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Malign Portents


Will Myers

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7 hours ago, shinros said:

True, and the topic is going off course. I will drop it for now. 

Still, thank you for the discussion! It was cool chatting with someone who's opinion was drastically different yet it didn't devolve into name calling or get heated. I hope whatever happens, you are happy with the new Death stuff and continue on with the faction as you are obviously very passionate about it. Merry Christmas!

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8 hours ago, shinros said:

I understand, but death gameplay style in my opinion is about hordes, wound regeneration and negation. Strong/buffing heroes along with elites and the bulk of your army being a tide of bodies. I personally feel starting Death is an easier prospect compared to whfb but the issue is we lack tools compared to other factions. Death should NOT in my opinion from a game play stand point out elite another alliance. 

The tide of bodies support the elites so they can do work. Or you go the route of the tide of bodies being your main damage dealer via the supporting heroes.

I don’t think death will loose the horde factor in their gameplay, as I don’t think if we do get deathcast models it’ll be an elite infantry - it’ll be nagash having additional champions to the mortarchs. After all he only has 3 at the moment, and one of them is Manfred.... plus look what happened to the Carrion King, it’s obvious Nasgash is always looking for new lieutenants.

Who knows  what’s gonna happen with a new death faction. What I think is certain is that it won’t be what it was WHFB. 

More importantly and as someone said earlier, the gw design team are doing a fantastic job. So I have a lot of faith in them to do something amazing with death. 

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11 minutes ago, NurglesFirstChosen said:

I don’t think death will loose the horde factor in their gameplay, as I don’t think if we do get deathcast models it’ll be an elite infantry - it’ll be nagash having additional champions to the mortarchs. After all he only has 3 at the moment, and one of them is Manfred.... plus look what happened to the Carrion King, it’s obvious Nasgash is always looking for new lieutenants.

Who knows  what’s gonna happen with a new death faction. What I think is certain is that it won’t be what it was WHFB. 

More importantly and as someone said earlier, the gw design team are doing a fantastic job. So I have a lot of faith in them to do something amazing with death. 

As I said again there is a whole book already detailing how nagash makes more deathlords which are the equivalent of mortarch's. 

 

Read this when it comes out next year, it used to be a warhammer world exclusive novel. This book is about how someone becomes a deathlord one of nagash's champions. To add this book takes place before all the death novel's it occurs during the age of chaos. 

BLPROCESSED-Nagash-The-Undying-King.jpg

 

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16 minutes ago, AthlorianStoners said:

Still, thank you for the discussion! It was cool chatting with someone who's opinion was drastically different yet it didn't devolve into name calling or get heated. I hope whatever happens, you are happy with the new Death stuff and continue on with the faction as you are obviously very passionate about it. Merry Christmas!

Agreed, I try to be civil honestly it's just that I have been waiting so long and after reading undying king just for GW to go hey deathcast! I like stormcast a lot but I feel putting them everywhere and involving them in everything dilutes them. They are inspired by space marines but that does not mean they have to copy them 1 to 1. 

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1 minute ago, shinros said:

Agreed, I try to be civil honestly it's just that I have been waiting so long and after reading undying king just for GW to go hey deathcast! I like stormcast a lot but I feel putting them everywhere and involving them in everything dilutes them. They are inspired by space marines but that does not mean they have to copy them 1 to 1. 

Yeah of course, completely I understand and I should admit I can see the potential for them to be done poorly and fall flat. Lets just hope it doesn't come to that :) 

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57 minutes ago, AthlorianStoners said:

Starting to get a sense of what they mean, as others have said, they seem to be signalling a falling out of sorts with the general populace and the forces of Azyr, and a shift in belief to Nagash. 

I agree I sense a religous fallout is going to occur. I was honestly suprised nagashites are allowed to practice their faith in the open. Perhaps they don't know all the details but nagashites are nore than happy to help vampires.

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Always like seeing more ghosts. Everybody hoping for new deathrattle, vampires or deathcast but all I want is more spooky ghosts for my Nighthaunt and luckily the only confirmed upcoming models happens to be one. Of course I'm also aware that this teaser is probably more to do with new background lore and the Knight of Shrouds is all we'll be getting, but its enough for at least a small spark of hope. Who knows, maybe GW will surprise us all and do a super sized months long line of Death releases with something for everybody to bring the whole GA: Death up to the level of Order and Chaos. Highly unlikely, but I'll at least wait until the 4th the be disappointed.

