Next Death Battletome

[someone2040]

42 minutes ago, xspire said:

I mean, when you think about it, it actually wouldn't be a good idea for them to rebrand Tomb Kings. The simple fact is, Tomb Kings as an army was discontinued primarily because it was NOT cost effective: It had low sales and high production costs.

To generate more profit and more new players, it's not in GW's best interest to rebrand Tomb Kings. Popular opinion on this forum is that TKs are awesome - but look where we are... GA: Death forum, we might be slightly biased.

If you look at the majority of the AoS releases since launch, I would say that re-moulds or reproductions of existing units are few and far between, and most of the models actually released have been new concepts / new units.

Personally I don't agree that cost had anything to do with axing Tomb Kings. At the end of the day, there were a lot of newer kits that were quite nice in the Tomb Kings range which I'm sure GW would've liked to keep around to ultimately make their money back. Much nicer than some of the models they kept around for other factions (Grot Chariots, Orruk Boar Chariots, Aelf Chariots... lots of Chariots...) that I'm sure aren't cost effective to keep selling (But perhaps because they're older, have already made their money back anyway).

 

To me, the primary driver behind getting rid of the Tomb Kings is they didn't want 2 Skeletal factions. At the end of the day, no matter how cool War statues and Tomb Kings are, they bulk of the force are made up of Skeletons. You can easily axe the ****** old ones and just keep the Tomb Guards, but you're still a faction that's primarily Skeletons with some extra flavour.

 

I get the feeling, that ultimately they decided that Deathrattle was the way forwards and not the Tomb Kings.

Which is a true shame from a rules perspective, because the Tomb Kings faction, even if you cut a bunch of stuff, has a lot more depth to it than the Deathrattle does. Even if the only kits you kept were: Skeleton Chariots, Tomb Guard, Sepulchral Stalkers/Necropolis Knights, War Sphinx/Necrosphinx, Tomb King on Foot/Chariot, you've still got a ton more options than the current Deathrattle army. And that's cutting a bunch of cool stuff like the Bone Giant, Liche Priests, Casket of Souls, Skull Catapults, Tomb Scorpions, Ushabti, etc.

 

But at the end of the day, generic undead Skeletons probably do appeal to more people than egyptian ones do.

[xspire]

I think both of you guys are being naive if you think the decision wasn't based on money... You don't agree that cost had anything to do with it, I mean, there's almost nothing I can contribute further to the discussion if you believe that.

Woolly bro, how are they still a popular army...? They've had no new models produced since AoS launched. Popularity is determined by sales.

31 minutes ago, someone2040 said:

To me, the primary driver behind getting rid of the Tomb Kings is they didn't want 2 Skeletal factions.

How many different space marines are there? They aren't going to get rid of ANY product that's profitable with good margins and growth. If anything this is the opposite of the direction that GW is moving it's products in, their new successful products are all multi-use kits, you can make varying different units from 1 single kit. Less production cost, more sales and gameplay options. The fact that TKs had 'nice' and newer kits is irrelevant, you can't recuperate your money if they're expensive to produce, have lower margins, and lower sales. You don't 'make your money back' on individual products, they aren't running a corner shop...

39 minutes ago, someone2040 said:

 You can easily axe the ****** old ones and just keep the Tomb Guards, but you're still a faction that's primarily Skeletons with some extra flavour.

This is where you start to make sense. I agree - this fits in with GWs new approach to producing kits, make them multi faction / multi-use. E.g they would only need 1 'Skeleton' kit, and one 'Skeletal Knights' kit, you get the idea. If they wanted to KEEP TKs, this is what they would of done.

WoollyMammoth -  If they wanted to simply re-brand to protect IP they would of been able to do so without discontinuing the range, using the ideas above.

[Lavy]

@xspire  , I think what these gentlemen are saying holds some weight. If Tomb Kings had ever seen real support from GW way back in fantasy battle then their sales would have been better. Thier rules and army books were always vastly underpowered, so less people purchased the models as a result. 

I do agree about GW wanting to move away from the ancient Egyptian aesthetic, to make it easier to put their stamp on their product.

I have to be honest with myself though; I really don’t expect to see a new fully fleshed (pun intended) death faction until 2019 the earliest.

