Neck-Romantic Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Hmm. If FT is army wide I would be shocked at how powerful it would be on top of the abilities certain units have as their 'gimmick' And if the warscrolls are temporary until the book drops, well that just seems silly given how many other units were teased and the cover shown already. I'm guessing the book and the rest of the line are being held back to push sales of the boxed set Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choocheelo Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 but did they not say that the NH book would be released day in day than AOS2.0 release? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ahn-ket Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 2 minutes ago, choocheelo said: but did they not say that the NH book would be released day in day than AOS2.0 release? The nighthaunt bt would come later maybe July or August Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choocheelo Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 5 minutes ago, Ahn-ket said: The nighthaunt bt would come later maybe July or August nope... June 2018.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ahn-ket Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 I assume a pre-order on 30th and come out in July first or second weekend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 The banshees have nice offence with the -2 rend, but 20 points per wound with only a 4+ ethereal and deathless minions to protect them is awful defensively. A stiff breeze will see them off the field, with an unacceptable portion of your points going with them. That said, they are summonable, so gravesite deployment and endless legions could do the trick to get them into combat, and I'm sure nighthaunt will have alternate deployment methods as well. I'm pretty skeptical, though. Even more so of the glaivewraiths & grimghasts. Neither look like sufficient improvements over just more chainrasps to be worth bothering with, and certainly don't look to contend with hosts or hexes as semi-elites. Formations and allegiance rules could still save them, though, so I'm not writing them off completely just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honk Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 On 6/14/2018 at 7:58 PM, Sception said: No access even to the plain old knight of shrouds Is this not an oversight?! I mean, it is like saying vampire lord, but only the one on nightmare steed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inqy Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 2 hours ago, Sception said: Even more so of the glaivewraiths & grimghasts. Neither look like sufficient improvements over just more chainrasps to be worth bothering with, and certainly don't look to contend with hosts or hexes as semi-elites. Formations and allegiance rules could still save them, though, so I'm not writing them off completely just yet. Grimghasts seem like they're designed for use with the Mounted Knight of Shrouds command ability. Being able to make two attacks with the deathknell ups the damage potential considerably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianob Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 2 hours ago, Sception said: The banshees have nice offence with the -2 rend, but 20 points per wound with only a 4+ ethereal and deathless minions to protect them is awful defensively. A stiff breeze will see them off the field, with an unacceptable portion of your points going with them. That said, they are summonable, so gravesite deployment and endless legions could do the trick to get them into combat, and I'm sure nighthaunt will have alternate deployment methods as well. I'm pretty skeptical, though. Even more so of the glaivewraiths & grimghasts. Neither look like sufficient improvements over just more chainrasps to be worth bothering with, and certainly don't look to contend with hosts or hexes as semi-elites. Formations and allegiance rules could still save them, though, so I'm not writing them off completely just yet. If you think Chainrasps are good and Grimghasts are bad I’d suggesting rereading the points values and warscrolls! Grimghasts are pretty amazing at 14 points per model. They’re similar to Grave Guard in damage output when they have their reroll, but with a 4+ invuln, 8” move and fly, more board coverage due to 32mm bases and a 2” reach. They make Spirit Hosts obsolete. And they’re battleline. 90 Grimghasts, 2*12 banshees and heros to flavour would be a good army right now and that’s before we know whattche other characters and allegiance abilities add. Youre going to see a lot of Grimghast spam armies. Chainrasps, conversely, are not very good. They’re offensively weak as battleline go due to their lack of bonuses at large numbers, and they have a 1” reach so will struggle to get all of heir models in even with fly. They lose banner and the all important musician compared to skeletons. They have no better save against rend 0. They lose 4 bravery if their hero gets sniped. Their 5+ ethereal and slightly faster speed in no way makes up for this. Theyncompare similary badly to other armies’ battleline - they’re just a bit mediocre. Other than being better than Skeletons at min unit size, they don’t really have a place to fit, and in pure NH armies will be inferior to Grimghasts as BL (being taken as filler, fulfilling battalion requirements etc notwithstanding) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashtyn Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 8 hours ago, AverageBoss said: In the NH faction focus they mentioned Frightful Touch would be a key aspect of the army. This tells me one of two things. 