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Hi guys

6 nations was this weekend I've been following it a lot on twitter, the main take aways from the players playing the the event I found was - 

People would prefer a roll off for turn one, with the first player to deploy getting a +1 as a compromise

Command ability stacking really should not be a thing 

Kroak is currently bonkers

Dreadwood grove is busted

Lens of refraction completely neuters magic heavy Tzeentch lists 

Portal is going to be abused and should come with a 4+ to cast a spell through it 

Engine of the gods 14-17 should supply summon points not free units

Would love to hear direct from any players on what they found from the event!

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Anybody who is interested, the event details and lists can be found here - https://aosshorts.com/aos-6-nations-preview/

I suspect we will see an FAQ about some things over the next week or two.

+++ MOD HAT ON +++

I'm sure I don't need to mention this but just in case can you all think about what you will be writing when you react to this. This was a cool event which has highlighted a few things from a competitive point of view may skwiff things. If you choose to comment about the lists or the event or any of the things highlighted above, please do so but do so in a way that is constructive and respectful to other members and players. ;) 

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I think folks should bear in mind this was a team event not a standard one, didn't use all the rules available either.  Some of the conclusions could be valid, but trying to take anything from a singular event like this,  is not gonna actually tell us much.  It also might do more harm than good imo.

Think we need to get to the end of the year, through 4 or 5 100 plus player events with more of the rules in effect, before any conclusions/statements like the one quoted from twitter above can be made.

 

 

Edited by Paul Buckler
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I have some thoughts I'll post later, since some things are clearly busted. However, conclusions should not be drawn too quickly.

Our team didn't stack command abilities, we didn't have Kroak, Dreadwood, Engine, Portal nor the lens.

I'm the captain of team Sweden, we came in second place without all of these "broken" things. So they couldn't be all that busted, really 🙃

Edited by Solaris
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Sorry maybe the language I used wasn't ideal (though I was just quoting from peoples Twitter feeds at the events I've followed). I wasn't trying to create a AoS2 is broken post more a discussion post on the event and peoples findings from it. Again I was just quoting from Twitter feeds I have read. 

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I've been playing Dreadwood a while now. Its improved a lot in AOS2 but I wouldn't class it as bust its definitely beatable by many armies.

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38 minutes ago, AaronWIlson said:

Sorry maybe the language I used wasn't ideal (though I was just quoting from peoples Twitter feeds at the events I've followed). I wasn't trying to create a AoS2 is broken post more a discussion post on the event and peoples findings from it. Again I was just quoting from Twitter feeds I have read. 

Don't worry I know that's not what you intended. It just needed some framing around it and just a nudge how we wanted people to respond ;) 

I quite like some of the lists that were used and some tweaking they could work in single events. 

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I think a lot of lists went overboard with AoS 2 adaptation, and just didn't work because they relied on a single trick. Specifically thinking about the ones starting with loads of command points to pump into a single unit a single turn. It's just overkill, and leaves you too thin on the board to play the scenario properly.

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17 minutes ago, Solaris said:

I think a lot of lists went overboard with AoS 2 adaptation, and just didn't work because they relied on a single trick. Specifically thinking about the ones starting with loads of command points to pump into a single unit a single turn. It's just overkill, and leaves you too thin on the board to play the scenario properly.

Agreed. I suspect this may get 'fixed' or clarified soon and probably be subjected to a rule of one. Again see how GW choose to respond to this (if they do. They may wait). With the new Stormcast and Nighthaunt books out now, plus whatever drops over next few months (I'm expecting updates for some of the older books as quick wins from GW), the meta will change completely again

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I wasn't at 6 nations but one question to the starting post

3 hours ago, AaronWIlson said:

People would prefer a roll off for turn one, with the first player to deploy getting a +1 as a compromise

Why not the original rule intention, that you roll of and if it's a tie the player finishing deployment first desides? I think that this was the intention to prevent Re-rolls. With a +1 it could be that you have to roll of 5 times because of ties.

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As much as some stuff seems a little crazy when you hear tweets like this, it always takes time for a new systems to right itself. Some people have found powerful combos and played opponents that have no defence against this. 

The kroak doing 100+ wounds in one turn for example, it was against daemons so damage was double what it would normally be. Also he likely rolled well on foresight allowing extra re rolls. 

Imagine if this player faced an opponent with army MW wide saves and the lens of refraction, this would likely be a different story. 

My point is, don’t take too much away from one niche tournament, wait for the game to settle and the FAQ to drop.

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1 hour ago, The Jabber Tzeentch said:

Tbe kroak doing 100+ wounds in one turn for example, it was against daemons so damage was double what it would normally be. Also he likely rolled well on foresight allowing extra re rolls. 

Imagine if this player faced an opponent with army MW wide saves and the lens of refraction, this would likely be a different story. 

Maybe.. But I imagine he didn't need to roll all that well.  His foresight is a command ability.  Just skimp 500 points and use it 10 times.  That's 15 rerolls.  On a balewind you're looking at a lot of comets with good range and a good chance of making those missing 500 points back with engines. 