 

[Sception]

I wouldn't say TK never got real support.  They had one heck of a model line, including several real gems with some absolute love behind them.  They got a ton of stuff when the split first happened, and several years later they got a major revision with several very impressive new plastic kits.  Not just new units either, they got some replacements for old kits too, which is a big deal.  They had several neat & unique mechanics that nobody else had, including their scroll-based magic system and their iconic chariot units.

No, their rules were never good, and yes that absolutely hurt their popularity and sales, but that shouldn't be read as a deliberate slight.  Rather it's a painful result of GW's lacking rules development process, in particular their lack of play testing and quality control.  As a result, some times things come out too good, and some times they come out not good enough.  Sometimes new rules wildly overcompensate in an effort to course correct, and sometimes they wildly undercompensate for fear of overcompensation.  Early books in an edition tend to be quickly eclipsed not so much because of deliberate power creep, but rather as a result of designers looking at things that didn't go over well with the last book and trying to do better in the next - as we saw with TK in 8th edition not quite figuring out how to make the rules for undead work in the new system and the later VC book taking what was learned and improving it, leaving TK behind.

Or else they see something that was too powerful previously and specifically trying to fix it not with errata - which would involve admitting the mistake the last time around, but rather by writing new rules specifically to counter it and as a result snoballing the problem, as we saw with the accidentally way too powerful vamp count book in 7th edition, then the Daemon book being made specifically to counter them and consequently trampling the entire game, then the high elf book came out specifically to counter daemons and only made the situation worse and forcing the major overall changes in 8th edition.

None of that is a deliberate slight to tomb kings.  GW does not ever make any armies or units deliberately bad, at least not when they're actively releasing expensive new kits for those very armies.  The recent compendium revision to TK might have been a deliberate hatchet job, but their oldhammer army books absolutely were not.  GW rules design is like a craps shoot and TK just had some unlucky roles in a row, and unfortunately that spat of bad luck just happened to coincide with the scrapping of the reworking of the entire game and scrapping of any faction that wasn't selling well at the time.

What's tragic is that TK had a big spike in rules quality, and with it a spike in sales and interests, right at the end of 8th edition with the End Times undead legion rules and start of Age of Sigmar with their stellar Compendium ruleset.  Unfortunately, it was too late to save them, because GW makes decisions like two years in advance, and consequently handles course correction about as well as a runaway freight train.

[NinjaDetective]

While I dont see tomb kings coming back i would love some new mummies units or heros, used to be able to take the back before they split the armies.

I still think we are going to get something in february next year.

Currently looks like its blood angels dark angels necromunda in november, christmas stuff chapter approved in december, which according to some leaks isnt includeing the new codexes which I think lends credence to the armies missing from ghb 2017 getting battletones, january is deamon codex, then february I think will be deathrattle and lead into malign portents, the Age of sigmar starter set will be almost 3 years old so seems like a good time for a new box, Stormcast vs Death could be a good chance in my opinion. 

[Aeon]

Will there be Battletomes going forward or just new units in campaign books?

[Sleboda]

On 10/30/2017 at 4:40 PM, Sception said:

.. the studio took care to ensure that the Shardspire skittles would fit right in with the existing skeleton models - same looking style, same looking armor & shields, etc. 

This is my biggest reason for pessimism when it comes to seeing something new and cool for Death anytime soon.

These models, while very nice, are really just super middle-of-the-road, run of the mill, gothic skeletons.  Nothing about them is AoS-y. It's almost like GW is not sure where they are taking undead, despite the Morghasts, Mortarchs, and Nagash from the End Times, and the result was these super-safe Sepulchral Guard.

I truly would have thought that given the mystery surrounding the Kataphranes, and given that the Guard were once living soldiers/cops etc. in the pre-cursed city of Sharespire, that we would see them as design harbingers for what NuDeth would look like. If there are, then Death is in for a very boring revamp, if any at all.

 

Nope, I expect that Death is still years away from a proper relaunch.

 

Would love to be wrong!!!

 

In the meantime, Necrons and Orks please!

