FEC artefacts and traits

[Dracothjay]

So I've been playing FEC religiously now for a while, and with the new GHB2017 out, I'm having a blast.

however, I'm always taking completely delusional for my general and blood river chalice on either my general or another hero. 

So, I'm hoping to open a discussion here as to who uses different FEC allegiance artefacts/traits and why. I'm wanting to broaden my knowledge and here people's own choices and experiences with the new abilities!

[James Ramsay]

-2 bravery with terrorgheists is pretty nice.

[Malakithe]

13 hours ago, Dracothjay said:

So I've been playing FEC religiously now for a while, and with the new GHB2017 out, I'm having a blast.

however, I'm always taking completely delusional for my general and blood river chalice on either my general or another hero. 

So, I'm hoping to open a discussion here as to who uses different FEC allegiance artefacts/traits and why. I'm wanting to broaden my knowledge and here people's own choices and experiences with the new abilities!

It looks like Completely Delusional is the best allowing you to react to the situation.

Yep The Grim Garland on a AGKoTG seems to be a common thing.

Then for Ghoul Patrol users The Flayed Pennant allows for some good charges

[Glaurung]

I agree, the others are sort of lackluster...
Really, a bone that gives you 3" range on a weapon? Can it be godd on anything?
The Heart would be good if it affected the terrorgheist, but it doesn't...

[Dracothjay]

A question on feeding frenzy. It said "a result in any enemy units being slain", does this mean the WHOLE unit has to be eliminated in order to be eligible for the 6+ roll or just A model from an enemy unit? I watched a batrep and he was rolling for feeding frenzy after killing just 1 model from the unit. I think he was wrong, but just clarifying.

[Glaurung]

A unit is made by all of its models, so I guess you are right, he's cheating (involuntary)

[Dracothjay]

And I take it all units can only do feeding frenzy once per game yea?

[Glaurung]

I don't think so... I don't remember how it's written, but the way I intended it was  that every rime a unit was destroyed I could pile in again, even with a unit that had already done it previously.

 

what's your go to delusion?

I'm thinking rerolling 1s for saves if I go second or the one that makes rerolling 1s for charges or run moves.

[Dracothjay]

I always choose  defenders of the realm (reroll save rolls of 1) if I'm still within my half of the board as I'm advancing. The turn I charge I would usually switch to crusading army (reroll 1's for runs and charges). My following turn if there isn't any monsters I'll switch back to defenders of the realm if more than half of my army is still on my side. 

The other delusions are ways too situational and lets face, our heros like GK on foot  haunter courtier should not be fighting enemy heros as we hit like a wet fish. I'd maybe switch to rerolling 1's to hit and wound against heros if my varghulf or crypt infernal was targeting enemy heros, but again, that's situational.

defenders of the realm has helped me so much, especially for my horrors. 

[Waizer]

When I'm using a general that isn't a GK I tend to like using the dark wizardry command trait. Being able to have the black hunger spell on something like an infernal courtier in a deadwatch list and casting it on a 4+ is pretty tasty. In that list it could even be used twice per successful casting if you target some flayers that are locked in combat already. Only problem is it does paint a rather large target on the infernal courtier's back since it's now the general, a source of model recovery and able to cast spells (including the black hunger).

In terms of artefacts I've only really found a use for 3. The blood river chalice, the flayed pennant and the grim garland are the only ones I use

[nuttyknatty]

8 hours ago, Waizer said:

Being able to have the black hunger spell on something like an infernal courtier in a deadwatch list and casting it on a 4+

Interesting. I always assumed that the +1 to cast was only if you were already a wizard?

But I can see how it could be interpreted both ways.

[Sophronia]

The 3" range bone might be good on a Crypt Ghast Courtier.  He could stand behind 2" of friendly Crypt Ghouls so he can give out the Trophy Hunter buff without fearing reprisal.  That said, it's not a great artefact.

[Glaurung]

1 hour ago, Sophronia said:

The 3" range bone might be good on a Crypt Ghast Courtier.  He could stand behind 2" of friendly Crypt Ghouls so he can give out the Trophy Hunter buff without fearing reprisal.  That said, it's not a great artefact.

