and can shoot all game.  

Iron Daemon

This was great in every game.  Its always great.  I did my time with the old rules and I think I have a real good handle on how to play and position the model in the game.  Now i'm rewarded with more damage and more defence.  10" move is nice, 3+ save too.  Best thing about it is the cannon.  not foe the damage caused, but for the shock and awe factor.  Shoot someone with 4D6 dice and rend 2 and they remember.  Which once again messes with their target priority. 

Skullcracker War Engine.  

As I said above, This was excellent in all my games.  My main fear was how easy it is to kill. Or not even kill, just keep a lid on.  The list as a whole presented so many targets that the Skullcracker was often left to do real damage.  Consistent damage output that has the ability to have a massive spike (rolling 20 attacks and getting 15 hits, while near the BSB) made this a real show stopper and my opponents didn't discover this until too late, Magma cannons dead, Drazhoath down and the Iron Deamon beaten up the Skullcracker did some great work. 

 

That will do for now.  My next post will be about how I played the list and how and why I was very aggressive and up the table with a supposed gun line army.  

 

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Kaleb Daark    389

Lovely run down Ben.

could you not suggest to forgeworld that they do a great weapon upgrade pack for the centaurs?

 

failint that could we not maybe go down the tauruk road where the shaft of the weapon is elongated?

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fued    20

sounds pretty good, my list struggled massively without Draz, you really really need that high speed option, thinking allies but i have an idea for a good draz/magmadroth conversion so i dunno lol

im dropping magma cannons for iron daemons in my list i suspect, those big guys are just so amazing.

keen to try bull centaurs, they sound like they do quite well

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@Ben Great write up man thank you very much! A question; was it a house rule for the tournament that you got to take Chaos alliance abilities and artifacts or does the GH2017 actually state that you're allowed to do that? I was under the impression that if your faction didn't have it's own allegiance abilities and artifacts that you pretty much couldn't use any. And with that said, does that mean you could let's say use destruction traits and artifacts with Bonesplitters allegiance?

Thanks a bunch for all the info and I await your post regarding your game plan.

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the grand alliances aren't factions, they apply to any of the sub factions within them. so you choose whether to go with your sub faction's allegiance abilities or grand alliance allegiance abilities.

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1 hour ago, James McPherson said:

the grand alliances aren't factions, they apply to any of the sub factions within them. so you choose whether to go with your sub faction's allegiance abilities or grand alliance allegiance abilities.

Exactly. So you either take Chaos Allegiance and have their abilities and artifacts or you take a faction and have theirs. But in the case of Legions of Azgorh, Tomb Kings, Greenskins etc. that don't have their own, where is the rule that says you can take the their grand alliance's? The list above is LoA allegiance by virtue of the Fireglaive core, but Ben took Chaos Grand Alliance traits and artifacts. Is that legal? From what you're saying it appears that let's say Ironjawz can choose to take Destruction traits. I haven't read anything in the new GH to confirm that.

In the original General's Handbook they said you could do that in the FAQ, but in this version it's not as clear. I haven't seen an entry that states if the faction you choose doesn't have it's own traits and artifacts, you can use the grand alliance's while still taking advantage of that faction's core units (battleline).

Edited by Baron_Bathory

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33 minutes ago, Baron_Bathory said:

Exactly. So you either take Chaos Allegiance and have their abilities and artifacts or you take a faction and have theirs. But in the case of Legions of Azgorh, Tomb Kings, Greenskins etc. that don't have their own, where is the rule that says you can take the their grand alliance's? The list above is LoA allegiance by virtue of the Fireglaive core, but Ben took Chaos Grand Alliance traits and artifacts. Is that legal? From what you're saying it appears that let's say Ironjawz can choose to take Destruction traits. I haven't read anything in the new GH to confirm that.

In the original General's Handbook they said you could do that in the FAQ, but in this version it's not as clear. I haven't seen an entry that states if the faction you choose doesn't have it's own traits and artifacts, you can use the grand alliance's while still taking advantage of that faction's core units (battleline).

When you choose your allegiance you can either use you faction specific e.g. fyreslayers OR Order. It does say specifically that you can use the grand alliance abilities OR your specific one if you have chosen one that has both.

Edited by sirflukesalot
Missed a bit
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24 minutes ago, sirflukesalot said:

When you choose your allegiance you can either use you faction specific e.g. fyreslayers OR Order. It does say specifically that you can use the grand alliance abilities OR your specific one if you have chosen one that has both.

That's great news! Thank you for the info :)

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