[Sception]

Yeah, that's about where I am.  There has been no indication from GW that I've been able to recognize to indicate they have any sort of vision or design direction for the undead in the game.  So far, we're not really pat of the game or setting, just a compulsory afterthought.  Even our characters are all just hangers on from the defunct oldhammer setting.  The end times models - Nagash, the mortarchs, and Morghasts - had a lot of promise for a compelling new visual direction for undead in the new game.  That look could have been expanded into an all new, distinct, and intimidating range for the new range, but three years later and there's zero indication that GW had or has any intention of doing anything with it.

And then the Sepulchral Guard come out, and the herald of nagash is previewed, and... they're great models.  Don't get me wrong.  But there doesn't seem to be any vision to them, they're just well executed examples of very generic concepts that just as easily could have been released in 7th or 8th edition fantasy.  When this is what we see after three years of waiting, I'm just not going to get excited or optimistic about it.

[NinjaDetective]

2 hours ago, Sception said:

Yeah, that's about where I am.  There has been no indication from GW that I've been able to recognize to indicate they have any sort of vision or design direction for the undead in the game.  So far, we're not really pat of the game or setting, just a compulsory afterthought.  Even our characters are all just hangers on from the defunct oldhammer setting.  The end times models - Nagash, the mortarchs, and Morghasts - had a lot of promise for a compelling new visual direction for undead in the new game.  That look could have been expanded into an all new, distinct, and intimidating range for the new range, but three years later and there's zero indication that GW had or has any intention of doing anything with it.

And then the Sepulchral Guard come out, and the herald of nagash is previewed, and... they're great models.  Don't get me wrong.  But there doesn't seem to be any vision to them, they're just well executed examples of very generic concepts that just as easily could have been released in 7th or 8th edition fantasy.  When this is what we see after three years of waiting, I'm just not going to get excited or optimistic about it.

What sort of direction would you like to see? I love skellies so im pretty happy with just a Battletome, but wouldnt mind adding some mad scientist, werewolf sort of additions.

[Sception]

Something new.  Expand what we saw in the end times stuff.  Skeletons, but with armor and gear reminiscent  of the morghasts and mortarchs - sharp, layered, armor, sigil plates with vaguely egyptian/babylonian sigils.  Wraithy weapons, with twisted faces on the hafts.  Ghostly smoke curling out from the skulls & rib cages.  Skeletons that aren't 'just' skeletons, but rather are skeletons raised from a centuries old civilization steeped in necromantic lore, built by the Mortarchs to worship Nagash.

The current skeletons and wights, and by extension the shardspire skeletons made in the same style, have no visual queues to associate them with Nagash or his mortarchs.  They're the generic remains of civilizations that never existed in the AoS setting to begin with.  They're leftovers from the abandoned setting of an abandoned game.

[Inqy]

I see where you're coming from. Currently most of the Death factions are just generic groupings of types. Deathrattle=skeletons, deadwalkers=zombies, Nighthaunt-ghosts. 

A faction with more of a unifying background plot, aesthetic and general feel as an army would do a lot for making undead in Age of Sigmar more distinctive. Heck even in WHFB, Vampire Counts got a hell of a lot more interesting when they added in the clans and their different aesthetics. Soulblight and the generic clan powers they've added just don't have the same feel or significance.

Or to look at more recent pop culture fads, Undead in Darksouls with the setting's whole mythology crafted around the idea of dynamic but perishable fire and the reborn souls managed to basically take what are on the surface very standard looking medieval fantasy undead and make them into something that's distinct and compelling even while not actually being all that different on the surface.

I think Death in AoS just needs more thought behind what they stand for as a whole, and also what individual themes their factions are pushing. (And hopefully give each faction deeper themes than just being a grouping of the same type of monsters.)

[xspire]

8 hours ago, Sception said:

Something new.  Expand what we saw in the end times stuff.  Skeletons, but with armor and gear reminiscent  of the morghasts and mortarchs - sharp, layered, armor, sigil plates with vaguely egyptian/babylonian sigils.  Wraithy weapons, with twisted faces on the hafts.  Ghostly smoke curling out from the skulls & rib cages.  Skeletons that aren't 'just' skeletons, but rather are skeletons raised from a centuries old civilization steeped in necromantic lore, built by the Mortarchs to worship Nagash.