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Looks like the portents are getting more and more overt. I really like this one. I do not think its showing ghosts. Ghosts would be nighthaunt, we know those look much spookier. I think they are either possessed or somewhat influenced, but at their core, regular mortal villagers. It certainly is a very overt sign of Nagashs influence, something a trader might witness when he arrives at an isolated community or the last think a happless traveler sees after sticking his nose in the forbidden shed.

 

2 hours ago, AthlorianStoners said:

Starting to get a sense of what they mean, as others have said, they seem to be signalling a falling out of sorts with the general populace and the forces of Azyr, and a shift in belief to Nagash. 

Might not even be shift in Faith to Nagash, just a showing how great its reach is outside of Azyr. We have to remember that Nagash is no longer the dread great Nekromancer, but the de facto god of Death, with all the positive traits and duties that includes. Add that Nagash has been fighting throughout the Age of Chaos and we have some lore that he actively reacts to prayer and compare that to the other six remaining gods who all abandoned the mortal humans in some form during the Age of Chaos. I think it is understandable that many non-Azyrites are not exactly happy with Sigmar and hold Nagash in higher regard.

 

1 hour ago, shinros said:

I agree I sense a religous fallout is going to occur. I was honestly suprised nagashites are allowed to practice their faith in the open. Perhaps they don't know all the details but nagashites are nore than happy to help vampires.

Well, Sigmar still wants to ally with Nagash and there are propably religious practises dating back all the way to the Age of Myth. I think it is important to remember that Age of Sigmar is a pantheistic, with the mortals of the Age of Myth propably worshipping all of the eight in some form, even Gorkamorka. I would expect that even the most fervent sigmarite in Azyr still pays his respect to Nagash. What is it to Sigmar if a Nagashites venerates and helps vampires? As far as he is concerned, vampires are not his enemies, Chaos is. So far they propably make less trouble in the free cities than the likes of scourge privateers and darkling covens and even those are actively colaborated with.

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Im getting nothing from the portents.

 

however just struck me. And may have been mentioned before, so apologies. But it says the Age of Hope is Dead. I take that the only hope now, is with the help of the Dead, last this was seen was in the end times with Vlad assissting the empire, could we be seeing a macarbe saviour in the shape of the undead. I look forward to hearing Morr.

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This new video kind of excites me. An icon that looks like it could be worshiped, a ship heralding new arrivals with a star overhead like a beacon with what might be worshipers gaining new gifts from Nagash. Perhaps even the return of lost souls returning to our shores (ship reference) reclaiming mortal hosts to gain a new foothold in the realm of the living.

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13 hours ago, shinros said:

I own all the books he is building a black pyramid to trap marked chaos and stormcast souls because it's disrupting the natural order and depriving him of power. I have also read the warhammer exclusive novel(I own it) detailing how a death lord is actually made and they can be from all walks of life in the death faction.  I also suspect you are going to bring up when Nagash muses on how stormcast work and function and the fact he owns Tarsus Bullheart's soul. 

So ok fine let's say he goes this route I mean he finds the mortarch's lacking in certain areas as per lord of undeath but that gives character to death in my opinion reanimation is not perfect nor is the stormcast. So let's say Nagash makes these improved whatevers elite skeletons or warriors or dark knights etc what do we do with the mortarch's? I mean clearly these new guys are better why should he need Mannfred, Neferata or Arkhan? Or even the deathlords? This could just be me being paranoid but if GW does such a faction and they become death's new "thing" the new "main" faction for death where the narrative is focused on for the alliance? 

You have a faction of every spooky thing of death and you make an elite heavy armoured army as the focus of the alliance? After waiting 2+ years? I mean.. sure gw can do it but if they do?

I am done with Death, that's it. Just going to twiddle my thumbs and wait for slaanesh and aelves. I mean the herald and the gameplay of the shadespire skeletons shows me the clear game play direction for death which fits the general perception of the alliance but hey. People want such an army fine. I might even be the minority. I mean I would take an elite vampire or wight unit dressed in the theme of deathlords(mortarch's etc), still stormcast don't have to be a part of that.  

