Jump to content

Let's chat: Steelheart's Champions


Killax

Recommended Posts

Lol fair. My experience has just been that no one in the area is playing them and the few times I've seen them they get bashed pretty badly. 

I've been trying to put decks together and struggling a bit. Aggressive decks feel really risky since if you get unlucky and lose a model early, it's super hard to recover. Defensive/Objective decks are a bit dull but mainly feel inconsistent compared to a similar deck for Khorne or Skeletons. I'm struggling to find the niche that Stormcast do better than other Warbands. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 92
  • Created
  • Last Reply
On 19.1.2018 at 7:30 PM, Requizen said:

Lol fair. My experience has just been that no one in the area is playing them and the few times I've seen them they get bashed pretty badly. 

I've been trying to put decks together and struggling a bit. Aggressive decks feel really risky since if you get unlucky and lose a model early, it's super hard to recover. Defensive/Objective decks are a bit dull but mainly feel inconsistent compared to a similar deck for Khorne or Skeletons. I'm struggling to find the niche that Stormcast do better than other Warbands. 

I can see Your point. With Orruks around it is pretty common to include Upgrades/Ploys that let You reliably oneshot 4 HP fighters. Considering defence, Orruks are on par with Stormcast (Speed, Defence die, HP). But oneshotting fighters hits Stormcasts way harder than Orruks. There are only 3 of them, so losing one is tough. Plus Gurzag has 5 HP, so it is considerably harder to oneshot him. In addition to that Gurzag might be the strongest model in the game (fighting-wise).

Add to this faction specific objectives. The ones Stormcast can reliably score give just one glory, so they have to heavily rely on universal objectives. And again, Orruks would have the upperhand in Objective play (I'm speaking of Hold Objectives and anything related, like supremacy and so on), as they have an additional fighter. And Orruks don't even do that, as they have sick faction specific objectives!

 

So thats it, being vulnerably to 4 damage attacks and a clanky objectiveplay make then imo a weaker warband compared to Orruks. And I like to compare these to, as their statline is relatively similar. Sure, exept for Gurzag the Orruks don't hit as hard as SCE (inspired Gurzag hits the hardest btw). But they have an inbuilt workaround. Cards like Demonic Weapon and Shattered Terrain significantly improves their dmg output AND inspires them. One could argue, that they get a wound token afterall, but the fact that they can easily deal with it just underlines my statement.

 

TLDR: Orruks can be played like SCE and might be better at it. In addition they don't need to, as their unique playstyle is even better than that. Plus they are better at fighting.

I don't say picking SCEis an autolose, but they are in a tough spot right now. BTW, this is why I think SCE will have acess to the cards of the to be released SC warband.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 19/01/2018 at 7:30 PM, Requizen said:

Lol fair. My experience has just been that no one in the area is playing them and the few times I've seen them they get bashed pretty badly. 

I've been trying to put decks together and struggling a bit. Aggressive decks feel really risky since if you get unlucky and lose a model early, it's super hard to recover. Defensive/Objective decks are a bit dull but mainly feel inconsistent compared to a similar deck for Khorne or Skeletons. I'm struggling to find the niche that Stormcast do better than other Warbands. 

I think that the point with stormcast is not to be better in a specific aspect of the game (finding a niche) but to have more flexibility.

Sure, they are can be said as the tankiest (blessed by sigmar=+1 wound, few upgrades or ploys putting models on gards and of course, 2 dices in defense when inspirerd). But as the orruks have 4 models withe 4 wounds or + (defending with shields, imkillable upgrade ect...), and because 4 wounds models can be one shot; the tankiest aspect is not the main advantage.

Another obvious aspect: they hit hard, harder than orruks. Once inspired, Steelheart has a area attack (one of the best, the best?) and Obryn has cleave. With the upgrade giving cleave to Steelheart or to Obryn, the band is the only one with the S Guard to have access to 2 warriors with cleave.  Plus ploys to re attack in case of failure, to do +1 wounds, shattering terrain is still usable in a offensive way. That also mean that SC player don't need to put weapon upgrades in their deck.

But as i said, the point is not really to know who hit harder or who is the tankiest.