That's an interesting idea, I may try it sometimes 

[Waizer]

5 hours ago, The Nameless One said:

Interesting. I always assumed that the +1 to cast was only if you were already a wizard?

But I can see how it could be interpreted both ways.

Oh I could be fully wrong there with my interpretation. Either way though  5+ is still going off most of the time

[WoollyMammoth]

With death getting kicked while its down repeated since the launch of AoS, I was really looking forward to some exciting stuff in the new GH. Unfortunately, the new stuff does not feel very "fleshed" out. 

The horde discount thing is great for death, typically being a horde army.  With FEC, you get a 40 pt discount  for taking a horde, which you are likely to want to take anyway. Unfortunately, AGKoZD went up 40 points. Since you are really going to want that re-roll wound bubble, it about evens out. If you are taking 120 ghouls, you'll have enough points to throw in an extra Haunter Courtier .. not really enough to feel like a big change in your lists. Then you factor in the battalion point increases and the fact is your lists are likely to be smaller than before even though you are a horde army that is supposed to be cheaper now. 

It also worth noting while many armies got their best units turned to battleline within their allegiance,  FEC still requires an arbitrary extra requirement that an infernal/haunter courtier be the general for Flayer/Horrors as battleline. Being that the theme of FEC is an army led by, and always under the influence of a Ghoul King ... forcing you to not make the Ghoul King as your general is .. well its just silly.

As for allies .... FEC has been taking 'allies' since the start of AoS. Essentially they have put restrictions on what was unrestricted before. There is a 10 point discount on Necromancers which is not anything to pop a champagne bottle over. One of the most notable allies is the Vampire Lord on Abyssal Terror, which is not even available anymore, so this is actually a major nerf.

As a side note, the main synergy you need in a FEC list is the AGKoZD spell, and since all the command abilities are total ****** this means FEC is in great position to take an ally general. My favorite would be Neferata (especially since the Command Traits are pretty disappointing as well, so there is almost no loss for having a named general). Not really exciting that FEC is so bland that you might want to ally in a new general, but its worth mentioning.

As for allegiance, changing the ability to get a 5++ within 10" of your general to a 6++ within 6" of heroes is a massive nerf for FEC, since most of the saves are poor, that 5++ was huge for FEC. With a 6++ essentially twice as many ghouls die, leading to bigger battleshock tests and the army falling apart more than twice as quickly. Before you could also use the AGKoT spell to double down with two 5+ saves which was amazing and awesome protection from insane horde killers. Well this is gone now while the horde killers are likely to be much more prevalent.

To be honest I do like the loss of the 5++, since that was really stealing the identity of Nurgle, and I saw this coming. But I was hoping for something really cool in its place. I was happy to see that there is still a 6++ but its not going to be enough to keep your armies from falling apart like the 5++ did.

Next we have the Feeding Frenzy, which is rarely going to come into play, let alone go off on a 6. It absolutely should be that if you kill enemy models, not units - and I am praying they FAQ this. An alternate option would be to have it go off on a 4+, given that setting up a situation where you are in combat with two units and completely wipe one of them out with attacks alone is difficult to set up (units more often die from battleshock). I would be ecstatic with even a 5+ to go off, but a 6+ is a complete nothingbuger that will happen so rarely that FEC players are likely to forget to roll for it.

Next we have dillusions. The ability to re-roll run and charge rolls of 1 is pretty great and is what I will be taking every time. The rest are hard to get excited about. Most of them are to re-roll hit rolls of 1 which you are already doing for ghouls and horrors if you are playing FEC correctly. I guess that if you are utilizing a lot of Horrors in cover with Mystic Shield, Defenders of the Realm would be useful but that is personally not how I play. In most cases re-rolling saves of 1 is not really great in an army of 5+/6+ saves. Overall they just don't seem very well thought out and have such a small effect in most circumstances.  Its nice to still be re-rolling 1s if you don't have a Ghoul King (usually because hes dead) but overall any +1 to hit would have been amazing here and is noticeably absent.

