AoS 2 - Maggotkin of Nurgle Discussion

[Luke1705]

27 minutes ago, ZaelART said:

Are Plaguebearers worth it? It seems for 40 points more 5 Putrid Blightkings get a lot more done?

+10 wounds and more offensive capability.

I’ve only just ordered my minis so haven’t played with either yet.

How do people use Plaguebearers?

Plaguebearers are a lot more inherently durable when they’re in large squads

Edited July 12, 2018 by Luke1705

[Darkfine]

3 hours ago, ZaelART said:

Are Plaguebearers worth it? It seems for 40 points more 5 Putrid Blightkings get a lot more done?

+10 wounds and more offensive capability.

I’ve only just ordered my minis so haven’t played with either yet.

How do people use Plaguebearers?

Actually, in my opinion, mortals are about to take a huge hit.

On paper mortals are fantastic because of their cost effectiveness.  At 40 Marauders for 200 points they are 5 points a wound.  Now, normally because of their relatively awful stats that wouldn’t mean much however Nurgle has a huge number of things that make them one of the best units in the game.  You can literally spend over a thousand points just making Marauders killing machines and a great tar pit.

The caveat there is before they can claim that you need a hero phase.

I think we are about to see a lot of of one drop alpha strike and magic/gun line armies.  Lists that can interact with you in a meaningful way before you get a hero phase.

Plaguebearers don’t have that problem.

[Darkfine]

3 hours ago, ZaelART said:

Are Plaguebearers worth it? It seems for 40 points more 5 Putrid Blightkings get a lot more done?

+10 wounds and more offensive capability.

I’ve only just ordered my minis so haven’t played with either yet.

How do people use Plaguebearers?

Actually, in my opinion, mortals are about to take a huge hit.

On paper mortals are fantastic because of their cost effectiveness.  At 40 Marauders for 200 points they are 5 points a wound.  Now, normally because of their relatively awful stats that wouldn’t mean much however Nurgle has a huge number of things that make them one of the best units in the game.  You can literally spend over a thousand points just making Marauders killing machines and a great tar pit.

The caveat there is before they can claim that you need a hero phase.

I think we are about to see a lot of of one drop alpha strike and magic/gun line armies.  Lists that can interact with you in a meaningful way before you get a hero phase.

Plaguebearers don’t have that problem.

[Darkfine]

double post

Edited July 12, 2018 by Darkfine

[Luke1705]

47 minutes ago, Darkfine said:

Actually, in my opinion, mortals are about to take a huge hit.

On paper mortals are fantastic because of their cost effectiveness.  At 40 Marauders for 200 points they are 5 points a wound.  Now, normally because of their relatively awful stats that wouldn’t mean much however Nurgle has a huge number of things that make them one of the best units in the game.  You can literally spend over a thousand points just making Marauders killing machines and a great tar pit.

The caveat there is before they can claim that you need a hero phase.

I think we are about to see a lot of of one drop alpha strike and magic/gun line armies.  Lists that can interact with you in a meaningful way before you get a hero phase.

Plaguebearers don’t have that problem.

Hence the plaguetouched warband. I think, even though you lose nurgle powers, you still have to take it if you want to be hyper competitive to be a 1 drop and get your defenses up before you get alpha struck

[Avvien]

2 minutes ago, Luke1705 said:

hyper competitive

I hear you buddy. Allegiance: Chaos has always been the competitive choice for Nurgle players anyway.

Either with plaguetouched lists, or Plaguebearers + Stormfiends + Warplightning cannons + heroes

 

My personal opinion? Maybe being competitive isn't the most important part of the hobby.

[peasant]

Sad defeat , we played a Mission with no reserve allowed, so bye bye gutrot's Alpha Strike. 1k Against DaughtersofKhaine I Run towards them but I had to concede in T3. A Weird Thing Happened in The sixth Stage of Nurgle Wheel I roll 3 units afected by The 1d3 MW but It happened no Units Were exactly 3 at 12" so We concluye The ability fail It is correct?

[Luke1705]

2 minutes ago, peasant said:

Sad defeat , we played a Mission with no reserve allowed, so bye bye gutrot's Alpha Strike. 1k Against DaughtersofKhaine I Run towards them but I had to concede in T3. A Weird Thing Happened in The sixth Stage of Nurgle Wheel I roll 3 units afected by The 1d3 MW but It happened no Units Were exactly 3 at 12" so We concluye The ability fail It is correct?

One unit is always within 12” of itself, so at minimum you can always do mortals to at least one unit, regardless of how you roll

[Avvien]

2 minutes ago, peasant said:

A Weird Thing Happened in The sixth Stage of Nurgle Wheel I roll 3 units afected by The 1d3 MW but It happened no Units Were exactly 3 at 12" so We concluye The ability fail It is correct? 

