Let's chat: Daughters of Khaine

[Lightbox]

Hey folks!

So I've always quite liked the daughters of khaine models and recently bought some more, initially as a conversion project to run them alongside my freeguild to go with the amazon/aztec side (my freeguild is like a mix of european and aztec,fun project and let me use my amazon models I had) buy I'm starting to think they might be better run as their own thing as I'm thinking they may need full sister dedication to make them shine (alas it means no hurricanum... But torally means i now have a good use for my executioners ot sorcereress/dreadlord on dragon)

Anyway im waffling. Basically I'm wondering 1) if I do need to fully commit to DoK to make them useable and 2) whether two bloodthrones are necessity? I'm not a tournament or competetive player I prefer a laugh but I dont enjoy being completely steamrolled either (unless i get to bite back well)

My main opponent is a guy who playes khorne mortals and has his lists at pretty good standards (by our casual standards at least)

Current collection consists of:

- 2x death hags, 1dblade and 1wbrew

-2 x unbuilt cauldron of blood (one could be made as a bloodwrack shrine)

-1x medusa (two if I go teo shrines)

-10x witch elves

-10x sisters

 

I know im gonna want more witches and some warlocks. But can anyone give some help on a good way to progress? Like some good generic first steps for what to begin adding. The fragility of the subfaction does intimidate me a little as well as the seeming lack of options for killing tougher elite guys (blood warriors will scare me with this army more than with my chaos due to getting dying attacks of the fragile witches)

 

Being a big conversion project I'd also love to use them in ptg and skirmish too if anyone has tips for what works in those.

 

Sorry for the the length do tldr: I'm super intimidated with how to get into this faction in a non competitive way that will still work well enough.

[The Traitor]

I think you should definitely build two cauldrons of blood and no shrines right now, two ward saves is the minimum for the army to work at first sight (I'm starting DoK now too). As for what to do next, I think witches are defenitely the anwser for you, only 20 infantry models is very few for this army from what I've seen in AoS... Or that's my advice from newby to newby I guess !

[Lightbox]

12 hours ago, The Traitor said:

I think you should definitely build two cauldrons of blood and no shrines right now, two ward saves is the minimum for the army to work at first sight (I'm starting DoK now too). As for what to do next, I think witches are defenitely the anwser for you, only 20 infantry models is very few for this army from what I've seen in AoS... Or that's my advice from newby to newby I guess !

Yeah that's fair. Also means I can run two snake ladies then! Great for any big skirmish games.

 

Mmm it unfortunately looks like I'll need lots of bodies. Bit of a shame for my wallet and free time  Hopefully they won't be too hard to paint. Not as many straps and belt pouches as chaos warriors and freeguild!

 

I read earlier that with warlocks it seems to be best to run them minimum size and sisters are best in units of ten just for objective duty. Does this still hold true in mostly melee focused meta's?

 

I also found my medusa died super easy in my mixed order PTG (she was a bit hit and miss with her stare). I presume It'll be best to keep them screened behind the witches or some sisters so they don't get charged and mulched? their danger seems to come from their stare as their attacks seem kinda crappy. Though can't remember off the top of my head if they'll get a ward save from the cauldrons. It's 6+ for everyone besides witches who get 5+ right?

 

Also do people find it useful to try and watch games of tournament players etc to get a feel for how the army should/could be played? If so any recommendations for good DoK ones?

[Kramer]

38 minutes ago, Lightbox said:

I also found my medusa died super easy in my mixed order PTG (she was a bit hit and miss with her stare). I presume It'll be best to keep them screened behind the witches or some sisters so they don't get charged and mulched? their danger seems to come from their stare as their attacks seem kinda crappy. Though can't remember off the top of my head if they'll get a ward save from the cauldrons. It's 6+ for everyone besides witches who get 5+ right?

Might not be most economical but... for 20pt more you get a lot more resilience... 

And correct. 

[Lightbox]

Hmm so I'm possibly going to want to look at getting a 3rd model to make into a shrine? aka 2 cauldrons of blood and 1 bloodwrack shrine.

