AoS 2 - Ironjawz Discussion

[Izikail]

2 hours ago, Lardidar said:

I have an army modeling idea but it would mean an entire mounted force...do we think a 5x GG list has any staying power?

I have seen it used with gordrakk and a maw to remove negash and some guys  turn one so they couldnt ever get onto there own objectives. 

Its whats referd to as a 3/5 list your not adaptive and flexable enough to win every game. But when they dont have an answer or the mission falls right you just win

[Jgroover]

20 hours ago, Jgroover said:

Bringing this list to a tournament tomorrow. First place gets a Soul Wars box so bringing the best of what I have. Would love to bring Bloodtoofs instead but don't have a realmgate model yet. Will update with how it goes:

Hate to report but it went terribly. I ended up getting last place out of six participants.

Game 1 vs. Legions of Nagash
Result: Draw
His army: Nagash, 2 necromancers, 40 skeletons, 30 grave guard and some dire wolves
This one actually didn't go that badly and I would have won but I left a unit of brutes .1 inches away from claiming a home objective because I am stupid. I threw everything at his skeletons and necromancer and ignored nagash and the graveguard the whole game while being battered with 9 spells a turn. 

Game 2 vs. Seraphon
Result: Major Loss
His army: 80 saurus, slann, carnosaur, various other BS. 
This one sucked, I feel like I played it right but feel there is absolutely no way to compete with that many bodies with that many attacks while they are being constantly reinforced and teleporting everywhere. It was over fast. Seraphon just feel stupid. 

Game 3 vs.  Legions of Nagash
Result: Major Loss
His army: 60 skeletons, arkhan, mortis engine, 10 grimghast reapers, 2 morghast
This one I played HORRIBLY. I let him go first and he proceeded to kill my weirdnob with pendulum, severely wound my warboss and debuff my mawkrusha with 4 different things. Then he blocked me with palisade and shackles. On my turn 2, with halved movement on the maw krusha I was only able to get it in range of 4 units for waagh, which I did 5 times and only one of them passed the roll. The rest of the game was just me running around trying to steal objectives while dying to spells. 

All in all, I feel like I played terribly. I also feel like my list does not have what it takes to compete against these armies, and I am not sure that Ironjawz has any answer for either Seraphon or spell spam. I will say that the two defensive artefacts from hysh were incredible. Every single army picked hysh just to take them and I don't see much reason to stray from it. I am feeling decently deflated after feeling positive about Ironjawz going into this. 

 

[Malakree]

2 hours ago, Lardidar said:

I have an army modeling idea but it would mean an entire mounted force...do we think a 5x GG list has any staying power?

You mean the Gordrakkfist which is currently one of the strongest Ironjawz lists ?

8 minutes ago, Jgroover said:

All in all, I feel like I played terribly. I also feel like my list does not have what it takes to compete against these armies, and I am not sure that Ironjawz has any answer for either Seraphon or spell spam. I will say that the two defensive artefacts from hysh were incredible. Every single army picked hysh just to take them and I don't see much reason to stray from it. I am feeling decently deflated after feeling positive about Ironjawz going into this.

To be honest the fact they gave seraphon another giant buff after they were already reasonably top tier was pretty retarded. Doesn't help that a bunch of the top tier armies are all wizard focused while we are STILL weak to it.

I think correct use of the endless spells is going to be mandatory if we want to try to compete, that and going for some ridiculous combos while saying ****** the meta. I suspect IJ atm are a 2-3/5 no matter what list you are running.

I'm taking this list to Throne of Skulls next weekend

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
Mortal Realm: Hysh

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (440)
- General
- Trait: Ironclad 
- Artefact: Mirrored Cuirass 
Orruk Warchanter (80)
- Artefact: Aetherquartz Brooch 
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (120)
- Artefact: Lens of Refraction 
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (120)

Battleline
5 x Orruk Brutes (180)
5 x Orruk Brutes (180)
3 x Orruk Gore Gruntas (140)
3 x Orruk Gore Gruntas (140)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (160)

Battalions
Ironfist (180)
Bloodtoofs (120)

Endless Spells
Chronomantic Cogs (60)
Balewind Vortex (40)
Prismatic Palisade (30)

Total: 1990 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 112

Then this one to bravery one the week after, changed somewhat because they have some house rulings and such which mean you can't multi-stack waaagh! Dropping first only means you win ties in the roll off etc.