The current skeletons and wights, and by extension the shardspire skeletons made in the same style, have no visual queues to associate them with Nagash or his mortarchs.  They're the generic remains of civilizations that never existed in the AoS setting to begin with.  They're leftovers from the abandoned setting of an abandoned game.

This is a direction I could definitely get behind, they need to start using the new content they've tried to shoehorn in, rather than reverting to type. I think any new death kits by design would be focused towards elite units, multi-option / build kits with less models, so you would expect they would have this extra level of detail and attention to aesthetic - I think the morghast / mortarch theme still has a lot of unexplored model potential.

As much as I would personally want some more vampire themed models, I can't see where they could go with this really, I'm not sure there's anything fresh to be done with vampires, there's never been anything extensive about the vampires apart from their factional lore. Model wise -  in fantasy they still just had vampire lords really that was it, it just so happened that they were ridiculously powerful.

[Rob Hawkins]

I think we've reached a point in the Rumor Engine pics where clearly none of the pics are anything Death related.  They've just released the Shadespire Skeletons & Skaven, which account for the tombstone, and the arch & bars pics, which were the only designs that might have been for Death.  So, if there is anything new on the horizon for Death, GW has been intentionally holding back any rumor pics.  If they're not holding back pics, then the only thing we can look forward to is the Herald of Nagash character and maybe a Battletome that has some Deathrattle combinations, but no new models.

[Sception]

other ideas to expand the death's narrative/lore/place in the setting, such that you could expand factions or build new ones:  Emphasize Shyish's underworld.  Make it clear that Shyish's surface world is like the tip of an iceberg, not terribly important.  That Nagash was willing to suffer living peoples there before the coming of chaos, and was willing to sacrifice it to archaon's hordes, because it's basically just his front lawn, not his domain proper.  That beneath the surface are endless passages, open caverns large enough to have their own weather pattens, housing entire cities or even nations populated entirely by the undead.  a whole variety of unliving, immortal civilizations each serving Nagash in their own way, perhaps even waging the occasional war with each other for his favor.

The undead we've seen so far in AoS would only be Nagash's weakest and least valued servants, traditional undead that are only the remnants of mortal civilizations - fresh dead rising as aimless zombies, degenerate civilizations succumbing to the flesh eater taint, lone vampired carving little mortal fiefdoms like toddlers playing with their food, long dead cities where old bones don't lie easy.  Dead souls wailing their sorrows.

But in the underworld, you'd have something new, entire cities not of the undead, but of the never-born, imortal necropolitans soulforged from necromantic energy, citizens that were never alive in the first place.  Bleak academies ever furthering the study of necromantic lore.  Choirs of Morghasts.  Glowing necropoli.  Perfected vampyric princes, freed from their bloodlust by Nagash's favor, who sustain themselves instead by drinking in the dark magic that permeates their home.

Model-wise, think smaller, wingless morghasts as the basic species here.  Stormcast-sized skeletons with ghostly spirits twisting within their open cages, smokey necrotic energy billowing around their bones like muscle.  Their mages could have those spirits billowing out of them in a flood of dark magic.  Their warriors could be clad in black armor and wielding ethereal wychblades.  But that would just be the species, you could have multiple factions of them following different cultures, in the same way you could have different human or ork or elf subfactions, each with their own style.

[BunkhouseBuster]

3 hours ago, Sception said:

other ideas to expand the death's narrative/lore/place in the setting, such that you could expand factions or build new ones:  Emphasize Shyish's underworld.  Make it clear that Shyish's surface world is like the tip of an iceberg, not terribly important.  That Nagash was willing to suffer living peoples there before the coming of chaos, and was willing to sacrifice it to archaon's hordes, because it's basically just his front lawn, not his domain proper.  That beneath the surface are endless passages, open caverns large enough to have their own weather pattens, housing entire cities or even nations populated entirely by the undead.  a whole variety of unliving, immortal civilizations each serving Nagash in their own way, perhaps even waging the occasional war with each other for his favor.

The undead we've seen so far in AoS would only be Nagash's weakest and least valued servants, traditional undead that are only the remnants of mortal civilizations - fresh dead rising as aimless zombies, degenerate civilizations succumbing to the flesh eater taint, lone vampired carving little mortal fiefdoms like toddlers playing with their food, long dead cities where old bones don't lie easy.  Dead souls wailing their sorrows.