 

Might be able to kitbash something up to work as one.

[Kramer]

19 hours ago, Lightbox said:

Hmm so I'm possibly going to want to look at getting a 3rd model to make into a shrine? aka 2 cauldrons of blood and 1 bloodwrack shrine.

 

Might be able to kitbash something up to work as one.

Do you get a lot of extra bits on the Cauldron? Because looking at it I reckon you have mirror/pool etc but you just miss the framework right?

[Twitch of Izalith]

I'm becoming a big fan of the bloodwrack Shrine option - The medusa attracts a lot of attention from Horde players and your opponent will use more resources taking out the shrine than the medusa on foot. I run one as a shrine and one on foot - shes easier to hide and faster.

You need 2 cauldrons and minimum 50 witches in a 30 and a 20. 60 is better.

My standard allies at the moment are an assassin,a sorceress and 2 x Dark Riders.

I play against  Khorne a lot and its a fun match up.

Its quite a big cash investment getting into this army at 2000 points but it really fun to play and paint.

I think most of the models are likely to be included in whatever new Dark Elf faction we eventually get too so it should be a good faction for the tuture.

 

[Lightbox]

3 hours ago, Kramer said:

Do you get a lot of extra bits on the Cauldron? Because looking at it I reckon you have mirror/pool etc but you just miss the framework right?

Not sure. Definitely will have mirrors/pool bits. issue will be as you said framework. However that can possibly be kitbashed.

 

40 minutes ago, Twitch of Izalith said:

I'm becoming a big fan of the bloodwrack Shrine option - The medusa attracts a lot of attention from Horde players and your opponent will use more resources taking out the shrine than the medusa on foot. I run one as a shrine and one on foot - shes easier to hide and faster.

You need 2 cauldrons and minimum 50 witches in a 30 and a 20. 60 is better.

My standard allies at the moment are an assassin,a sorceress and 2 x Dark Riders.

I play against  Khorne a lot and its a fun match up.

Its quite a big cash investment getting into this army at 2000 points but it really fun to play and paint.

I think most of the models are likely to be included in whatever new Dark Elf faction we eventually get too so it should be a good faction for the tuture.

 

Glad to hear it's good fun  I do have an assassin and sorceress. I assume dark riders are for objective grabbing and adding in some shooting?

 

The cost is a bit of a worry. I'm gonna take this army slow I think. That let's me make them a full conversion project. However I have seen some of the old witch elves on ebay for not too much which might make a nice option for my squad of just 20 since they'll look different. At least witches don't look too hard to paint as they don't seem overloaded with hard to reach detail and pouches

[Twitch of Izalith]

@Lightbox Yeah you will really enjoy the first 30 or so. I have to admit i'm struggling a bit with my next unit!! they are not hard but you have to be very careful with their bikini armour!

I was thinking of doing a conversion using Dark Eldar Wyches for a bit of a different look. The Box has 6 female to 4 male models in it but I think they carry the right aesthetic once you tool them up with spare witch elf weapons. Warlocks are male so I feel its ok to have some male witch elves.

Yes, I use the riders for scoring early objective points or grabbing late ones in starstrike for example. They have a bit of shooting and are really fast so I tend to keep them moving and avoid all but easy combats. They are also useful for delivering your assassin.

I forgot to mention I also generally run some sisters of slaughter in small units - the mortal wound output can be handy if they don't get shot on the way to combat!

[Lightbox]

@Twitch of Izalith I reckon wyches could probably work. I know a guy who managed to make one look like a vampire for mordheim just by painting the bodysuit like leather and getting rid of the obviously sci-fi bits.

 

My only issue is I actually kinda like the big hair look of the witches  Some male ones shouldn't matter though. I think they're like howling banshees in 40k where it doesn't explicitly say they're -all- female only mostly female.

 

[Kramer]

1 hour ago, Lightbox said:

My only issue is I actually kinda like the big hair look of the witches  Some male ones shouldn't matter though. I think they're like howling banshees in 40k where it doesn't explicitly say they're -all- female only mostly female.