Spoiler

Allegiance: Ironjawz
Mortal Realm: Ulgu

Leaders
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (440)
- General
- Trait: Ironclad 
- Artefact: Miasmatic Blade 
Orruk Megaboss (140)
- Artefact: Sword of Judgement 
Orruk Warchanter (80)
- Artefact: Spellmirror 
Orruk Warchanter (80)
Fungoid Cave-Shaman (80)
- Allies

Battleline
5 x Orruk Brutes (180)
5 x Orruk Brutes (180)
3 x Orruk Gore Gruntas (140)
3 x Orruk Gore Gruntas (140)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (160)

Battalions
Ironfist (180)
Bloodtoofs (120)

Endless Spells
Chronomantic Cogs (60)
Malevolent Maelstrom (20)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 2
Allies: 80 / 400
Wounds: 117

Going for the Sword of Judgement cheese on the Footboss. A double Waaagh! would put him at 8 attacks with his cleaver and the +2 to hit works really well for his claw as well. Not to mention if he kills a hero he gets an extra attack on the God Weapon  Much as the 4 WC combo is silly I think I really underestimated just how good a Megaboss with Sword of Judgement is. You are benefiting completely off the +hit right up until the third, he's tankier and gets tankier/more dangerous as he kills heroes. Plus the RR1's to hit for brutes is not irrelevant. 

Guna see how he rolls but on paper he's tasty.

18 minutes ago, Jgroover said:

Then he blocked me with palisade and shackles. On my turn 2, with halved movement on the maw krusha I was only able to get it in range of 4 units for waagh,

As a note, you know that you are still at full move during your hero phase so if you get some IJ triggers you can move out of range of the shackles before they affect you.

Edited July 15, 2018 by Malakree

[broche]

So just had my first game tonight against Seraphon (thunderquake starhost) finally. Made 1-2 light mistake (we played total comittment, I gambled for big scoring turn 1, but I half succed. He then proceed to summon and Gemenid me and that was game.

We didn't played a second game as we felt the Tier level between our list was too big. 

As expected, summon is way too strong (especially with Engine of the god) specially when coupled with Teleport. Geminid is just so supid lol

on a positive note, Aetherquartz Brooch is quite good in Ironjawz

Edited July 15, 2018 by broche

[Andrew G]

2 hours ago, Jgroover said:

Hate to report but it went terribly. I ended up getting last place out of six participants.

Game 1 vs. Legions of Nagash
Result: Draw
His army: Nagash, 2 necromancers, 40 skeletons, 30 grave guard and some dire wolves
This one actually didn't go that badly and I would have won but I left a unit of brutes .1 inches away from claiming a home objective because I am stupid. I threw everything at his skeletons and necromancer and ignored nagash and the graveguard the whole game while being battered with 9 spells a turn. 

Game 2 vs. Seraphon
Result: Major Loss
His army: 80 saurus, slann, carnosaur, various other BS. 
This one sucked, I feel like I played it right but feel there is absolutely no way to compete with that many bodies with that many attacks while they are being constantly reinforced and teleporting everywhere. It was over fast. Seraphon just feel stupid. 

Game 3 vs.  Legions of Nagash
Result: Major Loss
His army: 60 skeletons, arkhan, mortis engine, 10 grimghast reapers, 2 morghast
This one I played HORRIBLY. I let him go first and he proceeded to kill my weirdnob with pendulum, severely wound my warboss and debuff my mawkrusha with 4 different things. Then he blocked me with palisade and shackles. On my turn 2, with halved movement on the maw krusha I was only able to get it in range of 4 units for waagh, which I did 5 times and only one of them passed the roll. The rest of the game was just me running around trying to steal objectives while dying to spells. 

All in all, I feel like I played terribly. I also feel like my list does not have what it takes to compete against these armies, and I am not sure that Ironjawz has any answer for either Seraphon or spell spam. I will say that the two defensive artefacts from hysh were incredible. Every single army picked hysh just to take them and I don't see much reason to stray from it. I am feeling decently deflated after feeling positive about Ironjawz going into this. 

 

Sounds like game 1 and 3 were both winnable.  Seraphon is obviously pretty busted right now, so I wouldn't use that as a benchmark for comparison. 

Edited July 15, 2018 by Andrew G

[Jgroover]

2 hours ago, Malakree said:

As a note, you know that you are still at full move during your hero phase so if you get some IJ triggers you can move out of range of the shackles before they affect you.

I tried but they put it right in my only path so I had no option to avoid it.

31 minutes ago, Andrew G said:

Sounds like game 1 and 3 were both winnable.  Seraphon is obviously pretty busted right now, so I wouldn't use that as a benchmark for comparison. 

Game three was maybe winnable, but I don't think so. Even if I went first, I don't think I could have reached and killed arkhan and the rest of the casters, and as soon as geminids and the other debuffs come out it is quite frankly over. 

[Skabnoze]

It seems like one wizard is a liability.  This reminds me a bit of Warhammer Fantasy.  Playing with a single wizard is a potential liability depending upon the opponent.