I'm convinced that you could still have chosen 1 or 2 units, even if your opponent didn't have 3 close together after you successfully rolled for D3. I'm sorry to say but it sounds like your opponent cheated you.

[peasant]

Oooh Too Bad but I Know It for The Next Game!, ok Next Time I couldnt Have Win anyway. Damm gutrot he was Fighting Against an avatar for Three turns and Never Get The 4+ to grab The sword! 

[Luke1705]

12 minutes ago, Avvien said:

I hear you buddy. Allegiance: Chaos has always been the competitive choice for Nurgle players anyway.

Either with plaguetouched lists, or Plaguebearers + Stormfiends + Warplightning cannons + heroes

 

My personal opinion? Maybe being competitive isn't the most important part of the hobby.

Interesting to know that about GA: chaos (I’m new to sigmar and thought nurgle allegiance looked pretty strong with Maggotkin)

Just be careful with what you imply there. I know it’s different strokes for different folks, but it can sound kind of “you’re having fun wrong”

[Avvien]

2 minutes ago, Luke1705 said:

Just be careful with what you imply there. I know it’s different strokes for different folks, but it can sound kind of “you’re having fun wrong”

This is why I made sure to add my comment at the end there; There's lots of ways to have fun with AoS, aside from just the competitive aspect!

[kenshin620]

6 minutes ago, Avvien said:

This is why I made sure to add my comment at the end there; There's lots of ways to have fun with AoS, aside from just the competitive aspect!

Thats basically Beastmen MO for like the past few years!

"We have fun, just not in the competitive sense!" ?

Can we at least get our other god marked gors?

[Darkfine]

1 hour ago, Luke1705 said:

Hence the plaguetouched warband. I think, even though you lose nurgle powers, you still have to take it if you want to be hyper competitive to be a 1 drop and get your defenses up before you get alpha struck

I mean, army wide -1 is good but I’m straight winning games with 11th hour summoning and GA: Chaos has zero character interaction.

[Luke1705]

3 minutes ago, Darkfine said:

I mean, army wide -1 is good but I’m straight winning games with 11th hour summoning and GA: Chaos has zero character interaction.

Are you playing against alpha strike heavy 1 drop lists?

[Darkfine]

7 minutes ago, Luke1705 said:

Are you playing against alpha strike heavy 1 drop lists?

Hence the Plaguebearers.  You don’t need to burn a CP to survive combat and they tar pit well enough to survive until buffs can go up.  Also not sure if it is apparent or not but you can use trees as a summon point and you can summon trees.  It doesn’t matter where you get tied down, you can always make it to your opponents objectives.

Also, this is probably more a local meta deal but if I can’t kill characters I can’t win games.  

[Aaron Schmidt]

I played an interesting game last night. You all wanna see a battle report?

[sorokyl]

13 hours ago, Avvien said:

A single plague squall cast changed that. Took out his necromancer, and just like that his entire army crumbled the following combat phase.

At 1k points, I had no other means of reaching him. My kings could not get through his skeletons, my heroes could not reach his. I had no flyers, and shooting was not an option.

That spell won me the tournament!

2

I mean you had to have done at least 2-4 dmg to the necromancer in order for a "single plage squall cast" to kill it right? There's not some trick to making plague squall do 5 damage right?

[Avvien]

40 minutes ago, sorokyl said:

I mean you had to have done at least 2-4 dmg to the necromancer in order for a "single plage squall cast" to kill it right?

It was actually the Plague Squall plus the Rampant Disease stage of corruption that killed it off - Another reason why I like to have one caster firing plague squall while another cycles the wheel.

Might be a better idea to bring a Balewind Vortex instead though, as others have pointed out earlier in this thread.

[Zplash]

I currently run a list with plague squall +balewind: turning wheel -> rampant disease and a Rotigus-> deluge of nurgle.

My first experience about that Combo: it fully depends on your cast rolls (and unbind if enemy caster is in range).

I destroyed Key enemy units with good Casting rolls but another game i had 4 hero phases without 1 spell going off from the three above. So GG.

Another risk are other deepstrikes which can e.g. easily will your sorcerer in your backfield corner...

[Darkfine]

16 minutes ago, Zplash said:

I currently run a list with plague squall +balewind: turning wheel -> rampant disease and a Rotigus-> deluge of nurgle.

My first experience about that Combo: it fully depends on your cast rolls (and unbind if enemy caster is in range).

I destroyed Key enemy units with good Casting rolls but another game i had 4 hero phases without 1 spell going off from the three above. So GG.