I agree with your point though.  Counters need time. 

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I noticed that Lens of Refraction is used by almost every stormcast army, but can't find it in the book... Where can i find it? and what  does it do?

Thanks.

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17 minutes ago, Vextol said:

Maybe.. But I imagine he didn't need to roll all that well.  His foresight is a command ability.  Just skimp 500 points and use it 10 times.  That's 15 rerolls.  On a balewind you're looking at a lot of comets with good range and a good chance of making those missing 500 points back with engines. 

I agree with your point though.  Counters need time. 

Thing is these end up being gimmicky lists. They do win, and they win spectacularly, but they rarely win any of the standard tournaments because they either:

• run out of luck

• face a hard counter(more common with gimmick lists)

• don’t win fave game or sports votes so drop down too much to win. 

@MAGNUM990 it’s a realm artefact from malign sorcery. 

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I also noticed that teams couldn't have more then of the same artifact across the team, which probably massively reduced the amount of lens 

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2 hours ago, EMMachine said:

I wasn't at 6 nations but one question to the starting post

Why not the original rule intention, that you roll of and if it's a tie the player finishing deployment first desides? I think that this was the intention to prevent Re-rolls. With a +1 it could be that you have to roll of 5 times because of ties.

I was so excited about this when the new rulebook dropped then they went back to the old '****** anybody without battalions' version. Luckily I've managed to get some games in with the rulebook version used. 

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31 minutes ago, The Jabber Tzeentch said:

Thing is these end up being gimmicky lists. They do win, and they win spectacularly, but they rarely win any of the standard tournaments because they either:

• run out of luck

• face a hard counter(more common with gimmick lists)

• don’t win fave game or sports votes so drop down too much to win. 

@MAGNUM990 it’s a realm artefact from malign sorcery. 

I call them 'brake check' lists and they're actually usually a bigger issue than outright OP lists because of how intensely infuriating they are to go up against if you they have luck and you don't hard counter.

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12 minutes ago, MrZakalwe said:

I was so excited about this when the new rulebook dropped then they went back to the old '****** anybody without battalions' version. Luckily I've managed to get some games in with the rulebook version used. 

If it makes you feel better, not very many armies take battalions anymore.

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57 minutes ago, MAGNUM990 said:

I noticed that Lens of Refraction is used by almost every stormcast army, but can't find it in the book... Where can i find it? and what  does it do?

Thanks.

Relics of Hysh

Lens of Refraction:

"Each time a friendly unit within 6" of the bearer would suffer any mortal wounds from a spell cast by an enemy WIZARD, roll a D3 and reduce the number of mortal wounds suffered by the result"

- Malign Sorcery p. 85

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15 minutes ago, MrZakalwe said:

I was so excited about this when the new rulebook dropped then they went back to the old '****** anybody without battalions' version. Luckily I've managed to get some games in with the rulebook version used. 

This wasn't what I meant, when quoting the the Topic owner. I don't know why they made this in the FAQ, I would understand it if a Battleplan overrides it ("attacker goes first" or something like that) but it's the wrong way to change rules by FAQ (instead of Errata).

The point why I asked here is, why prefering +1 on the roll (risking to have ties and have to reroll) or saying that in case of a tie in round 1 the player finishing deployment first desides (like the rules said before they made the Point in the FAQ).

Edited by EMMachine

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2 minutes ago, Drib said:

Relics of Hysh

Lens of Refraction:

"Each time a friendly unit within 6" of the bearer would suffer any mortal wounds from a spell cast by an enemy WIZARD, roll a D3 and reduce the number of mortal wounds suffered by the result"

- Malign Sorcery p. 85

It's so overwhelmingly the best magic item in the book. Why would they do it? Was it play tested?

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13 minutes ago, InvalidUsername said:

I call them 'brake check' lists and they're actually usually a bigger issue than outright OP lists because of how intensely infuriating they are to go up against if you they have luck and you don't hard counter.

I don’t think they are that much of an issue, the poeople who take these lists normally want to win badly, but due to the reasons I mentioned before they normally don’t. So after this initially silly abuse period everything stabilises and more traditional lists become the norm again. 

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2 minutes ago, Drib said:

Relics of Hysh

Lens of Refraction:

"Each time a friendly unit within 6" of the bearer would suffer any mortal wounds from a spell cast by an enemy WIZARD, roll a D3 and reduce the number of mortal wounds suffered by the result"

- Malign Sorcery p. 85

I knew I'd hate the realm relics.

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6 hours ago, murphs said:

It's so overwhelmingly the best magic item in the book. Why would they do it? Was it play tested?

I’ve seen this said about many different things now 😂

its a very specific medium range defensive item. It’s quite coubterable by a balanced list as it only affects spells.  

It’s probably in there to make sure the magic heavy lists like Tzeentch don’t become OP. Just the threat of having this item available is enough to change lists. 

Edited by The Jabber Tzeentch
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