Their isn't enough lore on them during age of sigmar I think (or at least I haven't run into it) but old school warhammer lore meant all female. Male members were either slaves or executioners. 

[Lightbox]

12 minutes ago, Kramer said:

Their isn't enough lore on them during age of sigmar I think (or at least I haven't run into it) but old school warhammer lore meant all female. Male members were either slaves or executioners. 

That's fair. Though i presume with the scope of the mortal realms any cults that aren't from azyr might follow different practices?

 

If i recall correctly azyr is the only place that sorta keeps alive old world traditions and stuff? But regardless certain practices do get lost to time so could probably get away with it backstory wise.

[Kramer]

23 minutes ago, Lightbox said:

That's fair. Though i presume with the scope of the mortal realms any cults that aren't from azyr might follow different practices?

 

If i recall correctly azyr is the only place that sorta keeps alive old world traditions and stuff? But regardless certain practices do get lost to time so could probably get away with it backstory wise.

Yeah of course! And let's be honest, until their is a bit more lore you can do anything... and after that still. It's an endless world, so different cultures will develop. 

[Lightbox]

9 minutes ago, Kramer said:

Yeah of course! And let's be honest, until their is a bit more lore you can do anything... and after that still. It's an endless world, so different cultures will develop. 

Speaking of lore stuff I was wanting to go a bit snake themed with my tribal DoK. What with the medusas shrine and all that i thought it could be cool if my group viewed the medusae as almost like demigods. My friend suggested perhaps they thought khaine was like a snake god.

 

Any recommendations for ways I could convety the khaine statue into looking a bit snakey. Considered making a snake statue out of skulls i have or trying to stick a cold one head on the statue. Think it'd be nice to play up that snake & skull theme I've got going a bit more.

[Kramer]

8 minutes ago, Lightbox said:

Speaking of lore stuff I was wanting to go a bit snake themed with my tribal DoK. What with the medusas shrine and all that i thought it could be cool if my group viewed the medusae as almost like demigods. My friend suggested perhaps they thought khaine was like a snake god.

 

Any recommendations for ways I could convety the khaine statue into looking a bit snakey. Considered making a snake statue out of skulls i have or trying to stick a cold one head on the statue. Think it'd be nice to play up that snake & skull theme I've got going a bit more.

That is a good theme! 
First thing that comes to mind is get the Slaanesh lord on daemonic mount and paint the mount as a statue. (then sent me the rider for my own project ) 
It would be a great replacement. 

Also maybe use the mounts of the mounted daemonettes for a unit of warlocks? (personally prefer the old daemonette models)

 

[Lightbox]

Ooh those are cool ideas @KramerI have one or two spare seeker mounts so might see if I can convert something interesting out of them like that. I'll have 2 statues to do so will probably use the slaaneshi mount for at least one!

 

Only issue is modifying the snouts to be less slaanesh and more snake. Would rather avoid them looking too chaos.

 

I would love some of the old sculpt demonettes but they're so expensive on ebay

 

Wonder what I could do with the leftover khaine statues... Maybe big objective marker scenery with part of them buried in sand.

[Twitch of Izalith]

@Lightbox if you are not bothered about having all GW models check out Raging Heroes - They have some really cool dark elf stuff. Its slightly smaller scale - more like true 30mm but its not out of place, particularly if you use scenic bases. Avatars of War also have some good stuff and Mierce Miniatures have a whole range of snake people if I remember right.

Again its not cheap (all resin models) but its not too spendy if you use them for characters.

[Lightbox]

38 minutes ago, Twitch of Izalith said:

@Lightbox if you are not bothered about having all GW models check out Raging Heroes - They have some really cool dark elf stuff. Its slightly smaller scale - more like true 30mm but its not out of place, particularly if you use scenic bases. Avatars of War also have some good stuff and Mierce Miniatures have a whole range of snake people if I remember right.

Again its not cheap (all resin models) but its not too spendy if you use them for characters.