The command traits are pretty sad. Again, would have been amazing to have a +1 to hit thing in here somewhere. Typically you are taking a AGKoZD as the general and, assuming you get the spell off, Bringer of Death is useless. Frenzied Flesh eater is so bad it makes me wonder if they truly did write the Feeding Frenzy rule incorrectly. Majestic Horror is actually pretty cool for holding two Haunter Courtiers off the board then summoning them via AGKoZD; this way you can have them when you need them, where you need them and you don't have to worry about them getting shot off the board before then (which is common). Savage BR is also very lame. Dark Wizardry is nice to make sure you get off your spell but its nothing impressive. Completely Delusional would only be useful in the event that you have a hero phase knowing that your general is about to die so that you can pick Grant Tournament and secure your 1 rerolls even after your GK has died .. which is pretty situational IMO. 

The artefacts are not bad. S Broach is pretty bland but might be nice against a powerful magic army like Tzeetch. Grim Garland is pretty great for battleshock and the aforementioned Tgheist. @Sophronia for the great idea for the Keening Bone .. if you put the courtier 2" back from the front of your ghoul line, hes in combat when they get charged even though hes 2" back, and getting the ability is awesome, though pretty much any shooting unit in the game can murder your courtier without a lot of trouble so this is a risky waste of an artefact. Flayed Pennant is my personal favorite, awesome for Ghoul Patrol ( @Malakithe for pointing that out). Its not to hard to set up a AGKoZD so he will be within 6" of their ambush after he moves, especially with conga lines. The Chalice is obviously very good, I think they upped the price of the dragon knowing that hes going to have this almost every time.  Gargan Feast is pretty boring since the AGKoZD does this to himself and everyone around him every turn he gets his spell off anyway.

I'm not saying that FEC is a bad army or an army that is not fun, but the new stuff in the GH is just not very exciting. Given the state of disrepair that death has been in for 3 years, you would think they would throw us a bone and have some awesome power combos like you see with pretty much everything else. Honestly FEC might be the least impressive allegiance in the new book. I really hope the FAQ feeding frenzy but knowing the history of the FAQ writers we are more likely to see odd nerfs coming our way than any kind of boost. The only thing we can hope for is FAQs, this is may be the final thing the FEC army is getting for a very long time, if not forever. 

[Thanatos Ares]

Question regarding Dark Wizardry:  the model knows the same spell as a Ghoul King, does this mean the Ghoul King on foot only? Or could you choose the GKoT/GKoZD spells instead?

[TheWilddog]

39 minutes ago, Thanatos Ares said:

Question regarding Dark Wizardry:  the model knows the same spell as a Ghoul King, does this mean the Ghoul King on foot only? Or could you choose the GKoT/GKoZD spells instead?

I think the ruling per the FAQ would be, when they use the non-bold text they are referring to a specific unit.  Here they did not use the bold keyword text, so its only the AGK on foot as that is the name of the specific unit.  If it had been Abhorrent Ghoul King  then you could have chosen among the others.

[Waizer]

12 hours ago, WoollyMammoth said:

With death getting kicked while its down repeated since the launch of AoS, I was really looking forward to some exciting stuff in the new GH. Unfortunately, the new stuff does not feel very "fleshed" out. 

<great unit/command trait/artefact analysis in here>

I'm not saying that FEC is a bad army or an army that is not fun, but the new stuff in the GH is just not very exciting. Given the state of disrepair that death has been in for 3 years, you would think they would throw us a bone and have some awesome power combos like you see with pretty much everything else. Honestly FEC might be the least impressive allegiance in the new book. I really hope the FAQ feeding frenzy but knowing the history of the FAQ writers we are more likely to see odd nerfs coming our way than any kind of boost. The only thing we can hope for is FAQs, this is may be the final thing the FEC army is getting for a very long time, if not forever. 

Agree with what has been said in the most part. Definitely feel the points reduction in some area's are more than balanced out by the increases elsewhere for an overall net loss. Would be nice to get a good new death army book and even see some other factions getting a book like the FEC had before.

[Bademeister]

On 15.9.2017 at 6:24 PM, James Ramsay said:

-2 bravery with terrorgheists is pretty nice.

its absoloutly awesome on an GKoTG with a Deadwatch list. I've done 21 Mortal Wounds in 1 Shooting phase. 1 Treelord and a bunch of Dryads died that way. The rest of the Dryads fleed. That was a really good feeling