I think there is a realm item that lets a hero dispel as a wizard.  It might be worth considering on a sturdy character like a mawkrusher boss if we are only going to bring a single wizard.

[Rakysh]

I saw earlier in this thread, people were treating the new rampaging destroyers as though it includes a run roll - is this right? It reads to me like you just get to move the base movement, but I might be totally wrong. 

[broche]

you just made me reread it , did not notice the change (i played 6'' like before)

it say normal move and you can run as part of a normal move. But it's now much better. Maw Krusha can move 12'' in your herophase! Pig will move 9''.

Edited July 15, 2018 by broche

[Ravinsild]

So I don’t plan on playing in any tournaments but I would like to bring a solid all-rounder list as my local meta is fairly competitive. 

Things on my to-do list are: Get a Baleful Realmgate as well as a Fungoid Cave-Shaman and Malign Sorcery for endless spells. 

I chose my realm based on my Waaagh’s personal lore, but I have no clue at this point what general traits or artifacts I should be going for, I also like Ghur because it’s where Ironjawz are originally from based on what I can tell in the Battletome. 

Right now this is about the best list I can manage. What do you think? 

Realm: Shyish

Leaders: 

Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (general) 

Megaboss 

Weirdknob 

Warchanter 

Warchanter 

Battleline: 

x5 Brutes with Dual-Choppas, Boss-Klaw & Smasha, Gore-Choppa

x5 Brutes with Dual-Choppas, Boss-Klaw & Smasha, Gore-Choppa

x5 Brutes with Dual-Choppas, Boss-Klaw & Smasha, Gore-Choppa

x3 Gore-Grunta with Pig Iron Choppa

x3 Gore-Grunta with Pig Iron Choppa

x3 Gore-Grunta with Pig Iron Choppa

Battalion:

Ironfist 

Edited July 15, 2018 by Ravinsild

[Lardidar]

8 hours ago, Malakree said:

You mean the Gordrakkfist which is currently one of the strongest Ironjawz lists ?

8 hours ago, Jgroover said:

Sorry for being a moron...I can't seem to see anything on it. I was at an event yesterday so I am pooped!

I was thinking a full brutefist and with a krusher but Gordrakk would be better. Then I think there is 500pts left, a warchanter and some kind of wizard?

[Superninja]

6 hours ago, Rakysh said:

saw earlier in this thread, people were treating the new rampaging destroyers as though it includes a run roll - is this right? It reads to me like you just get to move the base movement, but I might be totally wrong. 

That was me.  You can run, but you won't be able to charge later.

[broche]

8 hours ago, Ravinsild said:

So I don’t plan on playing in any tournaments but I would like to bring a solid all-rounder list as my local meta is fairly competitive. 

Things on my to-do list are: Get a Baleful Realmgate as well as a Fungoid Cave-Shaman and Malign Sorcery for endless spells. 

I chose my realm based on my Waaagh’s personal lore, but I have no clue at this point what general traits or artifacts I should be going for, I also like Ghur because it’s where Ironjawz are originally from based on what I can tell in the Battletome. 

Right now this is about the best list I can manage. What do you think? 

You're list is not bad, pretty classic. But right now the most competitive option would be a Weirdfist, then Gorefist. Ironfist is not bad but in the end all it does is compensate your army bad movement. On the other end, Weirdfist and  Gorefist allow you to dictate the play. A list like this one:

Allegiance: Ironjawz
Mortal Realm: Hysh
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (440)
- General
- Trait: Ironclad 
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (120)
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (120)
Orruk Warchanter (80)
3 x Orruk Gore Gruntas (140)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (160)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (160)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (160)
10 x Orruk Brutes (360)
Weirdfist (180)
Balewind Vortex (40)
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (40)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 137
 

It put pressure on your opponent who want to turtle as you can reach is model with mortal wound output. That one of the big weakness of Ironjawz is that they are very easy to screen out, and Weirdfist is one of the option to mitigate that weakness (other is to play Gitmob warmachine)

[Ravinsild]

1 hour ago, broche said:

You're list is not bad, pretty classic. But right now the most competitive option would be a Weirdfist, then Gorefist. Ironfist is not bad but in the end all it does is compensate your army bad movement. On the other end, Weirdfist and  Gorefist allow you to dictate the play. A list like this one:

Allegiance: Ironjawz
Mortal Realm: Hysh
Megaboss on Maw-Krusha (440)
- General
- Trait: Ironclad 
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (120)
Orruk Weirdnob Shaman (120)
Orruk Warchanter (80)
3 x Orruk Gore Gruntas (140)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (160)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (160)
10 x Orruk Ardboys (160)
10 x Orruk Brutes (360)
Weirdfist (180)
Balewind Vortex (40)
Geminids of Uhl-Gysh (40)

Total: 2000 / 2000
Extra Command Points: 1
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 137
 

It put pressure on your opponent who want to turtle as you can reach is model with mortal wound output. That one of the big weakness of Ironjawz is that they are very easy to screen out, and Weirdfist is one of the option to mitigate that weakness (other is to play Gitmob warmachine)

 

I can run this list if the GW store lets me borrow their endless spells, but I don’t think they have a spare Balewind Vortex.  That’s also on my list to get. 

