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matched play battleplans with imbalance


EMMachine

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Hi guys,

I get the feeling that the GH17 Battleplans are not really balanced for all armies.

We already had the case with "scorched Earth", where fast armys with aditional movement are in the lead.

But how about the Battleplans "Total Conquest" and "Battle for the Pass"

Both have the following victory condition:

Quote

A player controls an objective if, at the end of any turn, they have a unit of 20 or more models from their army within 6" of the objective and the enemy does not, or, failing that, if they have more models from their army within 6" of the objective than there are enemy models within 6". ...

So you need a unit with 20 models within 6" of the marker while the opponent has no unit with 20 models within. If he has a unit himself. The player with more models in range get controll.

So we have 2 missions where elite armies are pretty much screwed because they use rarely 20 models in a unit or don't even have a unit that are 20 models or bigger.

What do you think?

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If your army is built of elite units, you should be capable of reducing your opponent's units such that they have fewer than 20 models. It requires different gameplay, potentially (using your elites to mow down their hordes rather than taking out their monsters, for instance) but it should be generally still very winnable. 

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The problem is, that in both ways the marker is controlled by the player that captured it even if it leaves it. What means. If he captures 1 marker and you don't have a unit with 20 models or more you autolose the game in first turn like in scorched Earth when all your markers got razed in first round (and in case of Stormcasts the only unit that can get more than 20 Models are Liberators).

You want to play a vanguard chamber? You can't win because Vanguard Hunters can only get 15 models. You want to play Beastclaw Raiders, you don't even need to set up if the opponent has only one unit with 20 models. Each Matched Play Battleplan should be winnable ba every army, not excluding a quarter or more of them.

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@EMMachine, here are some potential scoring scenarios:

1. My entire unit of 5 models is within range of the objective. Your unit of 19 models has 3 within range of the objective. I control the objective.

2. My entire unit of 5 models is within range of the objective. Your unit of 20 models has 3 within range of the objective. You control the objective.

3. Your unit of 20 models has one model within range of the objective (uncontested). You control the objective.
3a. Next battle round you go first, and move your unit away. You still control the objective.
3b. In the bottom half of the battle round, I move a one-model unit in range of the vacated objective. I now control the objective.
 

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But the rule says, you get control if your unit has 20 or more models and this unit is within 6". This sentence tells us that a unit with 19 or less models is unable to capture an objective.

It's the main condition. In other cases the rule should be.

Quote

A player controls an objective if, at the end of any turn, they have a unit from their army within 6" of the objective and the enemy does not, or, failing that, if they have more models from their army within 6" of the objective than there are enemy models within 6". A unit of 20 or more models can control even if other units with less models are in range...

In such a case the condition would be that a unit has to be in 6" and there would be a subcondition for units with 20 models.

But the unitsize is actually the maincondition that you can control a marker.

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@EMMachine I think your missing the "or" there.

"they have a unit of 20 or more models from their army within 6" of the objective and the enemy does not"

or, failing that

"they have more models from their army within 6" of the objective than there are enemy models within 6" of it".

So a unit of 19 models absolutely can capture an objective, provided that the enemy doesn't have a unit of 20 or more models within 6" of it, and there are more models from the unit of 19 than there are enemy models.

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But what logic does it follow when you can't control the objective when you don't have 20 models and there is no enemy there but you can control it if there are enemy models. o.O

Quote

A player controls an objective if, at the end of any turn, they have a unit of 20 or more models from their army within 6" of the objective and the enemy does not ...

I see the "or, failing that" as the point that the enemy has also 20 or more models. So when you use it for a programming language

if( unitsize >=20 && unitrange <6 && (enemyunitsize<20 || enemyunitsize>20 && modelsInRange > enemymodels in Range )

    controlObjective()

 

saying that unitsize of 20 only counts when no enemy is there screws up the entire logic of controlling a objective.

 

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Uh…

if ( (unitSize >= 20 && unitRange < 6 && ! (enemyUnitSize >= 20 && enemyUnitRange < 6))
    ||
    ( ! (enemyUnitSize >= 20 && enemyUnitRange < 6 && ! (unitSize >= 20 && unitRange < 6))
      && (modelsInRange > enemyModelsInRange))
  ) {
  controlObjective();
}

Or in English:

If I have a unit of 20+ within 6" and you don't, I gain control.

If you have a unit of 20+ within 6" and I don't, you gain control.

If we both have a unit of 20+ within 6" or neither of us has a unit of 20+ within 6", whoever has the most models within 6" gains controls (if we both have the same number, control remains unchanged).

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