LJ26

Allies as battleline

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Not sure if anyone has said this yet but will you be able to ally in your battleline? Example, if I'm running FEC alliance can I use my zombies as ally and full fill my battleline requirements? 

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I think you can, keep in mind though I also believe quite some things have changed for Battleline. For example we know there is more Battleline but we also know Battleline is now more often linked to Alliances.

Cheers,

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This is definitely a question that requires waiting for the book. 

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I don't think so.

From the quick peek they gave us of the first reveal it looks like Allies are kinda kept separate like they were in 40k. The points allocation on the chart is after the requirements and points value for you normal army.  This suggests that you have to fulfill the requirements of your main force BEFORE/IN ADDITION TO taking an allied force.

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I wonder if this will be consistent with the limits on heroes then, as otherwise Allies would let you spam a load more on top of your usual allowance!

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21 hours ago, Killax said:

we know there is more Battleline but we also know Battleline is now more often linked to Alliances.

What do you mean by this? Where do we know this from?

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9 minutes ago, Trout said:

What do you mean by this? Where do we know this from?

They said it on stream an facebook pretty sure in articles also, that there is far more battleline if....and more battleline.

 

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Posted (edited)

38 minutes ago, Arkiham said:

They said it on stream an facebook pretty sure in articles also, that there is far more battleline if....and more battleline.

 

 

nvm, I get it. Far more "battleline if..." units.

Edited by Trout

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1 hour ago, Trout said:

What do you mean by this? Where do we know this from?

Well as mentioned, allegiance linked Battlelines :) 

E.g.

AoSGenHandbookBalance_Verminus4gds.jpg 

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2 hours ago, Arkiham said:

They said it on stream an facebook pretty sure in articles also, that there is far more battleline if....and more battleline.

 

*crosses fingers for Battleline dracoths*

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If items such as Dracoths are battleline they might as well remove the concept of battleline in the first place lol.

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9 minutes ago, Auticus said:

If items such as Dracoths are battleline they might as well remove the concept of battleline in the first place lol.

It should be removed to begin with.

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It should be removed to begin with.


Battleline only exists in Pitched Battles for Matched Play.

Just say'n.... ;)

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12 minutes ago, Auticus said:

If items such as Dracoths are battleline they might as well remove the concept of battleline in the first place lol.

Not if you have to have a Stardrake General. You can only fit 5 units into a list like that anyway.

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1 minute ago, TheOtherJosh said:

 


Battleline only exists in Pitched Battles for Matched Play.

Just say'n.... ;)

Yup. That's why I'm not more vocal about it, it doesn't affect me much. That doesn't change the fact I would rather they don't exist in Matched Play either.

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Yup. That's why I'm not more vocal about it, it doesn't affect me much. That doesn't change the fact I would rather they don't exist in Matched Play either.


With the current system being run in 40k with their Battle Forged armies and various types of standard "Formations" it may eventually come up. (As you can make those kinds of armies.)

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If battleline didn't exist in matched play to me you might as well just toss matched play out altogether then.  There's no point in trying to pretend there's balance when I can just take all of the super nasties with no restraint.

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4 minutes ago, TheOtherJosh said:

 


With the current system being run in 40k with their Battle Forged armies and various types of standard "Formations" it may eventually come up. (As you can make those kinds of armies.)

You'll have to explain more, as not all of us are familiar with 40k.

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2 minutes ago, Auticus said:

If battleline didn't exist in matched play to me you might as well just toss matched play out altogether then.  There's no point in trying to pretend there's balance when I can just take all of the super nasties with no restraint.

They get wrecked to mortal wounds, objectives requiring more models, etc etc.

All balances out

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Like I said - then remove battleline and the concept of matched play altogether then. 

If battleline is supposed to represent the common soldier that is not super jacked out, then letting things like Dracoths be battleline makes the concept of battleline ridiculous in the first place.

Just play open play at that point.

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2 hours ago, Auticus said:

Like I said - then remove battleline and the concept of matched play altogether then.

I am not saying that it would work for every unit and every faction, but I don't mind certain factions having access to 'higher-quality' battlelines. For example, we are all used by now to the BCRs having low-count, high-powered models.

If taking a full Nighthaunts army enables the player to choose Hexwraiths or Spirit Hosts as battleline units, that could be another benefit/reason to take up that specific allegiance. As a trade-off, they would not get access to the Ruler of the Night command trait that is reserved for a general Death army (if it survives in the next version of GH).

I actually like this structure which promotes more diverse armies...

my 2 cents...

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Posted (edited)

But will it really create more diverse armies?  I strongly feel it won't.  I feel it would remove the point of battleline in the first place.

It brings forth the question "why would I never ever do this?"

Edited by Auticus

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Posted (edited)

5 hours ago, Auticus said:

But will it really create more diverse armies?  I strongly feel it won't.  I feel it would remove the point of battleline in the first place.

It brings forth the question "why would I never ever do this?"

Because you wouldn't be able to get the 'free points' from the hordes rule if you went elite ?

On a slightly more serious note, or rather to expand away from a cheap joke: Elite armies like pure BCR don't often seem to do that well in a competitive setting and require additional bodies in the form of Moon Clan or Bonesplitterz to really perform. People might (ok would) take Battleline Skyfires if they existed at their current points level, but that's because they're under-costed, as has been discussed many times. I'm not sure there are all that many other examples really. Stormfiends are a candidate, possibly, Arkenauts in some capacity?

Another reason might be that you end up with a sub-par general in order to get the specific Battleline choice. While you wouldn't want Burning Chariots as battleline anyway at the moment, if you did, then you have to pick a general with no command ability in order to do so. I could see this being fairly common.

I appreciate that there will be some optimum choices and this is probably what you're worried about, given what I've picked up about your local scene, but, to reverse your question, do you really think the option of elite Battleline will mean less varied lists than we currently have? 

Edit

To maybe clarify this slightly: how many top lists do you think there are now and how many would you predict there would be?

Edited by Tzaangor Management
Hopefully clarification...

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I think my main hangup is that battleline was put in as the old "core tax" and core units are supposed to be the normal non-elite troops. 

By putting elite troops in as battleline you destroy the point of having battleline in the first place.  

If elite troops can sit as battleline just remove battleline altogether and go back to the open model.  I don't like rules that exist for the sake of existing, and battleline elites would be a rule that exists for the sake of existing to me.

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These rules already exist, albeit in less abundance than they're likely to, and each requires a sacrifice of some sort: If you want Morghast Archai as battleline, you need to have the Deathlords allegiance for example. By suffering the core tax you can ultimately take a more varied army, the elite tax (TM) leads to a a more restricted pool of units, even if their battleline choice becomes better. 

You seem to be suggesting that allowing elite as battleline will mean that people will never choose the generic troop option, thus invalidating the battleline rule. I would argue against this and say that having greater flexibility will always make the generic option attractive.

 

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