But in the underworld, you'd have something new, entire cities not of the undead, but of the never-born, imortal necropolitans soulforged from necromantic energy, citizens that were never alive in the first place.  Bleak academies ever furthering the study of necromantic lore.  Choirs of Morghasts.  Glowing necropoli.  Perfected vampyric princes, freed from their bloodlust by Nagash's favor, who sustain themselves instead by drinking in the dark magic that permeates their home.

Model-wise, think smaller, wingless morghasts as the basic species here.  Stormcast-sized skeletons with ghostly spirits twisting within their open cages, smokey necrotic energy billowing around their bones like muscle.  Their mages could have those spirits billowing out of them in a flood of dark magic.  Their warriors could be clad in black armor and wielding ethereal wychblades.  But that would just be the species, you could have multiple factions of them following different cultures, in the same way you could have different human or ork or elf subfactions, each with their own style.

All of that sounds awesome to me!

[Kosmion]

My guess is theres basically gonna be a deatlords tome, but with various options to build armies around rattle, walkers etc. 

[Heroflegend21]

I’m new to death and was thinking of making a summoning- centric army with strong models and making tar pits across the board:

Arkhan the Black

6 Morghasts In units of 2 (archai and/or Harbinger)

60 zombies

corpse cart

40 skeleton warriors/ 30 Grave guard

wight king 

I understand it’s a lot of slow movers but it has quite a bit of points for summoning to replenish units. But the question I’m wondering is should I stick with death rattle or dead walkers or keep both as listed? Or will this idea of a list be short lived? I would really appreciate the feedback as I’m really considering a death army! Thank you

 

[AthlorianStoners]

Hoping for a Deathrattle release as well. I don't think it would take so many new units to reinvent them. 

A couple of ideas I've had (and seen around as well) are: 
 

• Giving Arkhan the Deathrattle keyword and making him the keystone figure of the faction. 
• Give Morghasts the Deathrattle keyword as well. 
• Split Skeletons up into Swords/Spears, with some varying rules for each. Perhaps allow the Spearmen to have Javelins or the like, essentially creating a ranged unit. 
• New, Elite units. Basically Morghast/Stormcast hybrids, used from the stuff Nagash has stolen from the Stormcasts. Give them some different builds perhaps allowing for a ranged option as well. 
• New monstrous cavalry unit. Basically mini-Mortarchs. 
• New monstrous creature, some form of Bone Giant in the aesthetic of the Mortarchs/Morghasts. 
• New Hero unit, a Skeleton priest so you can have magic without needing to take Arkhan. 

Four new kits isn't a massive release but it would greatly flesh out a new faction. Factoring in the added units and Warscroll changes you would have: 

1. Arkhan 
2. Morghasts Archai
3. Morghasts Harbigngers 
4. Wight King
5. Skeleton Spearmen 
6. Skeleton Sword...men?
7. Grave Guard 
8. Black Knights 
9. New Morghast/Stormy hybrids 
10. New Monstrous Creature
11. New Cavalry 
12. New Priest

You split the new units up into having different builds you can add another 4-8 units right there. Thats not at all bad and you could have a really awesome faction out of that.

Obviously a whole lot of wishful thinking here, of course, but would be so cool if that happened.

[Sception]

the problem I have with some of your suggestions here are that they're mostly things I'd rather see out of an expanded Death Lords faction, rather than stuff I'd like to see in Deathrattle.  In particular, I'd rather Arkhan and Morghasts (including any non-winged, pseudo-stormcast Morghasts) stayed in Death Lords.

The things I expect to see:

• no new units at all
• skeletons with swords as a different unit from skeletons with spears
• grave guard with great weapons as a different unit from grave guard with shields
• no change to base rules or stat lines
• a bunch of formations
• subfaction rules little removed from those that already exist for death
• no casters apart from a command ability for wight kings
• no spell lore

What I would like to see instead is a bunch of ideas pillaged from the old tomb kings, including:

• skeletons with bows or crossbows
• skeleton/grave guard chariots
• black knights with stats appropriate to elite heavy cav
• grave guard with stats appropriate to elite infantry
• skeleton catapult/ballista/other seige weapon
• deathrattle monstrous cavalry (variety of options here)
• deathrattle  monstrous infantry (variety of options here)
• deathrattle ridden/unridden monsters (variety of options here)
• skeleton spellcaster