It's great that you own all the books. What makes your reaction so unique however is that you are aware of how the narrative of Nagash is evolving but seem to dislike one of the more logical outcomes for no real reason. As is mentioned in the books Nagash is defeated by Chaos, not in full control of all armies that are in the realm of Death, upset that a great piece of souls do not even go to the realm of death and luckily for him he now owns a soul of someone who logically speaking would not be his.

I think your asking some good questions and as a fan of Chaos I can even awnser them for you. 
- What do we do with the Mortarchs?
They will remain as upper generals of Nagash, keep in mind that what is suggested here is not a warrior who's power goes well and beyond that of Mortarchs. What is suggested is that a warrior is created that can reap the soul of it's victim so that it belongs to Nagash. In essence what Death does not have now is something like that. Narratively speaking it would be an elite warrior that Nagash can create easier, certainly weaker as Mortarch's but much stronger as a regular undead soldier.
This difference can also be found in Order and Chaos or even Destruction. In Order a Stromcast is much more potent as a regular Free Guild human warrior. The existance of Stormcast does not make their heroes moot or that of the human warrior. It just shows the elite. The same is true for Marauders and Chaos Warriors within Chaos. The same is also true for Orruk Ardboys and Orruk Brutes. While Flesh Eater Courts allready have such a warrior Deathrattle, Nighthaunt and Deathlords do not. 
Visualy speaking it would act as a very functional unit that clearly ties Deathrattle, Nighthaunt and Deathlords to each other.

- I mean clearly these new guys are better why should he need Mannfred, Neferata or Arkhan? Or even the deathlords?
For the simple reason that Archaon needs Khul, the Glottkin etc, Just because you have acces to an elite warrior does not make the super elite (heroes) moot. It's here where I really have a problem following you resentment against the idea. It's the same as asking why Morghast have two forms or why Vampires are still part of Death at all. The awnser to this is that adding characters is never a bad plan nor is adding elites to something that allrady contains elites. E.g. Blood Warriors do not make Skullcrushers moot or Skullreapers for that matter.

What I would say to conclude this subject is that Nagash needs Mannfred and the others to lead his armies because he cannot be everywhere at any place. His new weapon to start this war could be the suggested new elite warriors, capable of empowering Nagash while they kill their victims.

- If GW does such a faction and they become death's new "thing" the new "main" faction for death where the narrative is focused on for the alliance?
I've not seen anyone suggesting something like that. I do not think there suddenly will be more new Allegiances. Instead I believe we will see several Allegiances fleshed out more. Because one thing we arguably allready have too much of are Allegiances. What we don't have for several Allegiances is sufficient choices to actually make a creative army.

What my suggestion is is one new elite unit, likely for Deathlords, not a whole new faction.

- You have a faction of every spooky thing of death and you make an elite heavy armoured army as the focus of the alliance? After waiting 2+ years? I mean.. sure gw can do it but if they do?
Again I don't really know where this idea comes from. I nor other have suggested a new Allegiance. What I think we see is that Nagash has found a way to create new warriors who's power match that of the current elites we see in Order, Chaos and Destruction. If the whole field is as strong as a Stormcast, Blood Warrior or Orruk Brute it can be important to have that sort of elite to be capable to battle several of the different Allegiances.

What is very clearly stated currently is that Nagash  while controlling many Undead seems to have realized that his current armies can't really compete with the new and improven Order, Chaos and Destruction. To some player's annoyance this actually matches the competitive scene currently aswell. Death is not preforming all too well and the likely reason for that is due to the available designed units.

So in order to logically follow up on narrative and design I do still expect elite new warriors for the forces of Nagash. Flesh Eater Courts basically has this selection allready but Nagash is fully aware that they are not completely under his control because they are not completely dead.
In addition to this elite unit I would also not be suprised if we also actually saw the Carrion King in a model form much later this year. Likely leading Flesh Eater Courts for his own purposes.

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55 minutes ago, Tonhel said:

The new video is nice., but still I have no idea what Malign Portents will mean for AoS. I can only hope that it means waves of new miniatures!

My current best guess is an expansion to Age of Sigmar, as it's really shown as something new and almost as a game on it's own. When we look at the MP website we see links to 40K, Necromunda, Shadespire and Age of Sigmar Malign Portents (not just AoS). 

