Let's Chat: Spiderfang

[Sheriff]

Nope, sorry dude. Great models and fun to play though. Might get a battletome one day but would assume not. 

[Malakree]

26 minutes ago, Oldmanlee said:

Hi guys quick question is a spidefang army competitive at torney level I'm thinking of collecting them as I love the models 

Depends what you mean by "tourney" level.

If you mean absolute top tier, then no. The only destruction army which is even close to T1 atm is kunnin' Rukk and even then it's at the bottom end.

if you mean can it do well at local and middling tournaments, yes if you get lucky with some good matchups. To be fair though you probably just want to run GA:Destruction instead. Run Moonclan Grots as Battleline then run Spiderfang as part of the army rather than the whole army.

Quote

Allegiance: Stoneklaw's Gutstompas

Leaders
Grot Big Boss On Gigantic Spider (100)
- General
Arachnarok Spider With Grot Shaman (280)
Arachnarok Spider With Grot Shaman (280)
Moonclan Grot Shaman (80)
Gitmob Grot Shaman (80)

Battleline
10 x Grot Spider Riders (200)
- Spiderfang Battleline
60 x Moonclan Grots (360)
- Pokin Spears & Moon Shields 
20 x Moonclan Grots (130)
- Pokin Spears & Moon Shields 
60 x Gitmob Grots (270)
- Bows & Slashas 

War Machines
Grot Rock Lobber (100)
Grot Rock Lobber (100)

Total: 1980 / 2000
Allies: 0 / 400
Wounds: 220

Maybe something like that?

Gives you a huge unit of Moonclan Grots to form a front line, you still get your Spiderfang force with double Arachnarok, plus a Moonclan shaman for his Curse of Da Bad Moon, and the 60 Gitmob + Gitmob Shaman is a personal favourite of mine, sneaky stabbin really makes them do work with their bows. Finally a pair of Rock Lobbers to give you the huge threat range.

As I said, and @Sheriff implied, you aren't going to win any major high profile tournaments with it. It will probably be able to compete with T2/3 lists however. Stoneklaws Gustompa's, if firestorm allegiances are allowed, is also a huge boon for a Grot orientated army, gives you a bit of extra potential. 

If you want to use it in a tournament you will require the firestorm book however.

[Oldmanlee]

Thanks for the info guys yeah I did not mean top tier (my bad ) just would like to take spider fangs to a torney and not get rolled in all my games lol 

[Malakree]

19 minutes ago, Oldmanlee said:

Thanks for the info guys yeah I did not mean top tier (my bad ) just would like to take spider fangs to a torney and not get rolled in all my games lol 

It depends on how lucky you get and how you pilot it. Against an opponent of equal skill running Vanguard Wing, Tzeentch, kharadron overlords, fyreslayers or something like that you will lose unless you get really lucky. Against the T2 lists like Ironjawz or some of the less retarded lists of stormcast you can win with some luck. 

Imo, which is VERY BAD AND QUESTIONABLE, pure Spiderfang probably falls in the bottom 1/3rd of armies. It's got a few to many key weaknesses which the top armies can exploit. On the other hand a Gutstompas grot list running a Spiderfang core is probably somewhere in the middle 1/3rd depending on the exact list, the additions of both a solid Line unit (Grots or Orruks), and Gitmob Artillery especially, is going to make a huge difference in what you can do. 

Quote

Stoneklaw's Gutstompas
10/40 x Orruks (90/320)
10/30 x Savage Orruks (120/300)
20/60 x Gitmob Grots (100/270)
20/60 x Moonclan Grots (130/360)

Grand Alliance: Destruction
3/12 x Ogors (120/400)

In My Dreams
3 x Fimir Warriors (120)
- Battleline (Fimir Dirach Balefield General)

This is all the battleline available to you if you were to go for a mixed army rather than a pure spiderfang. You can fill the required 3 for anywhere between 270 and 1200 points, the former gives you 10x10x10 Greenskinz Orruks while the latter puts a mighty 12x12x12 Gutbuster Ogors on the board, so there is some real flexibility in terms of choice. On the cheap end of the spectrum I personally would favour 20 Grots with bows, while a single block of 20 Ogors is going to be a huge tarpit, especially if you can get mystic shield on them and give them the Iron Fists.

Ultimately all of them bring more to the table than an expensive unit of 5 spider riders which you won't want to be buffing anyway, plus this removes the restriction of only 400 points of allies. The single most expensive core spiderfang block is 1200 points

Quote

Allegiance: Stoneklaw's Gutstompas

Leaders
Grot Big Boss On Gigantic Spider (100)
- General
Arachnarok Spider With Grot Shaman (280)
Arachnarok Spider With Grot Shaman (280)

Battleline
30 x Grot Spider Riders (540)
- Spiderfang Battleline

Total: 1200 / 2000
Wounds: 94

Which gives you basically everything you could want, so I think @Sheriff was probably right when he started mixing moonclan and spiderfang. 

[Sheriff]

@Malakree totally agree with all this, as it exactly what I'm doing 

I've gone with fanatics over rock lobbas but do intend to experiment with the points wiggle-room of 400pts or so. 