1. Frightful Touch will be an allegiance ability for NH. All units will gain it in a NH aligned army. or 2. These warscrolls are temporary and incomplete. We wont see the full and true warscrolls until the NH battletome drops. The 1st edition starter saw changed for almost every model in the box between its release and the release of the SC and Khorne battletomes. From what I'm seeing it looks like frightful touch will have to be a trait. Even if it's a flat roll of 6 that is unmodifiable, with the extra attacks some units can generate it's got massive potential. Even without frightful touch the banshees are great hammers. A unit of 12 has plus 3 to unbind at 18 inches meaning it will very likely have 24 attacks if it moves forward or if it can pop up on the board, that can be increased to 36 by a mounted knight. You can even unbind one of your own endless spells in your turn to get an extra attack at the cost of d3 wounds. With a torment they're rerolling 1s and can get models back. They have massive potential offensively. what I really love about them is that there are so many steps to uping their attacks that it's difficult for a opponent to stop them all. Especially considering NH heroes are all minus 1 to hit and are unrendable. I also like the grimghasts for the same reasons, it's easy to give them 3 attacks with rerolls at rend 1. most NH armies are going to run at least 1 torment, and a knight of shrouds so these extra buffs aren't really unrealistic. if you then add on frightful touch as an option for a trait then these 2 units can become disgusting offensively and still rock a 4+ unrendable save. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZaelART Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 I thought the banshees had an 18” unbind range, and that only wizards can unbind an endless spell. I also think they should’ve had at least 2 wounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richelieu Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 4 hours ago, ianob said: Grimghasts are pretty amazing at 14 points per model. They’re similar to Grave Guard in damage output when they have their reroll, but with a 4+ invuln, 8” move and fly, more board coverage due to 32mm bases and a 2” reach. They make Spirit Hosts obsolete. And they’re battleline. Agree completely. I look at grimghasts and think about how hard it will be to kill enough that their counterattack won't cripple whatever I attacked them with. Chainrasps on the other hand are...A tarpit, and not much more. I feel like grimghasts are the souls of vulkite berzerkers. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urauloth Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 10 hours ago, Ahn-ket said: I assume a pre-order on 30th and come out in July first or second weekend That's what I was told today, but apply a pinch of salt to that. 7 hours ago, Honk said: Is this not an oversight?! I mean, it is like saying vampire lord, but only the one on nightmare steed... The Knight of Shrouds on foot (?) is right there in the GHB Nighthaunt points list. He's 20pts less than his horse counterpart. Unless his warscroll has changed, he's still a solid investment too, because they have different (and complimentary) command abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevar Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 2 hours ago, Richelieu said: Agree completely. I look at grimghasts and think about how hard it will be to kill enough that their counterattack won't cripple whatever I attacked them with. Chainrasps on the other hand are...A tarpit, and not much more. I feel like grimghasts are the souls of vulkite berzerkers. ? Even better if the Nighthaunts get some form of army wide frightful touch, Grimghasts with rerolls actually improve their odds to get Mortal Wounds by hitting on 4s instead of 3s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Syf Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 In a preview on warhammer community it was mentioned that night haunt would be an army of mass mortal wound output, so can only assume there is something missing. Also on a YouTube unboxing video of the starter set (mini war gaming I think) they mention the warscrolls/ points in the starter set are temporary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 I did miss both the summonable keysord and the 2" reach on the grimghasts, and now feel a bit silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dracothjay Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 guys, let’s not jump the gun here. The tome is still to drop and that’s going to be in July. Sources from my GW store confirm that. secondly, grimghast reapers are going to be nasty. Yes, they might be one wound, but they are cheap enough if you want to max out on unit size. With a 2” reach and ethereal save of 4+, these guys are going to perform at a average standard, but throw a mixture of buffs from certain heros onto them, say +1 attack and +1 to hit from both KoS variants, these guys are going to be brutal, especially rerolling failed hit rolls on the charge. The 2” reach is the key to this unit. The banshees I think are incredible. They can fit so many rolls. I can see them being fielded in at least units of 8. They look to be heavy hitters when