Now, for the monster, monstrous cav, monstrous infantry, there are a variety of ways they could be done.  The most obvious would be skeleton versions of equivalent units from mortal armies.  Skeleton ogres, skeleton giants, wights riding skeleton demigryphs, wight kings riding skeletal dragons, etc.  But I personally would rather see a page taken from the tomb kings book, with animated stone statues, only instead of egyptian sphinxes and animal-head gods, they would be gothic style stone gargoyles, dragons, and byzantine kings, in order to fit better with the aesthetic style of the existing Deathrattle range.  Imagine grave guard riding the gargoyle dogs from Ghostbusters, for instance.  Maybe keep regular skeleton giants and dragons.  Fluff it as necromantic energy fludding the very stones of the crumbling Deathrattle Necropoli, so that the city itself rises up when its long dead inhabitants march to war.

Mostly, I'd like to see regular undead versions of as many tomb king units as possible, in part so that players with old tomb king armies would have current rules to use for their old models.

 

Again, though I don't expect any of that.  I expect a minimal effort book with no new releases aimed mostly at trying to convince players to buy more of the kits that already exist through formations rather than filling gaps in the army (archers, mages, monsters) or fixing any problems with existing rules (grave guard & black knights no where near tough or killy enough to fill their conceptual niches).

 

[AverageBoss]

I am also hoping for additional keywords on several units. I feel that would go a long way towards helping give some more variety to the death micro armies.

Arkhan should gain the Deathrattle keyword (just as Manfred and Neferata should gain Soulblight).
Not sure about Mortarchs, but it would be the easiest way to give skeletons an MI option without creating a new kit.
Skeletal crossbows should come back.

[someone2040]

8 hours ago, AverageBoss said:

Arkhan should gain the Deathrattle keyword (just as Manfred and Neferata should gain Soulblight).

Should he though?

I think it's probably one of the less contentious points, but people need to realise that Race != Faction. Arkhan is a Skeleton yes, but it doesn't necessarily mean he mixes with the identity the Deathrattle faction has (It also doesn't mean he can't either). My understanding of the Deathrattle is they are supposed to be the Barrow legions, or the skeletal warriors of civilizations long past. That doesn't necessarily fit with Arkhan, who really, like the Mortarchs doesn't really have a strong connection to the Age of Sigmar. 

Sure, I'm sure Arkhan raises plenty of Skeleton Warriors to fight for him, and he's a Skeleton himself, but it doesn't necessarily make him part of that factions identity. Not saying it couldn't work, just saying they'd need fluff to make sure the connection is solid.

 

As for Deathrattle. IMO with the death of Tomb Kings, they should really embrace the whole Undying Legions aspect of them. They should be the militaristic death faction, where there are unending ranks of undead warriors marching in unison. This means bring back stuff like Skeleton Archers/Xbows, Chariots, Skull Catapults, Bone Throwers, Lichs, etc. Make them feel like an Undead legion taken from long ago.

My general feeling on the more 'unique' aspects are that factions should have boundaries. I think they have to be careful, because they've already got Deathlords which I'm sure at some point will include some more humble Morghast infantry. You also have to make sure it matches the narrative given to the Deathrattle. If that narrative is undying bone legions, then whatever they create has to match that as well (And I think it's unlikely they'll bring back 'war statues' in Deathrattle).

 

Overall, it'll be interesting to see what they do.

[AthlorianStoners]

14 hours ago, Sception said:

the problem I have with some of your suggestions here are that they're mostly things I'd rather see out of an expanded Death Lords faction, rather than stuff I'd like to see in Deathrattle.  In particular, I'd rather Arkhan and Morghasts (including any non-winged, pseudo-stormcast Morghasts) stayed in Death Lords.

 

2 hours ago, someone2040 said:

Should he though?

I think it's probably one of the less contentious points, but people need to realise that Race != Faction. Arkhan is a Skeleton yes, but it doesn't necessarily mean he mixes with the identity the Deathrattle faction has (It also doesn't mean he can't either). My understanding of the Deathrattle is they are supposed to be the Barrow legions, or the skeletal warriors of civilizations long past. That doesn't necessarily fit with Arkhan, who really, like the Mortarchs doesn't really have a strong connection to the Age of Sigmar. 