And gone with multiple small spider rider units as it gives more options in battle, and because the bigger blob never seems to get many spiders in combat, therefore your spider buffs are more effective on an arachnarok instead. 

The stoneclaw allegiance abilities are great but it seems tournament organisers are retarded and decide they are illegal because campaign book. 

Some sorts of armies just wreck through mixed grots though. Anything that exploits low bravery, things that blend hordes into mush, anything that can snipe your general. 

[TeddyMadeMeDoIt]

Hey guys

Just a quick question about Battle brew and the +1 to hit... If I were to take that on a Shaman on Arachnarok Spider does the spiders attack also get +1 to hit?

 

Cheers

[someone2040]

1 hour ago, TeddyMadeMeDoIt said:

Hey guys

Just a quick question about Battle brew and the +1 to hit... If I were to take that on a Shaman on Arachnarok Spider does the spiders attack also get +1 to hit?

 

Cheers

Mounts aren't effected by artefacts unless specifically stated. So no, Battle Brew won't effect your Spider.

[PlasticCraic]

FWIW a friend of mine recently took his spiders to CanCon and won a couple of games (against Gnarlroot and Stormcast).  Once he'd lost his first couple of games he was playing against people with softer armies, or people with T2 armies who didn't know how to use them.  

His list had 3 or 4 Arachnaroks and at least 3 Rock Lobbas as allies.  He put Hammerblade on one of his A-Roks as crowd control.  As mentioned above the benefit of the big 'uns is that you are activating the whole thing at once.  I think he ran MSU spiders for objectives, as covered above you won't get many into combat from a big block and Battleshock is crippling for this army.  Also the discount isn't even that great - if the discount kicked in at unit size 15 or 20, or was 20 points per unit, it might be more relevant.  

I'd say pure Spiderfang is definitely a list you could lose all 5 games with, but if you practice you will be competitive in some of your games at even a large tournament.  Rock Lobbas as allies really are key.

[Lanoss]

I am so keen to get started with Spider Riders! But I’m worried that it might be years before a battletome or phased out...

whats everyone think? Worth the investment? 

Think we may see something this year?

[Malakree]

9 hours ago, Lanoss said:

I am so keen to get started with Spider Riders! But I’m worried that it might be years before a battletome or phased out...

whats everyone think? Worth the investment? 

Think we may see something this year?

I think we will get a combined destruction battletome for the Orruks and Grots sometime this year. That's my feeling post Legions of Nagash.

[kenshin620]

21 hours ago, Malakree said:

I think we will get a combined destruction battletome for the Orruks and Grots sometime this year. That's my feeling post Legions of Nagash.

Yea a combined book would be great, especially as a throwback to the old O&G books.

[TeddyMadeMeDoIt]

Thanks @someone2040 

Another simple one then, the Warscroll for our Spider Riders say some models in the unit can be armed with bows. Is there a limit on that? If I have a unit of 20 how many are we to arm with bows?

Cheers guys

[someone2040]

1 hour ago, TeddyMadeMeDoIt said:

Thanks @someone2040 

Another simple one then, the Warscroll for our Spider Riders say some models in the unit can be armed with bows. Is there a limit on that? If I have a unit of 20 how many are we to arm with bows?

Cheers guys

In this case, I think it's just restricted by how many bows you get in the kit to put on the models.

I know they have FAQed Moonclan Grot netters, but I think that's mainly to prevent Netter abuse (As it's the best weapon option in the kit by far).

[Skabnoze]

While I would not at all be surprised to see the armies carried over from Warhammer at the start of Age of Sigmar get phased out of the game at some point (or turned into something else entirely), I am interested in checking out what fluff there is for these forces in Age of Sigmar.  Now that I am starting to retool my old collection to fit into this new game, I am interested in reading up what these various sub-factions are doing and it may give me some fun ideas for conversions.

I have all of the Greenskin battle-tomes, but not the generic grand alliance one.  Where do I find the fluff for Spiderfang specifically (also Moonclan)?

[sal4m4nd3r]

I am going to push back on the "mount" thing for a bit. Lets look at the warscroll.

First off, the warscroll is the ARACHNAROK SPIDER. Not the Grot Shamen on Arachnarok spider. So the warscroll is the spider itself.  Just because the shamen gives him the hero keyword and thus able to take artifacts doesnt mean the warscroll of the unit changes roles! Khorne Lord on Juggernaught. KL is the hero and the Jugg is the mount. Same logic would apply here.. just with the gobbo being along for the ride while the actual unit is the Arachnarok.  

 

 

DESCRIPTION An Arachnarok Spider is a single model. It attacks its prey with venomous Monstrous Fangs and its massive Chitinous Legs.

SPIDERFANG GROTS Many Arachnarok Spiders carry a howdah of Spiderfang Grots into battle, who attack those below with Spider-bows and Crooked Spears. These howdahs can also mount either a Flinger – a crude web-slinging catapult – or a Catchweb Spidershrine – a magical artefact tended to by a Spiderfang Grot Shaman.

 

 

[Malakree]

2 hours ago, sal4m4nd3r said:

I am going to push back on the "mount" thing for a bit. Lets look at the warscroll.