buffed up, but that’s their risk. Ideally you want other units engaging whilst keeping your banshees safe for unbinding. Also, we haven’t seen the ethereal cavalry units yet!! I have a feeling they will be a juicy heavy hitting unit. Not to mention all the other units we haven’t seen yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevar Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 5 minutes ago, Dracothjay said: Also, we haven’t seen the ethereal cavalry units yet!! I have a feeling they will be a juicy heavy hitting unit. Not to mention all the other units we haven’t seen yet! I am pretty sure those guys are heroes of some description. The images could be misleading, but on their new website it shows them quite split up leading hexwraiths. In the leaked images they are also unit count 1 so they are some form of hero and I imagine they will be buff men somehow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 Looking at the gh17 points page for nighthaunt, the new ghosty cav things with swords are probably "dreadblade harrows', which seem to be heroes (unit size 1, leader). I suppose they could be 'bladegheist revenants', though, which are unit size 5-20. So I guess we'll see. It's also worth mentioning, if it hasn't been already, that the nighthaunt black coach costs more than twice as many points as the Legion of Nagash unit of the same name, which implies that there will be fancy new rules for the fancy new model and that LoN will be stuck with the lackluster existing version (though they can still take the new version as an allied unit). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urauloth Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 Pretty sure the bladegheists are the things that look like grimghasts but with zweihanders, unless it turns out the full grimghast warscroll has an alternative weapon option. That would allow for the horseman being the bladegheist, but we'd be none the wiser as to what the harrow was, and I expect a model that size which we've only seen two variations of is much more likely to be a hero. Given how expensive hexwraiths are, I'd be surprised at getting cavalry for bladegheist prices, too. The two similar models for the horseman are interesting though. One of them looks to me to be more complex, and I wonder if we're seeing regular and ETB iterations of the same thing. e; the only thing causing me nagging doubt about the horseman (who appears to only have half a horse, as an aside, which is cool if true) being a hero is the new art piece showing a group of at least 3 of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neck-Romantic Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 @ianob Oh wow, yes grimghasts as a cheapish horde unit is far more palatable than as a semi-elite. I hadnt seen their point cost yet. Although it does give me that sinking feeling they will be like bikers in 40k.. great stats, want them in units of 10/20... sold in boxes of 5 for $35 On a seperate note; any sighting of the Mourngul in the new GHB? Wondering how he will fit in with the new lineup. His -1 to hit aoe and self heal seems like a perfect candidate to bubblewrapped by ghasts or chainwrasps and spearheading straight into the thick of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingCommander Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 4 hours ago, Dracothjay said: secondly, grimghast reapers are going to be nasty. Yes, they might be one wound, but they are cheap enough if you want to max out on unit size .... these guys are going to be brutal, especially rerolling failed hit rolls on the charge. That's the Glaivewraith's ability. Grimgast re-roll against units of 5 or more models, which is is even better against most armies imho. ? I think they are pretty great for the reasons you mentioned and am truly looking forward to the bt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
christophe Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 5 hours ago, Urauloth said: That would allow for the horseman being the bladegheist, but we'd be none the wiser as to what the harrow was, and I expect a model that size which we've only seen two variations of is much more likely to be a hero. Given how expensive hexwraiths are, I'd be surprised at getting cavalry for bladegheist prices, too. The two similar models for the horseman are interesting though. One of them looks to me to be more complex, and I wonder if we're seeing regular and ETB iterations of the same thing. e; the only thing causing me nagging doubt about the horseman (who appears to only have half a horse, as an aside, which is cool if true) being a hero is the new art piece showing a group of at least 3 of them. they have a "shadespire" base, could they be push fit box ? or at least box of 2, maybe same price as the new ballista with detailed base ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZaelART Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 What is up with the Nighthaunt ally situation? Seems unreasonably restrictive considering they are Nagash's creations. If frightful touch becomes an allegiance ability, isn't that a massive nerf for Hexwraith's and Spirit Hosts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malakithe Posted June 17, 2018 Share Posted June 17, 2018 With all the summonable keywords going around those guys that can bring back D6 or whatever are going to play a big role Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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