With hold objectives, sigmar bulkwalk, bloodless, consecrated area: the stormcast almost scores some glory round 1 without having to charge.  As their is 3 models in the band, the deployment can almost always be made so you can camp where you are  without risking to be charged, so you draw cards, objectives or ploys. Without Trust your Luck or Duel of Wits, you can have a card advantage.

Stormcasts doesn't need the right set up of objectives (meaning 3 of them on their territory, let's say 1-2-3 and shardecaller in the first hand...) to be optimist.

There is objective cards rewarding aggressive actions : Lightning Strikes,  Awe-Inspiring. Its are easy to scored, easier than "3 charges in a round" or the khorne's Awe inspiring like card and are scored  immediately. With luck, Sigmar bulkwall and Consecrated area can be scored in the same round.

As i was writing i think i would say the niche for the stormcast is scoring easely. As they won't be a charge range, are hard to kill and dangerous to charge, they disturb aggressive opponents. The only real issue for stormcasts would be against Hold Objectives decks with the right set up (see above).

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

With the release of the new warbands, here is my revised deck.

OBJECTIVES:

  • awe-inspiring
  • butchery
  • precise use of force
  • seize ground
  • crushing force
  • conquest
  • contained
  • denial
  • no remorse
  • unbroken wall
  • swift advance
  • lightning strikes

PLOYS:

  • sidestep
  • time trap
  • tireless assault
  • last chance
  • spoils of battle
  • righteous zeal
  • earthquake
  • distraction
  • healing potion
  • peal of thunder
  • illusory fighter
  • momentary madness

UPGRADES:

  • soul trap
  • shadeglass darts
  • flickering image
  • fatal riposte
  • vampiric weapon
  • heroic might
  • shadestep
  • cunning duelist
  • blessed armor
  • heroic stride
  • great strength
  • trickster's charm

 

I've built this deck with offense in mind eschewing most 'hold objective' type objectives in favor of 'kill objectives'.

I use vampiric weapon on either obryn or steelheart as those two will be my front line fighters.

cards like triskster's charm, shadeglass darts and flickering image are reserved for brightshield who i'll have in the backfield to clean up any rat infestations that pop up.

Worked quite well so far as i'm currently undefeated with this list.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

So what have people liked in the new expansions? I think Unbroken Wall fits Stormcast quite well as an Objective - maybe a bit bad on T3, but on 1 or 2 it's not unlikely that you're pushing forward as a single unit, and Precise Use of Force is fantastic since most fighters are 2 or 3 wounds, other than Orruks (and SCE can hit 4 once Upgrades come out).

As for Power Cards, Ready for Action is just as good as it is for every other Warband, though I don't think SCE decks get as much from the Ploys in these expansions. Awakened Weapon is quite good for an Upgrade, though, and Light Footed can deny pushes in order to keep a fighter from being knocked away (more of a big deal with Stormcast than other Warbands). 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Before the skaven/fyreslayer expansions stormcast were the best at defensive objective grabbing while their offense was slow and unreliable, and that seemed to pigeonhole them into playing the safe objective plan.

Post-expansion, Fyreslayers seem to be strictly better at playing objectives since they have a plethora of healing and pushing cards, and they can lose a model but still control 3 objectives. When they need to riposte they have two of the best fighters in the game and two decent fighters.

The new cards seem to alleviate the issues that stormcast had with more +move upgrades, ploys/upgrades to reroll hits, more ways to immediately mitigate damage, and a way to immediately upgrade without spending glory (incredible for aggressive playstyles that won't get easy glory from objectives). Cards like Heroslayer threaten to (unreliably) kill any model in the Stormcast warband, but new defensive tools should turn those plays into very unlikely scenarios.

I'll definitely be testing aggressive Stormcast in the next few weeks. Not sure where to start with objectives, though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, PJetski said:

Before the skaven/fyreslayer expansions stormcast were the best at defensive objective grabbing while their offense was slow and unreliable, and that seemed to pigeonhole them into playing the safe objective plan.

I don't think that's necessarily true.  Both LVO and Waaaghpaca were won by offensive stormcast decks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, CodFather said:

I don't think that's necessarily true.  Both LVO and Waaaghpaca were won by offensive stormcast decks.

This.

Stormcast neither have the speed nor the bodies to effectively play hold objectives.