[Coganaut]

Hey guys, new to ironjaws and was curious what the best weapon options on brutes would be? 

[broche]

Yeah you could go without the vortex, the list would be less hard. Vortex on Weirnob is really good. With Geminid at 24'' + 8'' and + 6'' for Foot, Bolt and Puke.

I think i would take the Gryph charm on Weirnob, so he can go up to 3+  armour save and -2 to hit making him pretty survivalble, then maybe use Rockjaw on MK for addionnal mortal wound output.

[tolstedt]

18 hours ago, broche said:

you just made me reread it , did not notice the change (i played 6'' like before)

it say normal move and you can run as part of a normal move. But it's now much better. Maw Krusha can move 12'' in your herophase! Pig will move 9''.

You can run if you want but can't charge later.

[Vasshpit]

@Coganaut 

Hi.  Choppas  for units of 5 and hackas for 10+ is what seems to be the preferred method. 

[PlasticCraic]

2 hours ago, tolstedt said:

You can run if you want but can't charge later.

True, unless the Fungoid is your General ?

[Malakree]

8 hours ago, Coganaut said:

Hey guys, new to ironjaws and was curious what the best weapon options on brutes would be? 

@Vasshpit is correct for the conventional wisdom.

I think the Boss Brute  @Sangfroid normally says 5 is Choppas, 15/20 is Hackas, 10 is personal choice depending on how good you are with positioning etc.

One thing to note is that now you only have to be as close when you pile in the positioning aspect of the 1" range is easier to do so we might see a swing back to it for the units of 10.

[Ravinsild]

29 minutes ago, Malakree said:

One thing to note is that now you only have to be as close when you pile in the positioning aspect of the 1" range is easier to do so we might see a swing back to it for the units of 10.

I've read this sentence several times over, but is there any way you could say it differently? I keep getting mildly confused. 

What I *think* you are saying is that now, models need only be within 1", and not base to base, for their 1" weapons to hit, so it is now easier to use 1" weapons? Base to base contact is no longer strictly required? 

[PlasticCraic]

We only ever had to be within 1".  But the old rule was that to pile in, you had to end up closer to the nearest enemy model.  Which is impossible if you were already 0" away (can't be closer than in contact) - so you could be "locked" in base to base, unable to pile in.  Which could leave the guys at the back, out of 1" range, blocked out and unable to get closer.

Whereas today, you only have to end up equally as close, or closer.  Meaning you can start off in base to base contact, but still slide around (or even move out and back in) as long as you end up still in base to base.

It just gives you a little bit more freedom to move in combat, and makes it a little bit less common that your models at the back will be locked out of 1" range.

[Ravinsild]

1 hour ago, PlasticCraic said:

We only ever had to be within 1".  But the old rule was that to pile in, you had to end up closer to the nearest enemy model.  Which is impossible if you were already 0" away (can't be closer than in contact) - so you could be "locked" in base to base, unable to pile in.  Which could leave the guys at the back, out of 1" range, blocked out and unable to get closer.

Whereas today, you only have to end up equally as close, or closer.  Meaning you can start off in base to base contact, but still slide around (or even move out and back in) as long as you end up still in base to base.

It just gives you a little bit more freedom to move in combat, and makes it a little bit less common that your models at the back will be locked out of 1" range.

Yes that was explained to me on my first game of AoS 2. As you can tell I have not played much AoS, mostly 40k but I like AoS more now. Between Khorne Bloodbound and Ironjawz I really think I’ve found my armies. 

Even though I started in September 2017 to GW Games starting with Blood Bowl table top, and I had an entire Khorne army, I only ever played 10 or less games. Now I’m trying to get Games in weekly because I just really love my Ironjawz. 

[PlasticCraic]

7 minutes ago, Ravinsild said:

Even though I started in September 2017 to GW Games starting with Blood Bowl table top, and I had an entire Khorne army, I only ever played 10 or less games. Now I’m trying to get Games in weekly because I just really love my Ironjawz. 

That's awesome!

[broche]

10 hours ago, PlasticCraic said:

True, unless the Fungoid is your General ?

Right now knowing that the MK can move 12'' with the hero phase free move, i'll have hard time using another general. Being able to move the MK 24'' on a 4+ each turn just seem too powerful. It's sad that fungoid can only use his command if he is the general.

However i'm sure there's a good mixed destro list with him.