Chaos keywords warscroll update

[hobgoblinclub]

1 hour ago, TheOtherJosh said:

That isn’t their example, it specifically states that this is for handling Allegiance Abilities.

And nothing is FAQ’d.

And, unfortunately, they give no examples of how this “works” for Allies.

I’ll refer you to all the situations where Nurgle  Rotbringers exists, but Pestilins doesn’t ... (which also follows under Nurgle.)

If “Nurgle Rotbringers” is synonymous with “Nurgle” does that mean that anywhere “Nurgle Rotbringers” is on the Allies list that you replace it with “Nurgle” and can bring anything Nurgle? How about Daemons of Nurgle? They’re a separate table?

It says 'all instances'. That'll cover allies. I think it's time to put this debate to bed. 

[TheOtherJosh]

1 hour ago, hobgoblinclub said:

It says 'all instances'. That'll cover allies. I think it's time to put this debate to bed. 

You do realize that the point they clarified “If you have a chaos deity keyword you get the allegiance Abilities” was never in question?

So in the Allies lists:

If it says:

Nurgle Rotbringers that translates to Nurgle which boils down to “Anything Nurgle Keyword” e.g. Pestilins, Daemons of Nurgle, Nurgle keyworded Tamurkhan’s Horde, etc.)

But if it says:

“Daemons of Nurgle” that’s actually just the units from the Pitched Battle Faction table “Daemons of Nurgle”?

Same with:

Clan Pestilins = > Clan Pestilins

... if that’s the case then that really needs to be FAQ’d. And clarity on what the Pitched Battle Faction tables are actually for...

[BrAiKo]

The pitched battle faction tables are for locating your troops under convenient headings, please stop reading so much into it.   The associated keyword takes precedence in all instances.  It's an elegant solution.  

While 'Rotbringers of Nurgle' and 'Nurgle Daemons' are clearly synonymous with Nurgle when they are listed as allies, Clan Pestilens is slightly more tricky as it has both keywords.   Now if an army can ally with Nurgle, they should be able to take Pestilens as allies as they have the keyword.  However, if an army can ally with Pestilens, this is not synonymous with all of Nurgle, only Pestilens allies can be taken (as Rotbringers and Daemons of Nurgle don't have the Pestilens keyword.

[TheOtherJosh]

However it is not “Nurgle Daemons” that are listed ... it is explicitly “Daemons of Nurgle” (the Pitched Battle Faction name) on the Ally list for Pestilins. And they explicitly do not have “Nurgle Rotbringers” (aka “Nurgle”) in their ally list.

This is particularly noticeable with the explicit keyword change to “Monsters of Chaos” where some have  “Chaos” and “Monsters of Chaos” and others also have “Monster” as an additional keyword. (Which allows summoning by the bray-Shaman for some but not others.)

And you’ll notice that “Monsters of  Chaos” is also a Pitched Battle Faction list name ... and an Allegiance keyword.

So, while both Rotbringers and Daemons have the Nurgle keyword, only “Nurgle Rotbringers” was called out as being synonymous with Nurgle.

Sure .. you could go for “Nurgle Allegiance” for Pestilins, but you loose out on the Pestilins Abilities, and their objective would be to keep the Pestilins Allegiance.

If they have “Nurgle Rotbringers” as an ally, I could see allowing “anything Nurgle” as proposed for Allies... but they don’t.

So the converse is not necessarily true.

And Daemons of Nurgle were explicitly separated from Rotbringers in the Pitched Battle Faction lists. (Unlike Blades of Khorne and Disciples of Tzeentch ... which previously had been Arcanites and Daemons of Tzeentch.)

Again. It really needs a proper FAQ.

Unfortunately, this really feels like a pretty poor bandaid for a set of situations where Allegiance names don’t match Pitched Battle Faction names.

[Arkiham]

I think you are literally the only person arguing that.. It's pretty much accepted that when someone is discussing say...daemons of nurgle or nurgle daemons they are accepted to be the same thing.

They are separated simply as the battletome hasn't been done yet, it's obvious they will be combined when it is, why is it obvious?  As the khorne models are in the battletome is blades of khorne, Tzeentch in disciples of Tzeentch, they've yet to announce the name for nurgle battletome so grouping it as such would be premature.

There's no need to be so pedantic, there is a fair few examples of stuff which is incorrectly worded but the base idea is understood 

But if you want, I'd love you know what unit that chaos Lord on manticore is meant to be buffing as that unit doesn't exist.

[BrAiKo]

Nurgle daemons = Nurgle just like all other daemons = their appropriate god.  Why would you not want it to work that way? Yes they messed up by splitting up Nurgle differently to the other gods in GH17 but it's probably so as not to spoil the name of the upcoming battletome.

To be honest guys I'm still awaiting the FAQ for Uno to come out (it's taking a while).  Until it comes out I'm still going to be keeping that skipping rope handy for when I have to skip my turn /s.

 

[someone2040]

20 hours ago, Arkiham said:

But if you want, I'd love you know what unit that chaos Lord on manticore is meant to be buffing as that unit doesn't exist.

No, you're just looking at an out of date warscroll.

https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/aos-warscroll-chaos-lord-manticore-en.pdf

The app is pretty ****** sometimes when it comes to warscrolls, I have no idea how GW can be that sloppy about it. There are a bunch of units (mainly in the Chaos section) that still use the old black and white pdf format rather than the warscrolls that were printed in the Grand Alliance books. Be'Lakor is another instance of an incorrect warscroll (He should have the MONSTER keyword).

[Thomas Lyons]

6 hours ago, someone2040 said:

No, you're just looking at an out of date warscroll.

https://www.games-workshop.com/resources/PDF/AoS_Warscrolls/aos-warscroll-chaos-lord-manticore-en.pdf

The app is pretty ****** sometimes when it comes to warscrolls, I have no idea how GW can be that sloppy about it. There are a bunch of units (mainly in the Chaos section) that still use the old black and white pdf format rather than the warscrolls that were printed in the Grand Alliance books. Be'Lakor is another instance of an incorrect warscroll (He should have the MONSTER keyword).

The app?  For Kharadron Overlords, the app, website, book, and cards have 6+ errors in damage and ranges as well as multiple abilities and a completely wrong Thunderer warscroll across all formats.  No updates have been offered for any of these resources.  People are playing this wrong because they don't know about the updates.  People are making purchases under rules that don't exist or have been dramatically changed.  

[Kaleb Daark]

On 15/10/2017 at 7:34 PM, Killax said:

@Kaleb Daark for example  

Aye... but they've still fallen short of giving them the ability to take a mark, oh for marked skin wolves and mammoths...

 

still, better than the nothing we had before.