First off, the warscroll is the ARACHNAROK SPIDER. Not the Grot Shamen on Arachnarok spider. So the warscroll is the spider itself.  Just because the shamen gives him the hero keyword and thus able to take artifacts doesnt mean the warscroll of the unit changes roles! Khorne Lord on Juggernaught. KL is the hero and the Jugg is the mount. Same logic would apply here.. just with the gobbo being along for the ride while the actual unit is the Arachnarok.  

 

 

DESCRIPTION An Arachnarok Spider is a single model. It attacks its prey with venomous Monstrous Fangs and its massive Chitinous Legs.

SPIDERFANG GROTS Many Arachnarok Spiders carry a howdah of Spiderfang Grots into battle, who attack those below with Spider-bows and Crooked Spears. These howdahs can also mount either a Flinger – a crude web-slinging catapult – or a Catchweb Spidershrine – a magical artefact tended to by a Spiderfang Grot Shaman.

The discussion  is done, the change was specifically targeted at destruction monsters (all of them) with battlebrew. 

To use your own argument against you, the Warscroll is the spider but the SPIDER cannot take magical artefacts. Only if the Grot Shaman is added on top can the GROT SHAMAN then take an artefact. Your argument would require the spider to be able to take artefacts or command traits without the Grot Shaman which it can't. 

Honestly Spiderfang need a mount trait table the same as Stormcast have right now, that's the solution to all this.

[FatherTurin]

On 4/25/2018 at 6:45 PM, Malakree said:

Honestly Spiderfang need a mount trait table the same as Stormcast have right now, that's the solution to all this.

“Not before we do.”

- every Beastclaw player ever

[Fisher KIng]

Hi Guys,
I’ve never played AOS and the last time I played WHFB was 2nd/3rd ed? However I am getting very keen to try AOS out and I feel Spiderfang is the way to go for me. I love the models and I’m looking forward to painting some up. My question for you guys is about allies. I see that other grot flavours seem to be the way to go tactically but I’m thinking more from a modelling point of view. If I took a Stonehorn or Thundertusk but modelled it as Alarielle’s Beetle Rosen by some grots or Orruk warboss on wyvern modelled as a grot on a plague drone with a Arachnarok’s head painted a as wasp would you allow it?

[TeddyMadeMeDoIt]

Had a look around and I know the ar not in the generals handbook so forgive me if I'm asking an obvious question, do Spiderfang have their own allegiance ability or do they just use the general Destruction one?

[Intrinsic]

@TeddyMadeMeDoIt General Destruction currently.  Hopefully will change in a few weeks. 

@Fisher KIng If you put obvious work into something and it uses the same base as the model it's substituting for, no problems. 

[Skabnoze]

So what are everyone’s thoughts about Spiderfang given the game changes that we know about?

The first thing that jumps out to me is the changes to command abilities makes the Warboss on giant spider interesting.  Taking more than one is now useful for redundancy and getting a turn with multiple buffed spider venom units.  In addition, the shaman on the Arachnarok is now a source for the general command abilities like Inspiring Presence - which makes it easier to spread out a bit if needed.

[bsharitt]

Spiderfang Grots making an appearance in the lastest Malign Portents story. This is clearly a sign that GW is cancelling all that Nighthaunt and Stormcast nonsense for AoS 2 and June will see a new Spiderfang battletome and the new starter box will be Spiderfang vs More Spiderfang.

[Sheriff]

On 5/27/2018 at 5:05 PM, Skabnoze said:

So what are everyone’s thoughts about Spiderfang given the game changes that we know about?

The first thing that jumps out to me is the changes to command abilities makes the Warboss on giant spider interesting.  Taking more than one is now useful for redundancy and getting a turn with multiple buffed spider venom units.  In addition, the shaman on the Arachnarok is now a source for the general command abilities like Inspiring Presence - which makes it easier to spread out a bit if needed.

I've played about with the idea of a gordrakk + spiderfang list for the new command ability combo, but its still too squishy. 

[novakai]

1 hour ago, bsharitt said:

Spiderfang Grots making an appearance in the lastest Malign Portents story. This is clearly a sign that GW is cancelling all that Nighthaunt and Stormcast nonsense for AoS 2 and June will see a new Spiderfang battletome and the new starter box will be Spiderfang vs More Spiderfang.

But-but Freeguild, Slaanesh and Skaven where also in those story, GW is clearly bias on their releases because Spiderfang grots is their secret golden boys for AoS.

Our lord and Savior Gorkamorka is going to keep opening those Spiderfang grot chambers for more spiderfang releases.

[SimonL]

Some great info here. My daughter has decided she wants in on the dice rolling shenanigans. She had a look at the armies and decided on Spiderfang.

She currently (not all built yet) has a Grot boss on gigantic spider, 3 Arachnarok's and 50 Spider riders.

 

She also has a Aleguzzlar Gargant she wants to use. I know you can ally a Gargant but is it worth it? or as previous members have stated would I be better off getting some spear chukkas or just run pure Spiderfang.  

 

This is for playing at home against me or some of my mates. So not Tourney stuff. Just for fun. (and when she gets bored they will be mine )