Concecrated Area and Sigmar's Bulwark are great turn 1 objectives, when You don't want to engage outright. SCE need careful positioning, so those two objectives give You early glory while doing so. They, by no means, dictate a passive objective grabbing playstyle.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So what would you say is a must have for SCE, in an aggressiv deck?  Ready for action seems really interesting, or fuelled by fury?

What about trap for a surprise +1 damage and potentially one shotting gurzag of similar?

Solid stance for defense on a upgraded severin? Vampiric weapon ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

56 minutes ago, Anamnesis said:

So what would you say is a must have for SCE, in an aggressiv deck?  Ready for action seems really interesting, or fuelled by fury?

What about trap for a surprise +1 damage and potentially one shotting gurzag of similar?

Solid stance for defense on a upgraded severin? Vampiric weapon ?


Every free attack card you can get.  Ready for Action, Time Trap, Mighty Swing, Tireless Assault.  Damage cards like righteous zeal and Trap.  Push cards are always good, and upgrades that make you more survivable like soul trap, blessed by Sigmar, great fortitude and upgrades that make you hit more reliable like awakened weapon, helpful whispers and Heroic Might.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Anamnesis said:

So what would you say is a must have for SCE, in an aggressiv deck? 

Luck. You really need luck.

I've played a few games with Stormcast being used agressively (around 7) and I've found their biggest issue is getting the right cards or right dice roll. But I do suspect I had a bit of bad luck as I struggled to get average dice rolls when I used them. 

7 hours ago, Hesa_First said:

Stormcast neither have the speed nor the bodies to effectively play hold objectives.

I think you can do Objective holding based Stormcast but you really need to play defensively with them. So this means keeping them as far as way from your opponent as possible and camping on objectives. Downside with this is you can never score big. I have no idea how they would work with Skaven in the mix now.

Personally I think a balanced deck is the way as if you get a board layout that doesn't favour you, it's not the end of the universe

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Gaz Taylor said:

Luck. You really need luck.

I've played a few games with Stormcast being used agressively (around 7) and I've found their biggest issue is getting the right cards or right dice roll. But I do suspect I had a bit of bad luck as I struggled to get average dice rolls when I used them. 

This has been my experience as well.

Stormcast can do very well if the dice go their way and they get the right draws. I personally don't like a playstyle that is so heavily reliant on RNG. The new cards seem to alleviate their reliance on dice/draw by smoothing out the distribution curves.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
On 10/10/2017 at 5:31 AM, Mr. White said:

On the modelling end of the conversation....I wish Steelheart came with a helmet to wear. We like all our stormcasts to be helmeted. Keeps the mystique of them being energy beings of Azyr. Sure, I can cut the head and stick a helmet on, but cutting out the helmet under his arm may prove difficult.

 

Also, Steelheart's name reminds me to much of this fella ;)

StrongheartMOSC1a.jpg

Helmeted version from a reddit post.

https://redd.it/7fbe4r

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
  • 3 weeks later...
  • 3 months later...

So with the release of quick a few card since the start, are people still playing steelheart?

Quick love my aggro stormcast but I kinda feel the new warband play this game better. what are people thoughts on the subject?

Cheers

Anamnesis

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have only played Steelheart Champions since day one.   Recently I have entered 5 tournaments with them.  My standings are 1st (2) 2nd (2) 4th(1).  I even took a piece of glass home for one of those tournaments.  I play Turtlecast (non relics)  and I find it works really well for me and I think plays to their strength.  Arggocast can still be a thing but I feel that Mangore does it so much better. 

Stormcast are still great in my opinion and I think we will continue to be good for some time. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've only just started using SCE (two games) but so far I've enjoyed using them.

I'll be honest, I stayed away from using them before due to them only having three models. However, after two games they seem a pretty flexible warband to me.

They have great stats and great objectives.

I've built my deck as a balanced one, with a mix between offensive, defensive and objectives. Seemed to work pretty well in my first two games.

One objective that I put in it is supremacy. I ummed and ahhed about it, but it actually turned out useful in both games. Obviously if you lose a guy it's stuffed, but that's the same with the eternals objective. Still undecided which is better. More play testing should help. The thing about supremacy is you can score it any round and people maybe don't expect it as much with SCE.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


×
×
  • Create New...