Another risk are other deepstrikes which can e.g. easily will your sorcerer in your backfield corner...

Well sure, banking on what is basically a fancy game of Farkle(spell casting) isn’t the way to approach a series of games(like a tournament).

However using the wheel and Squall to top off characters/units is kind of our best shot at Death, which, as far as I can tell is the only allegiance that out tar pits us.  

[Zplash]

10 minutes ago, Darkfine said:

Well sure, banking on what is basically a fancy game of Farkle(spell casting) isn’t the way to approach a series of games(like a tournament).

However using the wheel and Squall to top off characters/units is kind of our best shot at Death, which, as far as I can tell is the only allegiance that out tar pits us.  

So true. 

I just try to build a competitiv list around nurgle daemons and their defensive skills. Thats why I Love plague squall and deluge of Nurgle to even have a Chance to kill something... most of the time I focus the enemy support heros with that spells.

[ZaelART]

So is the consensus that if you can run a block of 30 Plaguebearers then that’s good, but if you can’t then probably just get more Blightkings?

Also, for casting, is a Rotbring Sorcerer recommended over a Poxbringer?

And finally, with regards to summoning, how strong is this? What amount of units do people generally end up being able to summon in an average game, and what models do people recommend having on hand for summoning?

[Darkfine]

33 minutes ago, ZaelART said:

So is the consensus that if you can run a block of 30 Plaguebearers then that’s good, but if you can’t then probably just get more Blightkings?

Also, for casting, is a Rotbring Sorcerer recommended over a Poxbringer?

And finally, with regards to summoning, how strong is this? What amount of units do people generally end up being able to summon in an average game, and what models do people recommend having on hand for summoning?

1.  Pretty much, it’s either 30 Plaguebearers or bust if you are looking to maximize effectiveness.

2.  Those are two guys who do very different things for your army.  The Sorcerer is a more traditional caster who is looking to get casts off, both Squall and Blades, control the wheel and late game mess with objective math.  The Poxbringer is more close support with spells like Favored Poxs and artifacts like Whitherstave.  Bringing both can definitely happen.

3.  Nurgle summoning is vastly different than anyone else’s.  For starts our summoning is fairy unique in that it can shut down reasonably well.  If your opponent parks on trees and gets in your face quickly you will struggle to summon at all, about 10 Plaguebearers actually.  It is also very dependent on mission, there are a few with tiny territories and mostly dead space, those are practically impossible to summon on.  

Even if you are collecting points at a good clip the kind of summoning you are want to do isn’t going to be earth shaking.  The burden a tar pit army carries unfortunately.

If you are looking to bring in awesome stuff to affect the game via interaction with the enemy then you’ll be massively let down.  Plaguebearers, Beasts of Nurgle, even Drones and Great Unclean Ones aren’t going to shift units off of objectives late in the game.  

We have no charge tricks outside of Command Points and are extremely pillow fisted in a straight up fight.

Now, the nature of how we actually put models into play means we can come at people sideways to sneak objectives thought otherwise safe.  Either that or we force bad positioning.  As an example at 21 points(around turn 4) you can drop two trees covering over 2 feet of table space and leaving you 7 points for a 5 man Plaguebearer unit to grab something.

Like I said that’s just one example, a few times I’ve found it correct to summon a unit as early as turn 2.  Getting into a fight with a large unit and summoning a 5 or 10 man Plaguebearer squad to get a long bomb charge from the other side of a combat to keep a hoard spread out so those freaking spears don’t mow you down.

A general rule of thumb is, the more you can think on your feet the better you’ll find Nurgle summoning.

 

Edited July 12, 2018 by Darkfine

[Zplash]

23 minutes ago, ZaelART said:

So is the consensus that if you can run a block of 30 Plaguebearers then that’s good, but if you can’t then probably just get more Blightkings?

Also, for casting, is a Rotbring Sorcerer recommended over a Poxbringer?

And finally, with regards to summoning, how strong is this? What amount of units do people generally end up being able to summon in an average game, and what models do people recommend having on hand for summoning?

There is no real yes or no to your questions. It always depends whats your goal to achive with it.

For Holding objectives for example plaguebearers shine. Doing dmg kings will outperforme plaguebearers every time. Also to remember what is the rest of your armee? Buffing mortals? Buffing daemon?

For the caster issue its the same. Sorcerer has access to rotbringer and mortal spell lores. Poxbringer to daemon spell lore. Maybe you can say for debuffing take poxbringer for dmg take sorcerer... 

Summonig is a nice Strategie aspect. Taking objectives with summoned plaguebearers for example. Since now I only summoned trees and plaguebearers in 5 or 10 men squads depends what i want them to do. Maybe there will be a Situation where drones could work too...