I believe the intention again is to have something akin to Storm of Chaos (2004) for Age of Sigmar. Meaning we will see new models for several lines but also newer designs, including the Heralds. The two Heralds shown so far do not match much of the excisting lines one to one but do blend in and likely are the new plans for certain model lines to come. Basically MP would act to remove AoS more from WFB where this is needed (which isn't all Allegiances). 

As before though I think the videos will just act as playable scenario's. In all I think MP will be a book with additional rules making the AoS armies that more dynamic. Perhaps we will even see the influences of locations play a part in games played in scenario's of Malign Portents. Like with Storm of Chaos I do not expect tons and tons of new models but enough to transfer the development of the ages and stories to the game. 

Like I hoped with GH2017 I hope the following will again be adressed:
- Battalion costs for Matched Play or in general the rules revolving around Battalions ideally would be different.
- Magic for Age of Sigmar is currently extremely restricted and this actually removes a lot of the fantasy vibe AoS should have.
- Ranged attacks for Age of Sigmar currently still out preform how ranged attacks work in 40K and to me this actually removes a lot of the fantasy vibe AoS should have.

More soon! Cheers,

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15 minutes ago, Killax said:

My current best guess is an expansion to Age of Sigmar, as it's really shown as something new and almost as a game on it's own. When we look at the MP website we see links to 40K, Necromunda, Shadespire and Age of Sigmar Malign Portents (not just AoS). 

I believe the intention again is to have something akin to Storm of Chaos (2004) for Age of Sigmar. Meaning we will see new models for several lines but also newer designs, including the Heralds. The two Heralds shown so far do not match much of the excisting lines one to one but do blend in and likely are the new plans for certain model lines to come. Basically MP would act to remove AoS more from WFB where this is needed (which isn't all Allegiances). 

As before though I think the videos will just act as playable scenario's. In all I think MP will be a book with additional rules making the AoS armies that more dynamic. Perhaps we will even see the influences of locations play a part in games played in scenario's of Malign Portents. Like with Storm of Chaos I do not expect tons and tons of new models but enough to transfer the development of the ages and stories to the game. 

Like I hoped with GH2017 I hope the following will again be adressed:
- Battalion costs for Matched Play or in general the rules revolving around Battalions ideally would be different.
- Magic for Age of Sigmar is currently extremely restricted and this actually removes a lot of the fantasy vibe AoS should have.
- Ranged attacks for Age of Sigmar currently still out preform how ranged attacks work in 40K and to me this actually removes a lot of the fantasy vibe AoS should have.

More soon! Cheers,

I'm hoping they use it as an opportunity to layer on new factions that share models with existing factions to fix the stub factions like all much of death and all the high elves. Either by using existing keywords like Malignants to add Nighthaunt and the Mortis Engine together at last, have Dealthrattle contain all with the skeleton keyword to pull in Arkhan and the same thing Soul Blight and the vampire keyword to pull in Neferata and Mannfred. And while they're at it, Give Nagash the Archaeon treatment of sharing the keyword of all(or most of) the Death factions so he can lead any army(especially since he's already too expensive to run as an ally). In places were there's not a shared keyword that's not to generic(like the former high elf stuff that only have the too generic aelf keyword that would include wanderers), create new faction with a rule that said something the affect of "the following models gain the keyword [new faction name]".

Of course none of this means anything if it's just temporary for a campaign season. Don't do it as a campaign book, do it as a new expansion book that has the new faction rules, new allegiance abilities, artifacts, warscroll battalions and other stuff like battle plans and maybe still a campaign ruleset, but don't make it just about the campaign. And then when the GHB2018 rolls around, enshrine all the new stuff in there.

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22 minutes ago, Sheriff said:

I think a moonclan hero would be cool. 

Agreed!  Hell, give me a whole new moon clan army!  I bought the totem from the old Battle For Black Skull Pass set, just waiting for the Moonclans to get updated.  They’ll be my destruction faction for sure.

They have the core troops set.  They just need to update the characters and such.

 

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24 minutes ago, The Door Master said:

Nice, now I know I'll be getting two of the champions at least, this guy and the ghost. I'm holding out hope that the Moonclan grots could get some love next year since they're one of the more complete destruction factions and got left out of the GHB for allegiance stuff. Hopefully some plastic squigs aren't too much to hope for.

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