Ooh i forgot about raging heroes! 

 

Not sure I'll need more death hags but more options is always nice. Especially for skirmish bands as for that I'll want all my girls to be little characters!

 

Thwt brings me to another question. 2 cauldrons and 2 foot hags. How mant witchbrews are recommended? Are death swords ever preferable to buffing your witches?

[The Traitor]

Haha, because I'm doing a Cult of Slaanesh themed army I'm exactly using those very models ! I had the luck of having some old metal daemonettes on steed still unassembled so I press molded them to pull my Cauldrons:

Had to retcon them a bit with greenstuff because of the low quality of the press molds, but that also differentiates them a bit. 

[Twitch of Izalith]

@Lightbox I have one cauldron with Deathsword and one withe witchbrew and the same for my hags on foot. I think witchbrew is probably more important for the army to make them immune to battleshock but the D3 damage sword is also handy. I think as long as you have a witchbrew available for each unit of witches you are probably ok to mix and match a little.

I got Raging Heroes minis for my assassin and my sorceress. I haven't built them yet but I will post some pics when I get them done.

[Dead_Ghost]

Has anyone played any games with Daughters recently?  

Have potential games against Nurgle, Goblins, Mixed Death and Khorne and Vanguard in the future. Anyone have any hints for playing against those types of armies? 
[Other than the obvious medusa for the Goblins and Skeletons!]

[Lightbox]

31 minutes ago, Dead_Ghost said:

Has anyone played any games with Daughters recently?  

Have potential games against Nurgle, Goblins, Mixed Death and Khorne and Vanguard in the future. Anyone have any hints for playing against those types of armies? 
[Other than the obvious medusa for the Goblins and Skeletons!]

As a death player i can give some general tips on playing death. They have no mortal wound protection and their shields only work if there's no rend so definitely rend any bloodknights. Don't let their cav charge as bloodknights are deadly on thr charge. ****** when charged. Zombie dragon is nasty if it's used with a vamp but expensive. You'll have no trouble with their battleline if you strike hard and fast but watch for their sustainability. Your warlocks will kite well as death have almost no range and usually are slow (watch for their cav and dire wolves though)

 

Death are good tarpits but are low on things with real bites and are hordes which daughters should be fine against. Make sure to murderize necromancers or vampire lords quick as they have good spells. Killing heroes also removes deathless minions. Mortal wounds and range are your friends.

 

Vs khorne KILL THE BLOODSECRATOR he's a massive force multiplier for them. With him they get bonus attacks and immunity to battleshock. Bloodletters are less scary as your witches don't have saves to worry about mortal wounds. Hit them before they hit you and they'll fold. Blood warriors don't have too scary a statline but they're tough and attack when they die. Wrathmongers are a pain as they also give bonus attacks but if you're in their bubble you also get those bonuses, remember thst when fighting them. Don't kill them eith strong units as they make your models attack themself. I think it's only model ans not unit though.

 

As always keep your cauldrons alive and don't let them charge!! Bloodthirsters are scary and skullcrushers are an annoying fast tarpit.

 

Be prepared for good saves on khorne mortals and lots of attacks.

 

Best of luck bud. Let us know how you do!

 

Mortal Khorne is my usual opponent so interested to see how you do vs those.

[Dead_Ghost]

 

Are we about to see some love for the Daughters on the horizon?! 

 

@Lightbox , thanks for the all that feedback! I'll try and put it to good use and update when i've had my battles!

 

[Lightbox]

Aww yiss!! That sounds like the gearing up for a great story too!

 

And happy to help @Dead_Ghost, bear in mind my games are usually rather friendly and I've mostly experience with mortal khorne as opposed to demons just in case you fight those. Demons seem to have more bite but less armour.

 

One thing I forgot with death is morghasts can be quite nasty. If they have the halberds don't let them near your cauldrons.

[Lucentia]

Haha, I knew this would happen as soon as I bought all the necessary models for my planned GT heats list.  Oh well, at least now I might actually have a battletome to mess around with, exciting stuff!