Just replying to the Arkhan/Deathrattle question, I'd rather him join Deathrattle for a few reasons. I do get where you're coming from though. 

Overall, i feel like: 

• Placing Arkhan in Deathrattle gives the faction a figurehead, a model you can build lists around and also saves GW money in designing and producing a new kit. In the Deathlords faction, I feel as though Arkhan is underused. Let him be a bigger fish in a smaller pond. 
• Similarly, it can give new units a visual asthetic they can follow and be based on. Another skeleton sorcerer with a similar design to Arkhan would work well within the faction, as would some elite troops etc. 
• I personally don't want to see cool units like Arkhan or the Morghasts, or the hypothetical  Stormcast/Morghast things we all want, to be stuck in Deathlords. It's a faction that is limited in what can be done with it, and with Nagash in said faction, there is only so much Arkhan in particular can bring to the table.

From a lore perspective, while you (someone2040) said Arkhan doesn't fit with the identity of Deathrattle, I feel as though that can be reworked. Beastclaw Raiders and Flesheater courts were given new identities when they're tomes came out, with fully fleshed out lore creating a nice background. Something similar could be done with Arkhan and Deathrattle. 

By adding Arkhan to Deathrattle you give him the connection to AOS that he is lacking. Make him the guardian and commander of the remnants of forgotten empires. As a relic of a time long past, Arkhan fits within this theme well. It stands to reason he would find himself drawn to the sombre, forlorn and quite tragic idea of these Skeleton empires in the service of Nagash. They don't fit in to the current world of AOS, yet by Nagash's will they fight battles that don't really concern them or their future. This resonates with the core of Arkhan's character I feel, and if any of the development from End Times comes through it could be shown here in this battletome. 

That could be way to develop their faction. The silent, tragic armies of a silent tragic commander, who fight and die in the service of a cause that doesn't concern them. They've been left behind, but haven't been allowed to move on. 

[someone2040]

Yep, which is why I did say both:

3 hours ago, someone2040 said:

I think it's probably one of the less contentious points

and

3 hours ago, someone2040 said:

Not saying it couldn't work, just saying they'd need fluff to make sure the connection is solid.

 

Personally I have no issues with it as long as they tie in Arkhan properly into the history of the Deathrattle and has him as part of some significant Deathrattle empire.

I would actually prefer to see for Death that each sub-faction has a Mortarch (or more than 1) that is a part of it. Mannfred and Neferata for Soulblight (RIP Vlad :(), Arkhan for Deathrattle (but preferably also another important Wight King, Krell or not-Krell), Night of Shrouds potentially for Nighthaunt, Ushoran to return for Flesh-Eater Courts, and then more to come as other factions are created or expanded.

And also agree that if Arkhan gets shipped into Deathrattle, some form of Skeletal Lich's I think would have to follow. It'd be super weird for Arkhan to be the only caster in the faction (Which ultimately is the undying legion of warriors only at the moment).

[AthlorianStoners]

2 hours ago, someone2040 said:

I would actually prefer to see for Death that each sub-faction has a Mortarch (or more than 1) that is a part of it. Mannfred and Neferata for Soulblight (RIP Vlad :(), Arkhan for Deathrattle (but preferably also another important Wight King, Krell or not-Krell), Night of Shrouds potentially for Nighthaunt, Ushoran to return for Flesh-Eater Courts, and then more to come as other factions are created or expanded.

And also agree that if Arkhan gets shipped into Deathrattle, some form of Skeletal Lich's I think would have to follow. It'd be super weird for Arkhan to be the only caster in the faction (Which ultimately is the undying legion of warriors only at the moment).

Yeah, the other Mortarchs having their own factions would be f***ing awesome to me. Also sets a precedent for new Death factions to have their own Mortarchs released. 

Out of curiosity do you have any other ideas for future Death factions?

[smucreo]

It would be cool to see a faction of spirits that possess stuff, sort of like automatons and animated armor. They could have a mechanic where every time one of the animated armors are killed the spirits in there go to reinforce another guy in the unit, giving him + to hit or an extra attack or something.